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My new SACD manifesto


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33 replies to this topic

#1 of 34 Mike Broadman

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Posted March 17 2004 - 06:50 AM

When I first got into SACD, the selection was limited, so I was snatching up everything I could get my hands on. With the excellent (and sometimes expensive) catalogue of boutique labels these days I'm adapting the following guidelines to start paring down the collection and limiting my list of things I want to get:

I will only buy or keep (that's right, I'm selling off SACDs that don't fit this manifesto) SACDs that are hybrids or offer an excellent surround mix. Single layer stereo is out. I need to be able to take my music on the go and this buying of the same album twice thing is ridiculous. Of course, there are exceptions. If the sound is a major improvement over the CD and it's an album I really, really love, I'll keep it or get it. Some of these are:

John Coltrane- A Love Supreme
(this one being single-layer doesn't bother me at all, because I have the deluxe 2-CD edition anyway)
Charles Mingus- Ah Um
Miles Davis- Miles Smiles
Miles Davis- Sketches of Spain
(not a favorite per say, but the music is just perfect mood music to envelope the room in, enhanced all the more by the SACD sound)
Miles Davis- Milestones
Joe Satriani- Engines of Creation
Classical, since I almost exclusively listen to that at home

Things I'm selling off:
All the Peter Gabriel and Police SACDs. Maybe I'll get the greatest hits Police SACD because I think it's hybrid multi-channel.
Alice in Chains greatest hits and Herbie Hancock's Headhunters- don't like the surround mixes

#2 of 34 Michael St. Clair

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Posted March 17 2004 - 06:52 AM

Mike,

I'm on the same page as you. I've never bought a stereo-only single-layer disc, and I'm not about to start.

#3 of 34 Paul.S

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Posted March 17 2004 - 12:09 PM

Mike:

YGM.

-p

#4 of 34 Paul.S

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Posted March 17 2004 - 12:37 PM

Mike:

Not sure if my mail went through: it bounced when I sent it via my own e-mail app. Tried again via HTF site. If you don't have mail from me, please either e-mail me, or lemme know if you check PMs or not and I'll send one if so.

-p

#5 of 34 Rachael B

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Posted March 17 2004 - 12:46 PM

I've resolved not to buy any more ancient albums that I've outgrown. I want fresh...
Rachael, the big disc cat is in real life Dot Mongur, Champion of the International Pacman Federation. You better be ready to rumble if you play Jr. Pacman with me. This is full contact Pacman and I don't just play the game, I operate it!


#6 of 34 Lee Scoggins

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Posted March 17 2004 - 12:47 PM

Quote:
All the Peter Gabriel and Police SACDs.


I guess this is why I will not be selling some of my single layers...there's just too much good music.

Fortunately most of the recent SACDs are hybrid. Posted Image
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#7 of 34 Michael St. Clair

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Posted March 17 2004 - 01:11 PM

Quote:
I guess this is why I will not be selling some of my single layers...there's just too much good music.


Too much good music that is barely better sounding than the last Redbook remasters, but with none of the utility.

We deserve hybrids, every time.

#8 of 34 Seth--L

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Posted March 17 2004 - 02:09 PM

I will only buy or keep (that's right, I'm selling off SACDs that don't fit this manifesto) SACDs that are hybrids or offer an excellent surround mix. Single layer stereo is out.


So much for buying music for the music.
Well - There it is.
My Music Collection

#9 of 34 TheLongshot

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Posted March 17 2004 - 02:36 PM

Well, I only buy hybrids, because I don't often get the opportunity to listen to my system at home. More often than not, I'm at work or in my car.

I am tempted by the Joe Satriani SACDs, tho. I've heard they are pretty good...

Jason

#10 of 34 Michael St. Clair

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Posted March 17 2004 - 02:42 PM

Quote:
So much for buying music for the music.


I buy for the music, I just can't rationalize buying two copies of each album to get normal and high-res stereo.

#11 of 34 Mark C.

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Posted March 17 2004 - 04:32 PM

I said the same thing from the start of hi-rez. I'm not going to repurchase my CD collection. My wife and I will add hybrids as we shop for music, but neither one of us wants to buy the same albums over and over again. Therefore, we are being very selective about which SACDs we purchase.

#12 of 34 KeithH

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Posted March 17 2004 - 11:02 PM

For those of you who are against single-layer stereo SACDs because you don't want to have two copies of the same album, consider this. Assuming you already have the CD, buy the SACD, burn the CD to a CD-R, and sell the CD. Why have just the CD?
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#13 of 34 Lee Scoggins

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Posted March 17 2004 - 11:52 PM

Quote:
Too much good music that is barely better sounding than the last Redbook remasters


On my system, I have tried several tests comparing the latest remasters and the Super Audio blows them away and it is not even close. Take for instance Steely Dan Gaucho, I had the Japanese miniLP from Red Trumpet which sounds awesome. I then got the SACD and it just eats it.

