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You completely missed all the comments about why Toshiba lost, apparently.

I agree with Adam and Bryan. Toshiba didn't lose because their prices were "too low". They lost because of studio support and the PS3 factor. That said, I don't feel that BR player prices are "unfair", especially if they fall to the $200 range by Christmas. I think it's obvious that he was...

Since when does the PS3 do 5.1 analog out? I'll add, it's useless for my Pronto remote, and wouldn't integrate well into my rack.

Analog diehards tried to claim something similar when CDs came out--"Stick with vinyl! That evil digital stuff will rot away in a few years!"

But why would it matter if some stuck the failure label on something that lasted over 20 years and produced over 20,000 titles? That's a better fate than SACD and DVD-A, I believe.

Actually, I'd be content to have the HD formats achieve the level of success laserdisc had. After all, it was around for over 20 years and produced over 20,000 titles. That doesn't sound bad :)

Paul, I'm not arguing the points you're making that are rather subjective in nature. The point of comparison I was making was between SACD/DVD-A and HDDVD/BR. If the two HD formats are able to muster only 0.14 percent of the market in several years, they'll be consider failures, and it won't...

True, but I was talking about high end videophiles (those who have front projectors and other top of the line displays). I should also probably make a distinction between film buffs and those types who think all "HD" should look like the Discovery Channel.

I think the presence of VHS had something to do with it as well. DVD would have struggled to gain mass-market acceptance if the players cost three times as much as VHS machines. I think it's undeniable that BR players would cost more than they now do if it wasn't for the presence of HDDVD.

One of the things I remember after DVDs were introduced were statements from some laserdisc die-hards, boasting that laserdiscs were looking better than ever. This was an implicit acknowledgment of the effect that competitive pressure was having on laserdisc from DVD.

That's exactly why I think all the hand-wringing by some about the "need" for one format is off-base.

That's true. I've seen commercials that say "Movie X now out on DVD and HDDVD (or Blu-ray)". I never saw similar commercials for those audio formats.

I never did buy the notion that SACD and DVD-A failed (yes, they are both failures) because of their format war. The fact is that very few people thought they were a significant improvement over Redbook CD (there was argument about this even in the audio high-end newsgroup). No such disagreement...

Why should it bother me that others disagree with me?

It may bother you that others disagree with your observations, David, but I'll continue to feel free to point it out.

? It would seem that Bill Hunt is willing to sacrifice ALL HD media to: a. His hatred of the format war. b. His hatred of the continued existence of HDDVD. Or both.

You cite "many" personnel, but only one person who you claim is objective, while ignoring the idea that many people are on Sony/BR's "bill".

Is it it your claim that the only two possibilities for someone are a. Being on Microsoft's "bill" and/or "allied with HDVD" b. Being "knowledgable" and "objective" (mutually exclusive with a) NO other possibility exists in your mind?

It fascinates me how you equate "has been debated before" with "is a settled question with respect to real-world superiority".

Does "most of the industry" really want no one to buy either format?

The logical conclusion of your two premises is that both Bill "and most of the industry" advocate nonsense.

It DOES matter if you care about cost. What manufacturer likes to add an unnecessary cost of production?

Is this a claim that the Samsung BD-UP5000 does not exist and will not be sold?

It sounds like you have more of a problem with combos and packaging than the coating per se, Paul. But ok, I'll amend my statement to say I've seen no significant numbers of posts (one is not significant) complaining about the absence of the hard coating on HDDVDs from people making a choice (as...

Your opinion that HDDVD should raise its costs so it can be more like BR isn't enough, David. Any engineer will tell you that you don't add extra-cost elements to something that are not needed (as you acknowledge), especially in an environment where manufacturing costs are very important. I've...

If that's true, then the article really does say nothing new at all. It's just more "it's true because we keep saying it" stuff.

Isn't Businessweek one of those publications that has proclaimed BR the winner all along? There's no real new information in the article, with the possible exception of a rumored sub $300 BR player (I wonder what features that would have).

I don't think anyone takes him seriously about anything. :D

Is it because of production and R&D costs, or is it because the studios don't want to undercut the DVD cash cow? I wonder...

I don't think the market has to be divided into ONLY two segments (ultra cheap and ultra high end), David. I think there's room for more tiers. By the way, I feel I should reiterate that my critical comments about BR come from the perspective of someone who was a SUPPORTER of the format based...