What's wrong with the PS Final Fantasy's?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Dome Vongvises, Dec 5, 2001.

  1. Dome Vongvises

    Dome Vongvises Lead Actor

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    This problem has been bothering me of late. I have fond memories of playing SNES Final Fantasy's and enjoying the hell out of them. But the three Playstation efforts left me disappointed. This is one of the few instances where I have absolutely no idea why I feel this way. A little help, please?
     
  2. Yoshi Sugawara

    Yoshi Sugawara Stunt Coordinator

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    Generally, I think the FF series lost inspiration progressively until the tenth installment.
    Final Fantasy VII blew me out of the water and made me get a Playstation. The story was very good, the minigames were fun, and it really redefined the console RPG.
    Final Fantasy VIII tried to capitalize on the success of VII, mainly by trying to deliver a much more cinematic experience - which is why I didn't like this one. Yes, the graphics and CG sequences were improved, but the story was totally uninspired. I just scoffed and shook my head with disbelief when it was revealed that Squall and all the party members were all together in an orphanage before, and that using the GFs resulted in them not remembering!
    The gameplay was excruciating: one battle can take up to 10 minutes since you have to draw all the magic you possibly can to make your character stronger, and the constant party switching meant redistributing all the Guardian Forces and re-junctioning all the magic - a total exercise in tedium!
    Final Fantasy IX tried to reel all the old-school gamers with its fantasy theme, and tried to take all the elements that made the previous FFs great, and stuffed it into IX. The result was another uninspired game that was just a mish mash of themes from the other FFs. Sure, the CG movies looked great, but by then I just wanted a game that played great. Worse yet, the load times for the battles were loooong. Ugh.
    I actually like Final Fantasy X, though. It's a really solid game that's probably as good as VII. The one gripe I had about it was that exploration seems limited, despite the full-3D worlds - but it delivers in terms of graphics, gameplay (battles are fast and strategic!), story and music. However, I've only played the Japanese version - the voices for the U.S. release sound, well, cheesy.
    After the success of Final Fantasy VII, Square was determined to churn out more products to generate more revenue, and not to make a great game. FFX seems to be an exception, but it seems like all their previous games before FFX were for the most part mediocre. It's really no surprise that they're now in the red...
    So there you go Morgan, your FF thread [​IMG]
     
  3. Chris Bardon

    Chris Bardon Cinematographer

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    I was another one of the people who bought a PS based on FF 7, and although there are some things that could have been done better (in ALL the FF games), I think that all of the PS games were very well done.

    I'd say that one of the best things that has happened with the series is the new magic/combat systems that have evolved. FF7s Materia system was great-I spent a LOT of time playing with different combinations, and finding the little tricks (like final attack+phoenix etc). The story was interesting, and while some complained about the game's linearity, I thought that it progressed well. Having a major character die at the end of the first disc was dramatic, and I actually kept playing to find out what was going on with Cloud and Sepiroth.

    FF8 on the other hand made magic quite useless as magic, but invaluable as a junction ability. Again, lots of time spent on tweaking junctions, and more finding the right combinations of things (this time Death on Attack effect). Story wise I kind of liked the whole SeeD idea, but you're right about things getting a little contrived.

    FF9 though...wow. Not only was there ANOTHER great magic system to play with, there were actually DIFFERENCES between the characters. The sidequests were interesting (I liked the treasure hunting with the chocobos), and I only think that it really fell apart for the ending. The only thing that really seemed to hurt the story here was that there really wasn't a main character for the game. I know that this was Supposed to be Zidane, but he just didn't seem to fit the role.

    Ao there you go-my tirade on PS ff games. Actually, that reminds me of something else... new thread coming on..
     
  4. Oscar_R

    Oscar_R Second Unit

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    Try casting Knights of Round in FF 7. Might as well get in your car and grab a six pack cause it had to execute that CG each and every single time. Then there was that end battle against Sephiroth, were you casted that idiotic spell 4 times in a row, and then had to sit through his Meteor spell that took another eternity to execute. Needless to say I haven't played any of them since then. I do plan on getting FF X though....... go figure
     
  5. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    I think that as the series moved to 3-D, it had some problems, and in trying to fix those, some of the inspiration was lost.

    FF7- good game, good story, but boy did I not like it as much as 8 and 9! The characters wore their emotions on their sleeves and lacked the depth that I would have liked. The one thing I liked is the continuity conveyed through the artistic style and the music. This game also made the whole planet feel too much like the same place (like the same town) only all over the world. Some places were just too similar. Overall, worth the purchase and a great game, but not the best.

    FF8- oh boy...so many people HATED this game, and I used to. I went back to play it and realized that while the cinematic battles and the complexities of it were annoying, if you take time to get into the game, its one of the best. The music rocked, the cinemas were great, the art was inspired, and the whole world felt like a WORLD. There were places where everyone was poor, where the cities were filled with technology, and where it felt like a modern day small city. The story also went all over the world, but not everywhere in the world. FF7's story went to every town, but FF8 left a lot of the world open to exploration.

