With Blu the apparent victor, it's time to demand some changes.... (1 Viewer)

[Marc Colella]

I'm pretty sure that's what's going to happen too.

Every new DVD release from a studio that supports Blu-Ray should be released in that format as well. Sony of all companies should be leading the way in this respect. I already see 5 recently announced Sony titles that will be released on DVD with no Blu-Ray version mentioned - 4 of which are new titles on home video.

The format's been out for almost 2 years already. Is Sony going to support this format the way they're supporting SACD?

 

[Jari K]

Yes, I agree. But still, you guys (and me too via importing!) are lucky, since in my country in Europe the cheapest HD-titles cost around 38-40$.. And I´m talking about some catalog titles like "Lethal Weapon" or "Training Day".. Some titles are over 50$! Nobody buys them at those prices..

 

[LarryH]

I do not envy your situation, but prices quoted in $US are hard to relate to since the $US has gone down the tubes in exchange rates.

 

[ppltd]

The time to ask for changes was when there was competition. It is a little too late now, as there will be no competing format to force any changes, and the studios have shown little regard to the consumer up until now.

As far as the list of 'would like to have's', the most important to me is the lowering of the MSRP on catalog titles. Warner already has a 28.95 MSRP on most catalog title that all studios should follow.

 

[EnricoE]

my demand to all br studios...

get rid of that region coding!!!

 

[Jonathan Kaye]

I disagree. What a lot of people seem to have forgotten is that, even if all HD DVD releases dry up tomorrow, Blu-ray is still in competition with DVD. High definition's only weapon against DVD is video/audio quality, and if the quality isn't there the consumer won't buy it. That's why titles like The Fifth Element had to be remastered, and the job of this community now is to make sure that the studios' standards don't slip, in the same way that we have done with DVD.

 

[Stephen_J_H]

Actually, HD's second weapon is retailers. If retailers gradually dedicate less and less space to DVD and begin to price BD players competitively with higher end DVD players (given those players' upscaling capabilities), the public will be more inclined to replace a failing piece of hardware with something that is perceived to be "future-proof", thus opening the gateway for new HD consumers.

 

[Ray_R]

Here are my demands.

NO using noise reduction OR edge enhancement!
No more usage of MPEG2!
Use the original soundtrack! No more of using the remixed with added foley shite!
No dubtitles! (I seriously hope there hasn't been any.)

 

[Dan Hitchman]

Besides all the usual suspects, how about all subtitles for "letterboxed" ratio movies (like 70mm, Panavision, etc.) have to fit within the picture frame for constant height scope front projection systems and so that it looks like the original theatrical release where the subs are placed within the lower picture frame.

No more of the common practice of putting the subtitles within the black bars (top or bottom)!

Dan

 

[Peter Neski]

Maybe Now Criterion will release HD Titles,I see buying the Last Emperor on
dvd ,because there's no HD Version,even though Criterion is big on promoting
that their transfers are new High Definition versions,they only give us DVD.

Maybe somebody can get Paramount to come out with some Titles on HD,not counting
that lame HD DVD List of Titles,They have the goods ,but refuse to release them.

Fox/MGM is a mess.either the extras arent on the Expensive Blue Ray versions.Like instead
of the stuff off the second "Speed"dvd set,they don't give us that ,they give us some stupid game.
MGM-UA titles come out as special dvds sets ,yet their arent any Blueray versions.

of course the 40 price tag is only something Fox would come with,remember when they did lasers

 

[Paul.S]

Okay, this is a stretch but I'm gonna toss it out there anyway.

Given Bob Chapek's and especially Mike Dunn's IMO arrogant comments over the past many months about looking at "the other format" in their rear view mirrors, how 'bout they use their newfound ability to focus their resources on the purported road ahead and prioritize the release of some stellar movies that have been non-anamorphic for too damn long?

