CLEOPATRA Region Free BRD (1 Viewer)

[trajan]

They never fixed the Entr'acte on the dvd . It was the exit music that was fixed.

 

[Andrew Budgell]

Having already seen the piece on the Fox Movie Channel, I'm in no hurry to view it again on disc, especially since they're unlikely to have looped over each of the many, many times that Fox honcho/host Tom Rothman mispronounces the name of CLEOPATRA's producer, Walter Wanger as "WANGH-er," instead of the correct WAYN-djer. Either nobody knew, or everyone was afraid to correct him.

Oh god, I know. That was so incredibly annoying.

 

[Douglas R]

The documentary “The Film Which Changed Hollywood” which is on the Blu-ray and was also on the DVD states that the UK premiere was held at the Dominion in London in autumn 1963 and that the cut version was shown.
I don’t think that’s correct. For one thing the film opened at the Dominion in the middle of summer in July 1963, not autumn, and I’m fairly certain that the version I saw at that cinema, very soon after the premiere, was the full 4 hour version. I saw the film again when it went on general release in 1964 and noticed that it had then been cut from the version I’d seen at the Dominion.
Did anyone else see the film at the Dominion soon after the premiere and can confirm that the full 4 hour versions was shown?

 

[Alan Tully]

The documentary “The Film Which Changed Hollywood” which is on the Blu-ray and was also on the DVD states that the UK premiere was held at the Dominion in London in autumn 1963 and that the cut version was shown.
I don’t think that’s correct. For one thing the film opened at the Dominion in the middle of summer in July 1963, not autumn, and I’m fairly certain that the version I saw at that cinema, very soon after the premiere, was the full 4 hour version. I saw the film again when it went on general release in 1964 and noticed that it had then been cut from the version I’d seen at the Dominion.
Did anyone else see the film at the Dominion soon after the premiere and can confirm that the full 4 hour versions was shown?

That doc should be called, How Not To Make A Movie. A great doc, but all that waste going on. I'd think the budget could have paid for every UK film made in the 50's...plus a fair few in the 60's!

 

[Rick Thompson]

I have no actual evidence on this, but it occurred to me that the Entr'acte music may be on disc one for space reasons. Inasmuch as the extras are on disc 2, it could be that an extra would have had to be cut to make room on disc 2. It could be a case where, rather than leave out an extra that's eight minutes long because there's only five minutes left of space (I'm using these times as an example, not because I've timed everything) on disc 2, they moved the four-minute Entr'acte to otherwise-wasted empty space on disc 1 and fit the eight-minute extra into the now-remaining 9 minutes on disc 2. Even though the Entr'acte is music only, we're not talking about a two-meg MP3 file here; it's an HD file that takes a lot of space.
Back in the days of LPs, Broadway cast albums did this all the time. One of the features of CDs is that songs are now in their correct "show performance" order.
If that's what happened here, I'll live with changing the disc after the Entr'acte instead of before.

 

[Douglas R]

I have no actual evidence on this, but it occurred to me that the Entr'acte music may be on disc one for space reasons. Inasmuch as the extras are on disc 2, it could be that an extra would have had to be cut to make room on disc 2. It could be a case where, rather than leave out an extra that's eight minutes long because there's only five minutes left of space (I'm using these times as an example, not because I've timed everything) on disc 2, they moved the four-minute Entr'acte to otherwise-wasted empty space on disc 1 and fit the eight-minute extra into the now-remaining 9 minutes on disc 2. Even though the Entr'acte is music only, we're not talking about a two-meg MP3 file here; it's an HD file that takes a lot of space.

That's a generous interpretation But they get these wrong so often that I'm convinced the people working on films with Overtures, Entr'actes etc simply don't understand how they were originally presented.

 

[kagemusha98]

I was at the HMV store on Oxford St in London on saturday. One of the staff put on the BLU of CLEOPATRA....,,,,,within minutes a large crowd ultimately gathered watching Cleopatra's entrance into Rome..everyone was transfixed ....comments such as "Is this 3D without glasses?" ..." and look no CGI..wow"...." Now I have to buy a blu ray player". Within 15 minutes.....35 copies were sold.
It was very cool to observe!

 

[Douglas R]

I was at the HMV store on Oxford St in London on saturday. One of the staff put on the BLU of CLEOPATRA....,,,,,within minutes a large crowd ultimately gathered watching Cleopatra's entrance into Rome..everyone was transfixed ....comments such as "Is this 3D without glasses?" ..." and look no CGI..wow"...." Now I have to buy a blu ray player". Within 15 minutes.....35 copies were sold.
It was very cool to observe!

That's marvellous. I'll be that way tomorrow. I'll see if they are still showing it!

 

[kagemusha98]

The staff just popped it in one of the screens on the wall.....they had just received their shipment ...late. I bought 2 copies for friends in the "Colonies".

 

[Hollowbrook Drive-In]

That doc should be called, How Not To Make A Movie. A great doc, but all that waste going on. I'd think the budget could have paid for every UK film made in the 50's...plus a fair few in the 60's!

