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So I was thinking about Star Wars on DVD...


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#1 of 561 David Rogers

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Posted January 23 2003 - 02:13 AM

... and it finally occurred to me why Lucas won't release them on DVD. For a while I couldn't figure it out. After all, Lucas has shown extreme willingness to charge for multiple revisions of the movies. He clearly has no problems taking multiple fees from consumers for the same basic content, just in different packaging every few years.

One would think he'd jump at the chance to issue movie-only discs of Episodes 4-6 and charge us US$20 a disc, then go back with SE discs and charge us US$29 a disc. Then a few years later show up with SE discs that have 1% extra new content, and we buy those too ...

Lucas has stated his intention to go back to Episodes 4-6 and revise them further. I've heard he's shot new footage, and likely that plus new effects and such will be applied to the movies. Rumors are voices and images will be replaced throughout the OT to match them up with Episodes 1-3.

DVD has definitely killed VHS, which is going away. Odds are seeing a VHS tape and player, intact and functioning, over the next five to ten years will become quite rare. LD should last very well, but is already a rarity.

Bringing me to my conclusion. By not issuing OT DVDs, Lucas will be able to let the OT as it was theatrically shown fade from collective memory. If the only DVD copies are his 2005 revised editions, then that's what'll get watched by most and the most often. It'll be what the kids all see as the grow into Star Wars. It'll become Star Wars.

Good, bad? Not saying either way, but that's what I think about why we can't get Star Wars DVDs.

Discuss?
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#2 of 561 AndrewA

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Posted January 23 2003 - 02:28 AM

As longs as Jar-Jar is not in the OT...and, darn it all, HAN SHOT FIRST Posted Image

#3 of 561 Daniel Becker

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Posted January 23 2003 - 02:33 AM

I've wondered the same thing myself. Lucas certainly has shown his greedy side over the years and he could easily get a great mastering done to the orginal films and release them each with barebones extras and make millions.


Then, sometime in 2006 release them all with the full treatment and all. It seems odd given his track record that he would take such a stance on the DVD releases.


Doesn't it just piss you off though that Lucas suddenly developed a "concience" and now decides he can't release the movies on DVD yet?!? He had no problems selling people multiple versions of the VHS tapes but now when it comes to DVD he's like "Oh no, I can't release them without a proper treatment and extras!". I find that hilarious and you can't help but notice his sudden change of heart on the issue. It's just too bad he decided to develop his "concience" just when DVD was getting big.


When the fans can finally see his movies the way they were meant to be seen at home with anamorphic widescreen and digital surround sound he decides to wait several years to do so! Everytime I think of that it infuritates me even more! Posted Image


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#4 of 561 Jesse Blacklow

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Posted January 23 2003 - 03:40 AM

Actually, judging by his stance on DVDs, I think he's opposed to multiple versions all strung out over time. He'll be consistent with the Episode I & II releases, so as not to confuse poor J6P.

He's probably going to spend the next 2-3 years on Episode III, then work for a year or so on updating footage (blech) for the OT, and then release the OT, both individually and as box sets, in 2-disc Fullscreen and Widescreen versions. Just like his other DVDs.

There will be no original versions, no 1st SE, and no "bare-bones" sets. That's where he'll make his money, since there won't be any other choices, and no previous versions.

Remember, Lucas has a very poor track record with listening to fans. We should just hope that they'll be anamorphic, DD-EX or equivalent, and decent extras. Makes me glad I got a Laserdisc player and the Definitive Collection, 'cause we aren't going to see anything like that ever again. I'd suggest anyone bitching about it now to do the same.
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#5 of 561 Glenn Overholt

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Posted January 23 2003 - 04:07 AM

Stuid just the same. Ok, he is busy now and has been since his work started on Ep. 1, and if his plans are to 'redo' 4-6 for anything is release, I can see where the wait is sort of justified, but...

If anyone thinks that there won't be a serious scream when the OT isn't released, well, I think it's time to crawl out of your shell.

The people that saw it when it was first released are all grown up now, and some of them are in positions of power.
No, not regarding Lucas, but for other companies and such. TV managers, stars and business people. I could see them in active boycotts and protests. What if stores wouldn't carry his products? No DVD's or toys?

Can you see a kid bringing them back to a store and saying, "I want a refund. My dad said this is crap."

