Will Progressive Scan Give Me Sharper Picture?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by James Edward, Mar 22, 2002.

  1. James Edward

    James Edward Supporting Actor

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    I have a Sony 330 player now, and just took delivery of a 57HX81 Toshiba TV.

    Going from a direct view 32" inch to this is a bit of a shock. The picture is not as sharp and punchy. I currently have only an S-Video out on the 330.

    Would a new player with component outs give me a better picture, or does progressive only help with motion artifact issues?

    I am considering the Sony DVP-NS700P, or Toshiba SD-3750.

    Thanks.
     
  2. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    Get the Sony 700 post-haste, James. Yes, you will get a much better picture from a progressive-scan player connected via component-video inputs--the images will be smoother and more film-like. That RPTV deserves the best signal you can feed it.

    Don't expect a properly calibrated RPTV to overwhelm you light output and direct view-like contrast ratios. Once you get used to the Tosh's prog-scan images, you will come to appreciate the much better resolution and fine details it can render.

    But, first, get that Sony 700. Then report back to us.
     
  3. James Edward

    James Edward Supporting Actor

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    Thanks Jack, I'm all over it. Report to follow...
     
  4. Mike I

    Mike I Supporting Actor

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    I agree...A progressive player coupled with an HD ready set will give you and outstanding picture, almost 3d like..Get the progressive player when you can..
     
  5. Bob McElfresh

    Bob McElfresh Producer

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    I know you want to strike while the iron is hot, but I'd suggest you wait a few weeks.

    Display devices like these need a week or 3 of burn-in time and settling. Get Avia and do a basic calibration (because the out-of-box brightness/contrast typically tries to make the unit stand out on a showroom floor).

    Figure out the distances and order a HD component cable set from one of bettercables/wickedcables/catcables .com. An ordinary component cable may not do a great job with HD/Progressive signals. You can also find good cables on eBay by searching for "Canare".

    Then, get a PS DVD player.

    Now you can see if the new player helps, and you may be ready to consider paying a ISF calibration person to come in and do all the magic to adjust that TV to match that player. I've heard it makes a dramatic difference.

    Good Luck.
     
  6. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    Matching a 480P DVD player to the HX81 Toshibas will not give you a big boost up as compared to other non-toshiba sets for this year.

    The Toshiba sets process the 480P signal and upconvert it to 540P for display. This processing degrades the original 480P signal especially in the fine details of an image.

    Regards
     
  7. Elbert Lee

    Elbert Lee Supporting Actor

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    Don't expect miracles and don't expect an "HD-Like" image. I have seen posts from people who did expect the next step toward "HD" and not "FILM-LIKE". Complaints of "film grain" was the primary reason why some people didn't like the transition to Progressive Scan and concluded that the picture ultimately was "soft" in comparison with their older interlaced player.

    Progressive scan dvd players do reveal more and the "film grain" is actually part of the picture. I personally like to see it if it's supposed to be there and it does produce a smoother, more "FILM LIKE" image. I don't understand why people would want artificially sharp and "HD Video-Like" images from their Hollywood releases, absent of any trace that film was ever used to shoot the picture.........

    I second the opinion on waiting around 3 weeks for your set to break in before purchasing a prog scan player and final calibration. Turn the contrast down to around 25% or less so as to save your phosphers...

    Elbert
     
  8. Steve Young

    Steve Young Stunt Coordinator

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    Michael TLV, so are you saying sets by other manufacturers are better with the 480p output of the dvd player than Toshiba's X81 sets? I was considering buying one of these sets, particularly the 57HX81. What other sets in this price range can you recommend? I am upgrading from a Toshiba TP50H95 and Toshiba SD2109 DVD player.

    Thanks

    Steve
     
  9. RyanDinan

    RyanDinan Stunt Coordinator

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    Hmmm....That does seem "odd" that the Toshiba would mess with a 480P signal. But it looks as though the Toshiba set only has one scanrate (33.75kHz) - Thus, must upconvert all 480i/480p to either 1080i or 540p. It seems as though some manufacturers are sticking with supporting only one scanrate, as it's easier to make tubes, and makes the set less expensive to make, since the set only requires memory for one mode, plus the labor involved to set up and calibrate it. Unfortunately, it also requires the 'upconverting' of all signals that don't happen to have that native scanrate (in this case, everything except 1080i material).

    My Sony HS10 can scan at either 480P/960i (31.5kHz) or 540p/1080i (33.75kHz). I believe Pioneer's and Mitsubishi's sets do this as well....

    -Ryan Dinan
     
  10. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    57" Toshiba ... looking at a C$4.5 to C$5K range.

    Consider Sony 57HW40 ... Panasonic PT56WX51C ... Hitachi 53"? I don't think the Pioneers are in this price range.

    Nothing is perfect, but these sets have a few less issues than the Toshiba units.

    Regards
     
  11. Edwin-S

    Edwin-S Producer
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    I'm curious about the definition of "film-like". I have watched a number of films in the theatre lately and I would say that none of them looked particularly sharp. In fact, I would hazard to say that, at times, the DVD version looks "sharper" than the movie did in the theatre. I would like to know if a sharp looking picture actually might be being caused because detail is being lost due to the lower resolution of DVD. Sort of like when you look at an image with less scan lines; it looks "sharper" and more detailed than an image filled in with more scan lines but in reality it is an optical illusion. The image with a higher number of scan lines at first appearances looks "softer" but actually has much more detail.
     
  12. Chris Purvis

    Chris Purvis Stunt Coordinator

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    'film like' refers not to sharpness but to the lack of scan lines in the image - thus making the image solid and coherent. At least it does for me.
     

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