Pardon me while I pull a Peter Bart and pretend I'm directly addressing the person(s) in question: Bob, that means Spike Lee's terrific He Got Game and Robert Redford's outstanding Horse Whisperer and (Best Picture nominee) Quiz Show. Great movies, crappy DVDs. In speaking recently to Home Media Magazine, Bob, you quoted Michael Bay. How 'bout an Armageddon BD? Clearly the reason it's only been available non-anamorphic for almost 10 years couldn't be that the movie wasn't financially successful.

And Mike, how 'bout less bluster and more results on getting Van Ling to do wicked new SE BDs of The Abyss and True Lies? And I want a Waiting To Exhale BD too, dammit.

 

[Scooter]

If we were REALLY in a position to demand stuff...wouldn't there have been ONE format to begin with? And in the original HDTV spec?

The struggle will continue for a while....

 

[Paul.S]

Good point, Scooter. "You are in a position to demand nothing." --Khan

Oh and I forgot Scream.

 

[John Dirk]

Wow. I've never seen so many people so eager to be screwed. Competition is a good thing. It's what keeps otherwise unscrupulous companies reasonably honest. If, in fact HD DVD is dead, I see no real cause for celebration since Blu Ray is *not* [yet] a valid successor to DVD. I do understand that most of you probably feel that the demise of HD DVD would pave the way for a mainstream Blu format, but I see no reason why the BDA would be compelled to meet any consumer demands, especially pricing.

If either of these camps really cared about consumers, they would have worked together from the beginning to create a ubiquitous format that we could all embrace. Instead, both have presented proprietary formats in the hopes of eventual market domination. Monopolies don't serve consumers well. Think Comcast.

OK - End of rant. As I said in the beginning, I don't think this is over yet anyway, and when it is, I would be surprised if either of these formats is left standing.

Just my .02 cents and I hope I'm wrong...

John

 

[Edwin-S]

I don't get some of the arguments that are being used to put forward the notion that the BDA will have no incentive to lower prices, improve players, or engage in competition once HD DVD fades from view. If, in fact, it does fade away.

Using DVD as argument is fallacious, because DVD is no less a proprietary format than either HD DVD or Blu-ray. DVD belongs to Toshiba and, I believe, Phillips. Every manufacturer, outside of Toshiba, has to pay some sort of royalty or fee to Toshiba in order to produce machines. Every disc sold results in a royalty to Toshiba. If that isn't the definition of proprietary then what is.

DVD was a single format without competition, yet software and hardware prices fell to unprecedented levels. If the prices on DVD fell without a competing format then I see no reason that prices for the Blu-ray format will not come down over time as well. There is going to be internal competition between the entitities that make up the BDA. Competition is not going to come to a grinding halt just because HD DVD disappears. There are going to be at least six, if not more, manufacturers of BD players. Every one of these manufacturers are going to want to capture as much of the market as they can. The only way to do that is through price competition and/or improvements in the features on players. I do not believe the HDM market will become static just because HD DVD goes away.

 

[Marc Colella]

The price came down as more and more DVDs were purchased, making it cheaper to produce per unit. That's the big difference. I don't see how Blu-Ray prices (movie or player) will come down as fast as I really don't think it'll catch on nearly as fast as DVD has (if at all). If it stays in the niche, prices won't drop down to DVD levels.

 

[Robert Crawford]

There are many of us that don't believe HDM will ever approach the market penetration that SD DVD has and will forever be an advanced video format partner to SD DVD. We can only hope that it's market penetration goes far beyond what happened to LD so that prices are lowered enough to be somewhat competitive to SD DVD.