What is sad is that if Lucas doesn't budge, someone, somewhere, in a country far away is going to get a copy of that laserdisk and transfer it over. But I'll stop here, and we all know why.

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#6 of 561 Jesse Blacklow

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Posted January 23 2003 - 04:54 AM

Ha! When was the last time anyone in a "position of power," especially business, was more worried about a movie than making money? Even if the owners of corporations like Best Buy and Walmart were rabid fans of Star Wars, one promise of megabucks to come and they'd fold like origami. This is America, where the almighty dollar is more important than ethics.

Boycotts? Protests? The only people that are going to do that are precisely the people Lucas never pays attention to: the fans. Nobody but us is going to care about how long it is until they come out. And no one in a foreign county is going to be able to make more than a couple thou on a LD rip before Lucasfilms sues them into a deep dark hole. Lucas hasn't been about making movies for fun and not for profit since he saw what Star Wars did in 1977. That should be blatantly obvious to anyone who had to sit through Episode I, or any of the damn Ewok TV movies.
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#7 of 561 Grant H

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Posted January 23 2003 - 05:11 AM

Well, to be fair, after watching the Definitive edition on my new HDTV, and having seen the SE's not too long ago on a regular TV, there are a lot of things in both the original and SE's that would simply look pretty crappy on an excellent DVD transfer right now.

I think maybe George doesn't want to be embarassed by anyting effects-wise. AFterall, all he needs is to be bitched out by even more people. The prequels aren't flawless either of course since both trilogies deal with new technologies for the time. I figure he'll tweak all 6 before we see an Ultimate Edition of the entire saga.
There's a lot of stuff (think the Dooku/old Ken-doll digital double in AOTC) that needs to be re-done and the technology should be better by the time he's done with Episode III.
All the film-prints I saw of Episode II seemed too dark. I have to wonder if they were deliberately printed too dark to hide some of the not-so-perfect digital work. They probably had time to improve some of the stuff for the Digital version and the DVD release, but some is still not so hot.

But, I still love Star Wars. :b
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#8 of 561 Daniel Becker

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Posted January 23 2003 - 05:28 AM

Speaking of funny looking digital doubles. Check out Darth Maul in Episode 1 when he does the high speed dismount from his speeder on Tatooine. In the shot where he's closing in on Anakin and he jumps off to attack Qui-gon you can totally tell it's a digital double jumping and making the first move forward towards Qui-gon. If you watch it with that in mind you'll immediately see what i'm talking about. Posted Image



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#9 of 561 David Rogers

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Posted January 23 2003 - 06:04 AM

No thread hijacking please. Stay on thread topic.

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#10 of 561 Ray H

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Posted January 23 2003 - 06:32 AM

Quote:
If you watch it with that in mind you'll immediately see what i'm talking about.
Thanks for ruining the magic!Posted Image
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#11 of 561 Grant H

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Posted January 23 2003 - 07:04 AM

Not sure where the hijacking was. Just saw an example that may have supported my ideas on the matter. Especially when you consider we don't even have a good Episode I transfer yet.
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#12 of 561 Patrick McCart

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Posted January 23 2003 - 07:15 AM

It's all a plot, isn't it? Posted Image


Actually, the reason why they're not on DVD is because they're going to have to be the greatest DVDs ever released. Think of it.... the LOTR films will get 4-disc SEs, so why not 3 4-disc SEs for the Star Wars films?

What will probably happen is that you get 1 disc of the definative edition cut, 1 disc of the original version, then 2 discs of extras.

That being said...that'll take a lot of work considering it took nearly 3 years to compile stuff for the first two prequel movies.

#13 of 561 Tony Whalen

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Posted January 23 2003 - 07:38 AM

You know, I just can't fathom why Lucas won't release these now, and re-release them when he's done the "Ultimate Edition" or whatever the next version will be called.

I *do* think that the idea of the films looking like crap on DVD is possible, and some work needs to be done to restore/replace some of the sorta-cheesy looking FX.

Gotta comment on this:

Quote:
Odds are seeing a VHS tape and player, intact and functioning, over the next five to ten years will become quite rare.


