The Dark Knight sequel discussion thread (casting, villians, etc) (1 Viewer)

[Tyler Gagnon]

I thought i read somewere, (on this forum i think) That nolan thinks the Penguin is not interesting enough for him. If depp, or who ever gets the riddler role, PLEASE! no suit with the BIG ?????? all over it.

 

[TerryRL]

From what I understand, Nolan isn't all that interested in using Catwoman in the next movie. Talia al Ghul being the love interest is the rumor I keep hearing in terms of the third film's femme fatale. While I would love to see what Nolan would do with Catwoman, I think Talia fits more with what he's currently doing with the franchise. But that's just me.

 

[Brent M]

Yes, while I've heard Nolan doesn't care for The Penguin character he's also said he would be interested in working with Phillip Seymour Hoffman. So, who knows what will happen?

 

[Robert Crawford]

My concern is that character isn't well known to the general public.

 

[Edwin-S]

I don't know why Catwoman wouldn't work with this incarnation of the franchise. He could make the character's Catwoman persona much darker and nastier, while playing up the sexiness of the alter ego and using that to create some tension with Batman's Bruce Wayne persona. If it was handled right I think Catwoman would be an ideal character for a third film. I certainly think she would be a more interesting character to work with than either The Penguin or The Riddler.

I've never heard of Talia Al Ghul, so I can not comment on how appropriate a character she'd be to build a third movie around. I would have liked to see Harley Quinn used but that isn't possible since there was no set up for her character in the second movie. I wish they would have done some set up for a Harley Quinn appearance, rather than the cameo appearance of The Scarecrow. On the other hand, maybe she would have just seemed like The Joker Lite after Ledger's performance.

 

[TerryRL]

The female lead in the next film will very much be an "anti-hero" (ala Catwoman or Talia). She won't be the main villain. It'll be either Penguin or Riddler. If its Catwoman, I would think that Nolan and co. would want to avoid pairing her with Penguin because it was done before in "Batman Returns". Catwoman and Riddler or Penguin and Talia.

At this point its all speculation.

 

[EricW]

if they use the Riddler i hope they don't make it too similar to Joker --> eccentric maniacal lone figure who's outsmarting Batman - although i guess you could say that describes most arch-villians.

btw, i didn't catch this in Batman Begins, but was Liam Neeson actually Ras Al Ghul, and was using Ken Watanabe as a dummy, or was it like the Dread Pirate Roberts where they just always kept switching?

 

[Edwin-S]

If the above is their intended path then I hope its Catwoman and The Riddler. I just don't think The Penguin would work well in this version of the Batman Universe. He hardly worked that well in Burton's version which is a lot more cartoony than Nolan's take.

 

[TerryRL]

Eric, Neeson's Ducard character was actually Ra's.

 

[Pete-D]

I like The Riddler + Talia.

I dunno I think Catwoman basically requires a costume ala Batman and that swings the Nolan universe too much into the "costumed freak show" thing.

I like Johnny Depp or Guy Pearce as Edward Nigma (The Riddler) and Bollywood actress Katrina Kaif as Talia. This way Talia doesn't need to be as known of a character, after all most casual fans weren't that familar with Rhas Al Ghul or even Scarecrow.

Maybe it's for the best that the third Batman film put the focus a little bit more back on Bruce Wayne/Batman anyway.

I think Bane could actually work in the Nolan universe quite well too, but unfortunately I think people think too much of the terrible Schumacher version.

 

[TerryRL]

There was a rumor a while ago that Nolan was interested in having Rachel Weisz play the role of Talia should he go that route. Whatever the case may be, I completely trust that Nolan will find the best actress for either role of Catwoman or Talia or whomever the love interest in the next movie will be.

Hell, Nolan could surprise us all and not use either for the third movie, opting for one of Batman's many other love interests. Vicky Vale, Silver St. Cloud, Julie Madison, Kathy Kane, Vesper Fairchild, or someone made just for the movie (ala Rachel Dawes). There are many avenues Nolan can take.

 

[Pete-D]

No complaints with Rachel Weisz as Talia here.

 

[Zack Gibbs]

I don't think Talia will appear, it conflicts with what we already know, and the character isn't great alone. She hasn't anything special about her really other than she's Ra's daughter, and he's dead. There's also a sequel trend there; too many think they're clever by going back and aping material from their original, Nolan's too smart for that.

I think, even with several villains already translated, people can't seem to look past the comic origins of the characters.

Take Catwoman; everyone automatically thinks of the bad girl sex kitten, but that wouldn't work here. To translate it you take the basics of the character and figure out how to make it real. Catwoman is a cat-burglar who essentially develops a romantic interest with Batman. She's a thief, but we know there's good in her as well.

This Batman isn't going to catch her thieving on a roof and start flirting, he'd just beat the shit out of her. And if she's prancing around in ears and a corset, "meowing" with heaving cleavage, what's there for Bruce Wayne to develop an actual emotional attraction too, given what we know of his tastes?

She'd be very professional, extremely well disciplined, someone with a bad-girl streak in her, but it doesn't define her. If you want to cast Catwoman you don't look at comic inspired choices like Jolie, you look at people like Natalie Portman, Anne Hathaway, Scarlett Johansson, etc. Girls who can play intelligent, who can be sexy, but it doesn't have to be the first thing you think of when you look at them.

For the Riddler, watch Die Hard With a Vengeance. Jeremy Irons is essentially The Riddler. (I'm not saying cast Jeremy Irons, I'm saying the way his character is handled would be a good beginning for a Nolan Riddler). Incidentally, DHWAV is a great example of a sequel that just HAS to reference it's original.

