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Press Release Wired Press Release: Blu-rays are back; Streaming Isn’t Everything (1 Viewer)

Robert Crawford

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Every time that a studio or small label announces a new title and people go “Yes! I want that! But I’ll wait for a sale” is basically another nail in the coffin. It’s not fair, but I think that’s the reality of it. I think we’ve been seeing more sales this year than in years prior because things aren’t selling anywhere near expected, and they’re just trying to cut their losses and at least break even. A lot of things that were once profitable no longer are.
That's it in a nutshell.
 

Kyrsten Brad

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Every time that a studio or small label announces a new title and people go “Yes! I want that! But I’ll wait for a sale” is basically another nail in the coffin. It’s not fair, but I think that’s the reality of it. I think we’ve been seeing more sales this year than in years prior because things aren’t selling anywhere near expected, and they’re just trying to cut their losses and at least break even. A lot of things that were once profitable no longer are.
Would it help if the studio or label simply released the title at that “sale price” in the first place? Instead of a new release announced at $30, release it at $14.99 or something like that.
Just my $2 million dollars worth.....in counterfeit $10s & $20s.
 

Josh Steinberg

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I’m not sure that it would. The profit margins on a lot of these releases are razor thin - the difference between customers paying full price vs customers buying at a discount is probably the difference between a release that breaks even or makes a tiny profit to one that loses money.

I think in the past, they could make up for lower prices by selling more copies, but the number of people interested in buying physical copies has dwindled so much that the few of us that are left are going to have to pay more if we want the releases to continue.
 

Osato

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Every time that a studio or small label announces a new title and people go “Yes! I want that! But I’ll wait for a sale” is basically another nail in the coffin. It’s not fair, but I think that’s the reality of it. I think we’ve been seeing more sales this year than in years prior because things aren’t selling anywhere near expected, and they’re just trying to cut their losses and at least break even. A lot of things that were once profitable no longer are.

When titles have been offered at $15 or below and then they creep up to$20-$30 many people wait on purchasing. I honestly do this plus I have less time and resources now to purchase and watch.

The market has been over saturated in a lot of ways too.

Good discussion.
 

Osato

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I did order the world is not enough remastered soundtrack cd from la la land. I’ll pay more for a release like that. Plus the urgency is there too.

I usually get a lot of gift cards for movies or titles as gifts this time if the year too.
 

AcesHighStudios

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.
 

Robert Crawford

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.
What can I say, I am a frightening person. As to the comparisons between the stream and disc, you have a valid point, but they're close enough on my OLED for those differences to be more difficult to distinguish than it used to be just years ago between a disc and stream. Streaming has come a long way than when I first started streaming on Amazon. It was so bad, I wouldn't stream very often as it was just bad. Today, it has improved greatly and has closed the gap. My 4K/Dolby Vision streams look superior to Blu-rays of the same title. They're not as good as 4K/Dolby Vision discs, but it's not a night and day difference in my opinion. You probably feel differently and that's fine, but it's only my humble opinion. Therefore, don't hold my moderator status against me as some kind of strike against my personal opinion as I gladly acknowledge there are more knowledgeable people on this forum than I about the intricacies of Home Theater.
 
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Robin9

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.
You're easily frightened. :) Stay away from horror movies!
 

Tino

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.
How silly.:lol: There is nothing wrong with my eyes or tv thank you.

More likely your equipment is not up to par to what many of us are seeing.

I’m curious which titles have you compared and on what kind of equipment to lead you to your opinion?
 

Mark-P

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.
Also, your numbers aren’t right. A 4K stream is going to add up to way more than 3 GB. Most 1080p downloads are in the 3-5 GB range, so 4K would likely be 3 to 4 times that amount, but no one can measure it because 4K downloads aren’t permitted.
 

OliverK

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What can I say, I am a frightening person. As to the comparisons between the stream and disc, you have a valid point, but they're close enough on my OLED for those differences to be more difficult to distinguish than it used to be just years ago between a disc and stream. Streaming has come a long way than when I first started streaming on Amazon. It was so bad, I wouldn't stream very often as it was just bad. Today, it has improved greatly and have closed the gap. My 4K/Dolby Vision streams look superior to Blu-rays of the same title. They're not as good as 4K/Dolby Vision discs, but it's not a night and day difference in my opinion. You probably feel differently and that's fine, but it's only my humble opinion. Therefore, don't hold my moderator status against me as some kind of strike against my personal opinion as I gladly acknowledge there are more knowledgeable people on this forum than I about the intricacies of Home Theater.

Very good post, the gap has closed to a degree even though both sound and picture quality are not quite there yet. Especially picture quality has come closer than one would expect given the low average bitrates that are associated with streaming UHD.
 

OliverK

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Also, your numbers aren’t right. A 4K stream is going to add up to way more than 3 GB. Most 1080p downloads are in the 3-5 GB range, so 4K would likely be 3 to 4 times that amount, but no one can measure it because 4K downloads aren’t permitted.