The documentary's actually called The Film that Changed Hollywood, not "which" (a lot of people think "that" and "which" are interchangeable, but they're not -- they don't mean exactly the same thing).

 

[Rick Thompson]

That's a generous interpretation But they get these wrong so often that I'm convinced the people working on films with Overtures, Entr'actes etc simply don't understand how they were originally presented.

Not saying that IS the reason, only that it could be based on my experience with Broadway cast LPs.

 

[Charles Smith]

Another thing about the selections on Broadway cast LPs, though, is that they might sometimes have been rearranged slightly for better flow in listening to one song after another. Am I remembering correctly that one of Goddard Lieberson's personal mandates was to tailor a cast album to be a good and satisfying album, in and of itself? Of course that was probably the case with any good producer. And of course I digress.....

 

[john a hunter]

The documentary “The Film Which Changed Hollywood” which is on the Blu-ray and was also on the DVD states that the UK premiere was held at the Dominion in London in autumn 1963 and that the cut version was shown.
I don’t think that’s correct. For one thing the film opened at the Dominion in the middle of summer in July 1963, not autumn, and I’m fairly certain that the version I saw at that cinema, very soon after the premiere, was the full 4 hour version. I saw the film again when it went on general release in 1964 and noticed that it had then been cut from the version I’d seen at the Dominion.
Did anyone else see the film at the Dominion soon after the premiere and can confirm that the full 4 hour versions was shown?

Yes Doug. I saved up my pocket money ( a mammoth 10 shillings-the cheapest seats)and saw it at the Dominion at the matinee performance following the premiere-the first public showing. The doco makes two errors.
The first and most important is that it states that the Dominion presentation was the 3hour 15 mins version. That is totally incorrect. That was used at the Paris opening a few months later and became the 35mm general release version.Later 70mm prints were edited down to this length.
We got a 3hour 40 min (or thereabouts) version cutting many small scenes from the 4 hour Rivoli version among them the scene before Alexander's tomb and the first fire divination scene where it is for foretold that she will bear Caeser a son.
The doco also states the Elizabeth was at the premiere. Again untrue. Despite large crowds waiting to see her and Burton, they did not turn up. She later saw it at a charity performance for the Royal Ballet.The premiere was also covered live by the BBC-very unusual for those days.
The other error is that it states Elizabeth"owned Todd AO". She had a large share holding left to her by Michael Todd but the controlling interest had been sold to Fox in 1958 who then would use it for their prestige pictures like Can Can and the planned Greatest Story Ever Told.
Shame -apart from these errors, it is otherwise outstanding.

 

[Douglas R]

Thanks for that John. I was in the ten shilling seats as well!

 

[AdrianTurner]

I too saw the film at the Dominion and remember thinking it badly needed a chariot race or something to liven it up. I'm pretty sure it was the four-hour version (it certainly felt like it) but the usually authoritative Monthly Film Bulletin (Sep 1963, p127) lists its running time as "226 minutes (original running time 243 mins)" Now, the difference might be the length of the Overture, Entr'Acte and Play-out music . . . but it's a weird discrepancy.
I ran the film in 70mm a few times at the NFT in the 1980s and we never managed to obtain the original version.

 

[RickardL]

The BBFC lists the version certified on 30/05/63 as 243 minutes 11 seconds (21886 feet) and the one
certfied on 08/12/2011 (presumably the blu-ray) as 251 minutes 7 seconds (01:59:34 FEATURE PART 1, 02:11:33 FEATURE PART 2).

 

[Douglas R]

The BBFC lists the version certified on 30/05/63 as 243 minutes 11 seconds (21886 feet) and the one
certfied on 08/12/2011 (presumably the blu-ray)  as 251 minutes 7 seconds (01:59:34 FEATURE PART 1, 02:11:33 FEATURE PART 2).

Yes - checking the Blu-ray, the 251 minute length includes the Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music. The film itself is 243 minutes. So that BBFC classification in May 1963 suggests that the complete 4 hour version was originally shown at the Dominion?

 

[RickardL]

Is the Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music 7-8 minutes?

Originally Posted by Douglas R /t/315158/cleopatra-region-free-brd/210#post_3894953
Yes - checking the Blu-ray, the 251 minute length includes the Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music. The film itself is 243 minutes. So that BBFC classification in May 1963 suggests that the complete 4 hour version was originally shown at the Dominion?

Edit: corrected the number of minutes....

 

[Douglas R]

Is the Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music 17 minutes?

I'm not sure were you get 17 minutes. The Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music are a bit under 8 minutes which is the difference between 251 and 243 minutes.

 

[RickardL]

Oops! yes, it should have been 7-8 minutes of course... sorry about that!

Originally Posted by Douglas R /t/315158/cleopatra-region-free-brd/210#post_3894968
I'm not sure were you get 17 minutes. The Overture, Entr'acte and Exit Music are a bit under 8 minutes which is the difference between 251 and 243 minutes.