WS: Is Disney cheating?

Discussion in 'DVD' started by Marc_E, Oct 14, 2003.

  1. Marc_E

    Marc_E Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2001
    Messages:
    769
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Is Disney pulling a fast one on us who demanded OAR? 1.66:1 on my 103" FP gives bars on the sides. Are they trying to compromise between FS and WS?
    I just bought The Lion King and saw that it is 1.66:1 (Family friendly WS) after seeing that Treasure Planet and Stitch the movie are also that way.
    Any thoughts?
    Marc
     
  2. ThomasC

    ThomasC Lead Actor

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2001
    Messages:
    6,526
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    IIRC, Lion King was 1.85:1 in theaters, then opened up to 1.66:1 for the DVD. David Boulet said in his review that opening it up made it better, and rewatching the LD made it seemed cramped, and I find no reason to disagree. Perhaps TP and Stitch are the same way, I'm not sure though.
     
  3. alan halvorson

    alan halvorson Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 1998
    Messages:
    2,009
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    1.66 done right produces bars on the sides. Anything narrower than 1.77 produces bars on the sides; anything wider than 1.77 produces bars on the top and bottom. Normally, bars on the sides are not seen due to overscan. Apparently, your system has none/very little overscan - a good thing most of the time.
     
  4. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2001
    Messages:
    17,967
    Likes Received:
    2,353
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Albany, NY
    Every Disney film since The Little Mermaid has been composed in the 1.66:1 ratio.
     
  5. Jonathan

    Jonathan Second Unit

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 1998
    Messages:
    466
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  6. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2001
    Messages:
    17,967
    Likes Received:
    2,353
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Albany, NY
    ...with that notable exception.[​IMG]

    Forgot about that clunker.:b My point was that the animation system Disney used was a 1.66:1 based system.

    I just don't understand this need to fill one's widescreen TV, while leering at Joe Six Pack for wanting the same on his 4x3.[​IMG]
     
  7. Marc_E

    Marc_E Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2001
    Messages:
    769
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  8. Mark Zimmer

    Mark Zimmer Producer

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 1997
    Messages:
    4,300
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I don't think so. 1.66:1 is the standard ratio for European releases, and they may just be wanting to capitalize on the worldwide market.
     
  9. LukeB

    LukeB Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2000
    Messages:
    2,178
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    1.66:1 anamorphic widescreen isn't a compromise between Widescreen and Fullscreen, because the black bars on top and bottom will be the same as if it were 1.78:1 (which most "1.85:1 in theory" widescreen DVDs are). Like Adam said, 1.66:1 is the aspect ratio they create their films in, and DVD has become the only way to see the entire animated frame as it was created, since both theatrical matting to 1.85:1 and VHS cropping to 1.33:1 loses some of the frame.
     
  10. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Executive Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2001
    Messages:
    17,967
    Likes Received:
    2,353
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Albany, NY
     
  11. Julian Lalor

    Julian Lalor Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 1999
    Messages:
    975
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Lion King was composed for 1.85:1 but hard matted at 1.66:1. The DVD shows the full apperture.
     
  12. Joshua_W

    Joshua_W Second Unit

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2003
    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I think I read somewhere that the animators create a 1.66:1 image, which is protected and matted to 1.85:1 at the theater.

    The DVDs are released at 1.66:1 (technically "open matte") at the request of the animators, as they prefer that ratio.
     
  13. Sean Frost

    Sean Frost Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2003
    Messages:
    77
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What ratio was Spirited Away created in? On the DVD it looks like 1.85:1
     
  14. LukeB

    LukeB Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2000
    Messages:
    2,178
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I thought that the Spirited Away DVD was supposed to be 2.0:1. But I have no idea what the Ghibli people animated it for.
     
  15. Bryan Tuck

    Bryan Tuck Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2002
    Messages:
    1,724
    Likes Received:
    248
    Trophy Points:
    1,610
    Real Name:
    Bryan Tuck
     
  16. Ken_McAlinden

    Ken_McAlinden Producer
    Reviewer

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2001
    Messages:
    6,190
    Likes Received:
    76
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    Livonia, MI USA
    Real Name:
    Kenneth McAlinden
    Most of the 1.66:1 Disney films are layed out to be matted to 1.85:1. Certain special presentations of the films (such as the "Pocohantas Summer Spectacular") were projected at 1.66:1 in some venues.

    The 1.66:1 "fluff" area allowed for different framings between the two ratios and less egregious panning and scanning for 4:3 presentations. It doesn't bother me too much either way.

    Regards,
     
  17. Marc_E

    Marc_E Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2001
    Messages:
    769
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Does bother me terribly because I can just adjust my side surtains around the screen and looks perfect. I was just curious in the wake of the flood of phone calls/emails if this was a 'give them this to shut them up' solution.
    Marc
     
  18. Stephen_J_H

    Stephen_J_H All Things Film Junkie

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2003
    Messages:
    5,589
    Likes Received:
    871
    Trophy Points:
    9,110
    Location:
    North of the 49th
    Real Name:
    Stephen J. Hill
    It's a software thing. Every film completed with the Pixar-developed CAPS (Computer Assisted Painting System), with the exception of Atlantis:The Lost Empire and the upcoming Brother Bear, is outputted in 1.66:1. Since the average megaplex (and I know this from experience, since I work in one) is only equipped to show films in either 1.85 or 2.35:1, of course concessions have to be made in framing, and sometimes the directors actually prefer that framing (as was the case with Beauty & the Beast). BTW, the first Disney film to use CAPS was The Rescuers Down Under. The Little Mermaid was the last hand-painted film released.
     
  19. Sean Frost

    Sean Frost Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2003
    Messages:
    77
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Bryan do you know if Spirited Away was animated to 1.85:1? Or was it animated in some other ratio and they had reframe it for theaters.

    Also on the DVD it seems that the picture quality for the movie on the first disk doesn't look as good as the trailer picture quality on disk two. The trailer image looks more colorful and crisper.
     
  20. Howard S

    Howard S Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2000
    Messages:
    70
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    0
     

Share This Page