 

[Mark Hawley]

I've got a great idea. Since the Joker is the most interesting villian in the Batman canon and that his fate in Dark Knight was left open-ended, why not just have the Joker return in the next movie have Johnny Depp play him. Then in the next movie, have Jude Law play him, then Colin Farrell.

Actually I'm not entirely kidding. The Joker is certainly the most famous and interesting villian and I'm sure has been the subject of more than one classic Batman comic and/or graphic novel, so you could bring him back movie after movie and still keep it fresh, as many of the comic books did. Added to that, since he wears makeup, you can have a different actor play him and the lack of continuity wouldn't be too jarring. I'm not trying to disrespect Ledger's performance by saying he would be easily replaced, but I can certainly see a capable actor (as the three actors above are) taking over the reigns.

 

[Qui-Gon John]

I think Claudia Black would make a good Catwoman.

 

[DavidPla]

Would anyone want to see The Mad Hatter done on the big screen? He's one of the few big time "realistic" villains of Batman that hasn't been done yet. Not in a Joker size role but more a Scarecrow size role. I heard mention in Nolan's universe, he could be a pedophile with an obsession with little girls that remind him of Alice by controlling their minds. Could be a neat subplot for Batman to tackle and I would just love to see the character make it to the big screen.

 

[Patrick H.]

Zack is right...I think people are getting hung up on the comic-book versions of these characters. Based on the last two movies, I feel like Nolan and crew could take ANY Batman villian and re-engineer them into something believable, yet recognizable. Hell, they started right off with Ra's Al Ghul, one of Batman's more overtly supernatural foes in print, and made HIM semi-plausible.

I also believe that these guys are definitely thinking one movie ahead, and that the groundwork for whoever we're going to see next is already right in front of us somewhere. Batman's new suit "should do well against cats," and there are already copycat Batmen running around. My theory is that this will all somehow play into Catwoman's angle...she could be another vigilante who goes with the cat persona to distinguish herself. But maybe she doesn't have the resources of Bruce Wayne, so in order to support herself, she steals as well. Or maybe she has fewer qualms about killing people. Either way, she'd come into conflict with Batman pretty quickly. Look at the way Frank Miller did her origin in 'Year One'...that would work in these movies.

Riddler would also work, but he's tougher since the Joker sort of co-opted some of his knack for large-scale intricate plots and mind games. They'd have to do something different with him, but they could pull it off. Perhaps make him TRULY "enigmatic", to the point where he's like Kevin Spacey in 'Seven', and you don't even SEE him until late in the story. Given the Nolans' love of air-tight, labrynthine plotting, though, I have full faith they would come up with something great for him to do.

Penguin could be interesting if they played him more like they did in the latter phase of the animated series...as a low-level, high-class gang boss who owns a nightclub and knows lots of dirty secrets. He'd be willing to pass Batman some info if it didn't hurt his interests, but could also sell him out at the first sign of trouble. Since Batman's clearly going to be on the other side of the law at the start of the next movie, though, a contact like the Penguin could be useful. He'd be a great small-but-colorful side character.

As for casting, Johnny Depp would be great in whatever part you cast him in. The guy's an actor first, takes risks, and is a movie star just because he's damn good. I'd certainly be pleased to hear he was cast in any role in the next movie. Angelina Jolie, though...no way. That'd just be a total stunt. If they do go with Catwoman, I have a feeling it'll be somebody recognizable, but totally unexpected.

 

[todd stone]

please no catwoman......

 

[Paul_Scott]

Something I wouldn't mind seeing is the next film structured as an old school whodunnit, similar to what Patrick suggested. Not that it should take place in one location (like a train, a mansion, a cruise ship, etc) but just that the true identity of the villan should be left to the very end of the movie . There would be several major supporting characters thru the film- all of them suspects at one point or another, but it takes Batman to finally ferret him (or her) out and expose them-doing so in front of all the other suspects and Gordon. With a structure like that, the Riddler would be a perfect fit. It's also something we haven't seen before (in a live-action Batman movie anyway), and because the villans identity is a mystery to the audience until the very end, there is no room for the character to be the typical green leotard, prancing jackass we've already seen. The genius of the character would be in the way he orchestrates events and the bigger picture that ultimately develops out of random and incongruous associations. Although it sounds a bit similar to what we've just had, he would be different from The Joker due to motivation (profit + ego) and the covert nature by which he operates.
A lot of people have suggested a Zodiac/Seven style scenario, and while I can see that as a fit, it's really a bit banal at this point having been done well several times already in the last 10-15 years. Die Hard WAV is of course a strong fit too- but having the character 'out there' twirling his mustache on camera while Bats is put thru his paces is again fairly conventional. I think Nolan is more daring than that.
As far as Depp, I think he's overexposed but what could be cool is if he was cast and then used ultimately as a red herring in a whodunnit structured plot. I know I'd get a big laugh out of that and he probably would too.

 

[todd s]

I honestly think the only way to top TDK. Is to have Superman appear in the next movie. A "World's Finest" movie is the only way to have the buzz that this movie had. And potentially top it. And for those who say it can't happen because Nolan's Batman is set in the "real world". I say bulls@#t! A great script and good acting and directing. I can be made right.

Batman and Superman have never appeared together in live action. And would be huge if a movie does it.

For a good story. Watch the animated "World's Finest" movie. Just for the scenes about how Supes & Bats find out each others identity.

Actually...Here is a Youtube video of the scenes. Its the last 3 minutes of the footage.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMAV4...eature=related