ws or 4:3, projection or direct, any suggestions

Discussion in 'Displays' started by Brad Newton, Oct 12, 2004.

  1. Brad Newton

    Brad Newton Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2001
    Messages:
    382
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    That's what I am trying to decide. Looking for replacement for 36" RCA. My present setup is dish network, locals via ota, dvd, vcr. The dish signal is supposedly digital, and my locals are or will become available in digital, and we watch several dvd's each week. Most of the programming we watch is the local networks, satellite for movies and sports. I am interested in hd programming, but I don't feel enough is available at this time to justify the additional costs. I do anticipate the purchase of stb to receive the local digital signals. I prefer direct view to projection due to the cleaner, sharper picture. HD sets that I have seen are great with HD content, but soft and fuzzy with non hd. I would like to be able to receive my local networks in both analolg & digital until the digital signal has eliminated the quirks. Are both analog & digital tuners available in televisions, or is it a matter of picking one or the other. I have looked at the Sony 40" model, but understand that it is no longer in production. I want a set that will deliver a clean, sharp picture, regardless of the source. Any suggestions?
     
  2. John S

    John S Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2003
    Messages:
    5,460
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Not sure how to suggest something....

    I can only say, I am happy with my 60" Philips for SD and HD so far. I no longer even have an NTSC tuner hooked up, only the ATSC tuner though. Most of the Denver locals have an HD feed going these days.

    regaurdless of source?? Well cruddy sources will look, well cruddy, once you get above a certain screen size, and a display with accurate HD resolution. Just the reality of it all.
     
  3. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 1999
    Messages:
    2,713
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Garbage in, garbage out. That's why most HD displays don't make SD material (particularly analog satellite, OTA and cable broadcasts) look good. If you have a good DVD player that can upconvert 480i DVD's to 1080i or 720p and hook it to your HD display then that will help smooth out some of the rough edges.

    What kind of budget are you looking at, and have you considered a front projector and screen? Much, much greater picture size with a pretty sharp image (better than many 7" gun CRT rear projectors, which can't really display much more than 1280x720p resolution anyway) for the money.

    Around the $2,000 mark will get you a newer model 1280x720p LCD projector like the Panasonic AE700U, which has been getting pretty solid reviews, or the Sanyo Z3 (the verdict is out as to which is the better PJ). DLP is the way to go with its greater black level and smoother overall picture, but good 720p units start in the $4,000 and up category.
     
  4. Brad Newton

    Brad Newton Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2001
    Messages:
    382
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    not interested in a projector at all. not enough room.

    You are saying that I would not receive a good picture on most hd sets with the type of sources that I have?
     
  5. John S

    John S Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2003
    Messages:
    5,460
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    VCR and SD via cable or dish. Is quite poor on the low side, and barely acceptable on the high side. Screen size alone does a lot to reveal flaws in such sources, combine that with high res. And you will see every difficiency there is the source.

    DVD and HD, certainly most always look amazing on them though.

    A few laserdiscs I have, are quite bad, most of them look dang good. The majority of VCR tapes I have look bad, with only a few being somewhat accetpable.
     
  6. Jeff Gatie

    Jeff Gatie Lead Actor

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Messages:
    6,531
    Likes Received:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    5,610


    This is more due to the larger size screen than to any inherent superiority of the direct-view display. The bigger the picture, the more the flaws show up. Conversely, the smaller picture of a direct-view makes it seem more sharp, when this is not really the case. Projection CRT can actually resolve a greater detail than direct-view. Direct-view is also hampered by the shadow mask, which causes a pixel-like display that is not present in a CRT RPTV (the top of the line Sony HD direct-views are the only ones I've seen that minimize this effect. They also have much greater actual resolution and cost a fortune per diagonal inch). Most ISF calibrators on this site will tell you that the best picture available (certainly the best bang for the buck) is from a calibrated CRT RPTV. The blacks are better, there is no screendoor or rainbow and the price per diagonal inch is much better than direct-view. As far as picture quality, garbage in, garbage out is correct, especially if you start viewing HD programming. HD will make even the best SD signal look terrible.
     
  7. Jerome Grate

    Jerome Grate Cinematographer

    Joined:
    May 23, 1999
    Messages:
    2,984
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    110
    My suggestion is to go with HD-RPTV. I think it will satisfy you in all your viewing, 4:3 material and 16:9 material. Here's what I looked for before purchasing my first RPTV:

    1. The t.v. needs to have a line doubler that will upscale all signals to at least 480p. Larger sets (57 inch or larger) I believe will actually do 1080i on all signals. The only problem with RPTV is that VHS looks absolutely horrid. You can't fix it unless you have S-VHS.

    2. The t.v. should have DVI (Digital Visual Input) at least or HDMI (High Definition Multimedia Interface) that's HDCP (High Definition Copy Protection) compliant. This will future proof your video to the extent whereas when HD-TV via ASTC becomes more and more available, you won't have a problem with connecting it to your t.v. set.

    3. Follow some of us that can't wait for HD-DVD or Blue Laser HD DVD discs by purchasing an upscaling DVD player. Having HDMI or DVI allows you to pass the signal digitally with out and D/A and A/D conversion.

    4. Despite what some may say, I think the set should be 16:9. Each rptv has it's own stretch mode to fill the screen with 4:3 material and some do it well and others are pretty damn good. If you view a few DVDS a week, then it's definetly in your best interest to go 16:9 widescreen. Remember all HD material via Broadcast or HD DVD will require this format to look immaculate.

    My view on RPTV is that I think it looks so much more film like in viewing DVDs than Tube. Tube is nice and I still have my 32 inch Toshiba but watching shows like Futurama and other shows looks really great on my Sony via SD (Standard Definition) and watching DVD via component upscaled to 1080i is simply beautiful on this patticular set and you will get the same reviews on other quality sets like Hitachi, Mitsubishi, etc,.
     
  8. John S

    John S Producer

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2003
    Messages:
    5,460
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    One thing, I will say.. Everybody I know that let somebody talk them into a particular display, is usually not happy. Those that take great pains to decide for themselves usually are pretty happy with what they get.

    Most I know that just bought on a whim (impusle purchase) don't seem as happy either with a few exceptions here and there.

    Just some additional FYI on it all.
     
  9. Brad Newton

    Brad Newton Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2001
    Messages:
    382
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I plan on doing a lot of research, but I'm not all that familiar with 480, 720, 1080, etc. at this point. Just trying to learn the lingo
     
  10. Jerome Grate

    Jerome Grate Cinematographer

    Joined:
    May 23, 1999
    Messages:
    2,984
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    110
    The various numbers you mentioned in the previous post refer to lines of resolution.
    480i = 480 lines of resolution interlaced (wrapped around). This is the most common used for standard DVDs via S-Video connection and component without progressive scan.

    480p = 480 lines of resolution progressive (continuous). The horizontal lines are sent scanned continously hence a brighter and smoother film like picture, fewer artifacts and some upscaling to the extent that detail is slightly inhanced. No jagged or fragment edges that plague 480i.

    720p = 720 lines of resolution progressive. Pretty much the same as 480p but much higher definition. This is (I believe) the standard for High Definition. This produces a high quality of detail.

    1080i = 1080 lines of resolution interlaced. This by far is the standard of High Definition and of course more lines of resolution than 720p but the difference can't be seen by the naked eye.

    All t.v.s RPTV/LCD/DLP/LCOS do 480i or p and 1080i if there HDTVs. A few do 720p and this is somewhat of an issue as X-BOX have games that are done in 720p. These definitions just provided are my interpretation of each listing and you can certainly go to FAQ portion of this site for further explanations.
     

Share This Page