I highly doubt it. People will cling to 'em until recordable DVD is mainstream and affordable. And even then people will keep 'em. Hell, I'm almost frightened to admit it.. but I still have a fully functional/intact SuperBeta machine!! :b Of course, it's stored away in a box since the last move... but it's there! Posted Image

#14 of 561 DarrylWHarrisJr

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Posted January 23 2003 - 07:43 AM

I say everyone get together and not buy the damn thing unless the original OT is released. The dollar is a powerful weapon (people are still bought and sold with it)

#15 of 561 Adam Lenhardt

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Posted January 23 2003 - 10:14 AM

Quote:
DVD has definitely killed VHS, which is going away. Odds are seeing a VHS tape and player, intact and functioning, over the next five to ten years will become quite rare. LD should last very well, but is already a rarity.
Unless another mainstream video recording format comes along in the next 5 to 10 years (I'm not considering PVRs to be mainstream here), I think that VCRs will remain a fixture in households for the foreseeable future.

#16 of 561 JarrodK

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Posted January 23 2003 - 11:45 AM

Quote:
... some work needs to be done to restore/replace some of the sorta-cheesy looking FX.


This is exactly the sort of thinking that got us into this whole "Special Edition" mess with Star Wars. The cheesy FX are part of the charm of the original trilogy, and should not be changed.

I don't care if Lucas wants to put out a totally ruined revision, as long as the originals are available as an option. Too bad it will probably never happen.

#17 of 561 John Alderson

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Posted January 23 2003 - 11:57 AM

Not that I'm predicting anything, but I would not be shocked to see episodes 4-6 come out, either at once or separately, some time in late 2004 or early 2005 in order to hype episode III.

This strategy is exactly what he and Spielburg want to do for Indy 4. *shrug* And besides, there is some mighty fine anamorphic OT footage among the E2 special features Posted Image

Let's face it, all of these declarations, decrees and promises from Lucas that everyone is talking about are based on some nebulous comments he made years ago, when DVD was an enthusiasts-only domain.

Also, for those of you that "heard" the OT is going to be radically redone, think again. Rick McCallum pretty much laughed at the notion of Padme being in ROTJ, for instance. (See here for the quote.)

These OT super-duper special editions are also little more than rumors, IMHO. If anything, I don't think anything more major than what was done to E2 will happen. Also, they have NOT ruled out the possibility of the originals showing up on DVD, the last quote I saw on the subject (again from Rick McCallum) left the possibility open.

#18 of 561 RobertR

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Posted January 23 2003 - 12:14 PM

Quote:
I think maybe George doesn't want to be embarassed by anyting effects-wise.


This kind of thinking is ridiculous. The FX are what they are. Do you see Robert Wise wanting to redo The Day the Earth Stood Still? Do you see Warner doing CGI flying monkeys in The Wizard of Oz, or CGI FX in 2001? HELL no. The ORIGINAL films are what people want.

Quote:
all he needs is to be bitched out by even more people.


Bitched out by who? For what? Releasing restored (as opposed to CGI messed with) versions of the original films? Ridiculous. The opposite is true. He's going to get "bitched out" for not leaving the hell enough alone.

#19 of 561 Vic_T

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Posted January 23 2003 - 02:26 PM

If he's going to do anything to Ep 4-6 for the DVD release, he should re-master/re-record the damn score! When I saw the re-releases in the theater (the only time I've seen them, I might add), they punched up the FX sounds but had this hideous old thin score behind it. So there were huge booms and crashes and then a small 6" tall orchestra starts playing the Emperial Attack theme. What a disappointment.

Plot wise, I don't think he should bother doing anything with them. There's more holes in the plot than a pound of Swiss cheese. It can't be fixed. They're popcorn movies, they don't need more footage!
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#20 of 561 Luis S

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Posted January 23 2003 - 03:41 PM

John you've made some excellent points,particularly regarding how "special" the OT will be when released. Ive said it many times,and Id bet money on it,they will not live up to the wait! They will have nothing more spectacular than what we've seen in the prequel dvds.They have been wonderful releases dont get me wrong,but I would never wait 6 years for them! Its this kind of stuff that frustrates the hell out me when it comes to SW and Indy.The excuse is always that it will be a better product,or no time to do them justice, I can understand being about money.Hey thats how the world works,I just cant stand lame excuses.I just want an honest answer and some dvds! Posted Image

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