Indeed bitrates of UHD movie streams are usually around 15 mbps. UHD discs have more of a 4 to 5 times higher average video bitrate so this is no 60 vs 3 GB comparison.
 
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Josh Steinberg

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Bitrate comparisons between physical media and streaming also isn't apple-to-apples comparison.

Physical media has specs that are locked in place once the format debuts that cannot be changed or altered. There are more efficient ways to compress data than the codec that is used on Blu-ray, for instance. It's entirely possible to get the same master with the same quality in two different file sizes because the Blu-ray disc must compress it using only the codec and format that is allowed for Blu-ray, which streaming services are able to take advantage of improvements in compression technology and update their apps and services accordingly. In other words, larger file size in and of itself does not necessarily mean more data or better quality. It can simply mean that the same information was compressed in a less efficient manner.
 

OliverK

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Bitrate comparisons between physical media and streaming also isn't apple-to-apples comparison.

Physical media has specs that are locked in place once the format debuts that cannot be changed or altered. There are more efficient ways to compress data than the codec that is used on Blu-ray, for instance. It's entirely possible to get the same master with the same quality in two different file sizes because the Blu-ray disc must compress it using only the codec and format that is allowed for Blu-ray, which streaming services are able to take advantage of improvements in compression technology and update their apps and services accordingly. In other words, larger file size in and of itself does not necessarily mean more data or better quality. It can simply mean that the same information was compressed in a less efficient manner.

Correct and I would assume that with intelligent optimization streaming could get away with lower bitrates and be virtually tranparent to what can be seen on UHD. Unfortunately the big streaming services instead chose to hit a certain average bitrate target at which they try to make movies as good as they can. I wish they instead would use some of that flexibility to allow even higher bitrates for people who can support them..
 

Josh Steinberg

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I wouldn't be surprised to see that happening as technology continues to improve, as encoding becomes more efficient, and as bandwidth becomes more readily available. But at this point, the vast majority of their target audience seems to be satisfied with the quality being provided, which may limit the incentive to make those improvements immediately.
 

Bryan^H

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How silly.:lol: There is nothing wrong with my eyes or tv thank you.

More likely your equipment is not up to par to what many of us are seeing.

I’m curious which titles have you compared and on what kind of equipment to lead you to your opinion?

I find this video the best demonstration of streaming vs. disc(always trust Vincent). Pretty much my experience when dealing with the two formats. Disc is better, but If you gave me a blind Coke vs. Pepsi comparison with me unaware of the format I was viewing, I could not tell you one was better than the other. And that is coming from someone with a trained eye. You think the general public is going to care:D

 

Sam Posten

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Anyone who believes a 4K stream looks as good as a 4K Blu-ray, there is something seriously wrong with your eyes or your TV. And a 3GB file is never going to look as good as a 60+ GB file. And for a person saying that to be a moderator is truly frightening.

Come to MD and get an education
 

Robert Crawford

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I find this video the best demonstration of streaming vs. disc(always trust Vincent). Pretty much my experience when dealing with the two formats. Disc is better, but If you gave me a blind Coke vs. Pepsi comparison with me unaware of the format I was viewing, I could not tell you one was better than the other. And that is coming from someone with a trained eye. You think the general public is going to care:D


Thanks for posting that video Bryan as he basically confirmed my below comments I made earlier today about the differences between my Oppo 203 and 4KATV while viewing on my LG OLED. He even uses the same term I did about it not being a "night and day" difference between the two units. Also, since the time that video was made, the 4KATV does output Dolby Atmos now.

What can I say, I am a frightening person. As to the comparisons between the stream and disc, you have a valid point, but they're close enough on my OLED for those differences to be more difficult to distinguish than it used to be just years ago between a disc and stream. Streaming has come a long way than when I first started streaming on Amazon. It was so bad, I wouldn't stream very often as it was just bad. Today, it has improved greatly and has closed the gap. My 4K/Dolby Vision streams look superior to Blu-rays of the same title. They're not as good as 4K/Dolby Vision discs, but it's not a night and day difference in my opinion. You probably feel differently and that's fine, but it's only my humble opinion. Therefore, don't hold my moderator status against me as some kind of strike against my personal opinion as I gladly acknowledge there are more knowledgeable people on this forum than I about the intricacies of Home Theater.
 

AcesHighStudios

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How silly.:lol: There is nothing wrong with my eyes or tv thank you.

More likely your equipment is not up to par to what many of us are seeing.

I’m curious which titles have you compared and on what kind of equipment to lead you to your opinion?

O... K... Because I can see a very clear difference between a 4K Blu-ray and a 4K stream and you can't means MY equipment isn't up to snuff and yours is. Because, of course, that makes perfect sense.
 

Tino

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O... K... Because I can see a very clear difference between a 4K Blu-ray and a 4K stream and you can't means MY equipment isn't up to snuff and yours is. Because, of course, that makes perfect sense.
As much sense as you not understanding what an opinion is.
 

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