I think Seth is right, I buy music for the music and if I have to buy another disc to get better sound and get closer to the master tape, then I'm happy to whip out the wallet, particularly if its a major album I enjoy over and over.

After all, how many of us have bought a special edition DVD because it has a better transfer? Posted Image

Quote:
For those of you who are against single-layer stereo SACDs because you don't want to have two copies of the same album, consider this. Assuming you already have the CD, buy the SACD, burn the CD to a CD-R, and sell the CD. Why have just the CD?


That's a great idea Keith...you get the best of both worlds and still get hirez. Posted Image
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#14 of 34 Mark C.

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Posted March 18 2004 - 12:59 AM

Lee:

To me SACD just isn't all that great. I'll buy hybrids because I'm buying new music and I have a Sony ES SACD changer. But on my two-channel system many redbook CDs sound equal to SACD. Now surround is something else. It's great, but who has time to sit in a limited sweet spot to get the surround effect?

#15 of 34 Lee Scoggins

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Posted March 18 2004 - 01:59 AM

Quote:
But on my two-channel system many redbook CDs sound equal to SACD.


Something must be wrong with your system or setup. You should be able to hear a big difference in midrange detail and liquidity even on a modest system.

What components are you using?

You may be able to greatly improve your sonics by cleaning your contacts, adding power line conditioning, upgrading cables, etc.
Viewing: Sony KDSXBR150, Sony Bluray S570, ATT Uverse
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#16 of 34 Don Lindbergh

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Posted March 18 2004 - 02:11 AM

Speaking of Miles Davis 'Milestones' on SACD, I can't seem to find it listed at any of the usual online places. Is this sacd out of print or an import?

#17 of 34 Justin Lane

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Posted March 18 2004 - 02:58 AM

I am not against buying single layer discs, but when I do I usually try to make sure there is a multichannel mix of some sort. Oc course if the discs are from a favorite artist such as Peter Gabriel, I will gladly buy the single layer stereo only titles.

My Hi-res titles, hybrid or not usually dont leave the house, as the car is not a;ways the most forgiving environment.

J

#18 of 34 Mike Broadman

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Posted March 18 2004 - 03:07 AM

Quote:
So much for buying music for the music.


No, Seth, I'm keeping the CDs of this music. I want to avoid multiple copies of the same album as much as possible. Buying single layer SACDs of an album you already have on CD is not "buying music for the music," it's doing the complete opposite.

Keith, I don't know about you or your neck of the woods, but I have been having a tough time selling CDs. The used market has just dropped to shit within the last year. I get about $1-2 for each CD. So it still would be a expensive to buy two copies of the same album.

Lee, sometimes the SACD really isn't that much better than the CD. Sometimes it is. With the Police, it is my opinion that Synchoronicity benefits the most from high-res, but the difference between the remastered CDs and the SACDs of the first 3 albums is almost negligible. Same is true with Peter Gabriel, with the improvement felt most in his later, more polished albums.

But I find little use for stereo high-res in rock in general, with some exceptions. It's jazz and classical where it really kicks in, because there is room for the instruments to breathe and the higher fidelity really comes into play there.

#19 of 34 Mike Broadman

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Posted March 18 2004 - 03:14 AM

Paul, I never got an e-mail, I don't know why.

You can PM me.

#20 of 34 chung_sotheby

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Posted March 18 2004 - 03:26 AM

The way I see it, I only buy SACDs (and LP's, for that matter) for the sound quality. I am paying a premium for the highest level of sound quality, and I justify the premium through the quality of the music on the medium. If the music is not of the highest quality, then the sound need not be in the highest quality, either. While MC in also nice to have on a disc, it is NOT a deal breaker, as I have found that I tend to like the 2ch mixes better than the MC mixes of SACD recordings. Hybrids are nice, but they are not really necessary, as if I am going to need a redbook CD copy, I will either feed the analog signal into my computer soundcard and make a lossless WMA or WAV file from the disc, or I will go to a used CD store and buy a cheap copy, or I will borrow a friend's version and burn a copy (which is not copyright infringment since I already own a copy of the disc). If you have a computer with a line-in jack, then you don't need to buy an album twice just so you have the option of litening to it in your car, at work, or at home. Even when you are listening to the album in a car, at work, or while working out, etc., you will probably not need the HIGHEST sound fidelity, so ripping a high bitrate MP3 or lossless WMA of the album from the analog outs of your SACD player should not be that much of a problem. Either way, I see all hi-res formats (including LP's) to be on the premium side of music, while CD's and MP3's are not.


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