 

[Dave Moritz]

The problem is that even after HD-DVD goes away and at this point in time there is no reason to believe that it wont. While Toshiba looks like they will drag this fight out as long as the can. When it is all over Toshiba will still have SD-DVD as a royalty stream. I do not see SD-DVD going away anytime soon. Look how long VHS was available after DVD took over. But again I think HD-DVD is done for the most part unless there is a miracle and Toshiba figures out how to win back some studios, I do not see that happening. Some people seem to think that if and when HD-DVD goes away the BDA will not lower prices much or very fast. Lets not forget that Blu-ray still has to compete with the SD-DVD format. The BDA group still needs to convince all those people who have SD-DVD libraries and are buying HDTV's, that Blu-ray is the next logical step. So IMHO the BDA still has competition even after HD-DVD goes away. They still have to win the consumer over and convince them to buy players and software to replace titles the already own. I work in retail in the delivery department and you would be amazed that there are consumers out there that do not own dvd players and some that still are holding on to there VHS collections. And there are quite a few that do not have surround sound systems as well.

When HD-DVD goes away the fight is only half over and I do hope that Blu-ray can get decent market penetration. I am a firm believer that HD is the next step and with so many people buying HDTV's HDM is the next logical step. We know it offers the best picture and sound so hopefully enough consumers realize that as well. If HD-DVD had won it to would technically have to compete against SD-DVD. The only difference is that Toshiba would have two revenue streams and why would they lower prices when there is no outside competition? Personally my HT is going to revolve around HDM and all my upgrades are centered around it.

I see Toshiba having to at least make a dual format player around 2009. The studios that remain with HD-DVD are really going to feel the pressure this year as more and more people buy Blu-ray players and software. And the CNN spot on HD-DVD is another thing that does not help. That just helps spread the word that HD-DVD is loosing studio support and retail space and will be dead soon. So the consumers that did not want to buy a player while a format war was going on. I see them coming out and making that purchase soon and that will be even more reason for Universal and Paramount to finally go Blu. Then the format war will finally be over and the industry can concentrate on marketing one format.

I am going to keep my Toshiba HD-A1 and seal it up in a box after I buy a HD-A35 that is. And I might even buy a second A-35 if the price drops further. I want to make sure that I can continue to play my current HD-DVD library far into the future. As I fully intend to enjoy my HD-DVD's along side of the Blu-ray I own and will own in the future.

 

[John Dirk]

I was not aware of the exact origins of the DVD format. Thanks for the info. I still think it naive to assume that the BDA will be compelled to address "demands" from its consumer base, because they appear completely willing to accept the horrendous offering that has already been put forth. People are cheering Blu Ray as if it actually does something meaningful for them. It doesn't.

We chose DVD over DIVX because the format did not attempt to gouge us on price and offered features clearly beyond what any VHS product could achieve. Both HD DVD and Blu Ray have failed [IMHO] to offer a format compelling enough to universally unseat DVD. As I said in another thread, as an enthusiast, I like the idea of HDM, but even I will sit it out until concerns of instant obsolescence have been permanently addressed. But beyond that, the real people who must be convinced are people like my wife. When I auditioned HDM, She was not impressed with either format, and insisted that the picture looked no better than standard DVD. Since my Sanyo PLV-Z5 upconverts all content to 720P, she did have a point.

Until the average Joe sees HDM as a worthwhile investment, I do not believe that either format can establish itself. As it stands, I doubt this type of consumer would pay even $1.00 more for Blu Ray or HD DVD, [much less what they are asking], even if the media played on their current SD units. Studio support for Blu Ray is not the same as widespread consumer support. It is my contention that for the average consumer, DVD will remain the solid choice for the forseeable future. At best, this will produce a chicken and egg dynamic for HDM pricing.

For either would-be SD DVD successor to come to the table with such lackluster offerings tells me something. They care more about getting the jump on the market than they do about the actual product being sold to consumers. If they want my support, this attitude will need to change.

John

 

[RAF]

Good point, Paul. I've slightly edited the title of this thread to reflect the true nature of the current situation. This has nothing to do with any "head in the sand" mentality on the part of the HTF administration but is merely consistent with the neutral stance taken by this forum regarding the various HD formats. As long as a format is still selling HW and SW there has not yet been a total "victory" in this race. That doesn't mean that I don't personally think that there will eventually be a single format. It just more correctly indicates the current state of affairs as I write this.