    FF8 also had a GREAT story that I loved so much. So what if some parts are weird? The GF memory thing is strange, but the whole love plot was well conveyed, especially in the ending cinemas. There are even rumors about the story than are backed up by evidence (such as Rinoa being Ultimecia) and would just make the story better, but, nobody is sure.

    FF9- probably my favorite next to 6. This is the only FF game where the characters had individual personalities, but also had depth and realism, so much so that I cared about them. The story was also so well written and planned out that every character was impacted immensely and showed a change in themselves. The battle system was also very good, and the abilities thing was a good idea. Overall, everything just came together so well, to me, that it made it an experience.

    Yes, here is that FF thread I was looking for.
     
  6. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Supporting Actor

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    I have enjoyed the PS Final Fantasies, to an extent, but nothing that's made me want to rush out and get FFX in any way. FF7 was probably the best of the 3, if they'd release that with new graphics (as the non-combat graphics tend towards the sucky side right now) it would be a much tighter game, and the materia was clever without being overwhelming.
    FF8. Phew. I logged over fifty hours into that bloody game, and I don't think they were really worth it. I totally don't remember the storyline, and I played the damn thing only a few months back. The combat was ungodly slow, just endless drawing of magic, over and over. And that was just to junction up your stats! Don't get me started on that card game either. Instead of a pleasant diversion, they introduce those ridiculous regional rules because you know how to play the game too well.
    FF9. Haven't finished, lost interest on the third disk. Story and game wise, it has its moments, but sitting through those stupid battles drives me. Even when the battle speed setting is cranked, it still takes far longer than it should.
    I find it ironic that Square is the same company which puts out Chrono Cross, which fixes basically... every single problem I have with Final Fantasy. Chrono Cross has a solid story, memorable (mostly) characters, and a magic system that is complex without being frustrating. And one of my favorite final boss battles of all time. And a quick 'n dirty combat system.
    That's my take on things, but then I always felt Final Fantasy achieved its pinnacle in IV. I know people love VI, but VI has about six characters too many and none of them are developed enough for my own personal tastes. The story itself is great though, and it's really just beneath IV for me.
    But then, I get sick of the endless exploration in those games. Some exploration is good, but knowing where to go and not worrying that I haven't been using some character for a few boss fights so they're now useless to me is much better. And there's got to be a balance.
    I started playing Grandia. Story is quaint, characters are fun, battles are QUICK. Thank you, drive through [​IMG] . I wish Final Fantasy could realize that less is more, as far as combat is concerned.
     
  7. Dave F

    Dave F Cinematographer

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    I felt much more in control of the NES and SNES adventures. The story progression cinemas felt much longer in the PS1 games, and had less of an impact on me. I have literally fallen asleep during the first 30 minutes of FF7. 3 times! Furthermore, I always get frustrated that there is a beautiful screen, full of wide open areas, and I can only walk through a tiny part of it.

    I was pretty hyped about FFX until I played the demo. Lotsa cinemas, little gameplay. I'm looking forward to FFXI, but I doubt that I will pony up $10 a month for it.

    -Dave
     
  8. Joe_C

    Joe_C Supporting Actor

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  9. Chris Bardon

    Chris Bardon Cinematographer

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    Chrono Cross FIXES the problems? Actually I thought it caused more than it fixed, and it's the worst example of TOO MANY CHARACTERS out there. At least in FF9 you had a set of 10(?) distinct characters with unique abilities-Chrono cross was so preoccupied with having more characters than anyone else that they forgot to make them good or unique.
     
  10. Joseph Young

    Joseph Young Screenwriter

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    I wanted to like FF7 more than I did. I can chalk that up to my own ineptitude at RPGs. I normally don't tackle RPGS nor am I familiar with the repetitive nature of leveling up. Therefore by the time I got to a particularly nasty set of 3 boss battles in a row, I was not sufficiently leveled up and to boot, I had saved at the worst point possible in the game, with no chance to power up and re-save.
    The in-battle cinematics felt overblown to me. They disturbed the momentum of the battle (rather than being an opportunity to 'catch my breath').
    When it comes to games like the FF series, or Dragon Warrier, or Chrono chross/trigger, I want to like them more but I am not 'good enough' to really enjoy them. [​IMG]
    Joseph
     
  11. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    I loved all the FF games I have played, as well as Lunar, Chrono Cross, and a buncha others.

    The one thing I find about the FF series is that while the games aren't exactly the best games ever made, they are very good and are all worth purchasing.

    While 8 did have some long cinemas, slow battles, and was not made for fast gameplay, its story was just so good that it made up for everything (and you really had to be into it to remember the whole story). If anything, 7 had the worst characters (too shallow), the simplest plot, and was not that exciting. You spend the whole game tracking down a guy who is killing people, but why are you tracking him down? I know the reason, but halfway through, the quest lost meaning. At least IX changed the quest and still kept the same final objective without ruining the game.
     
  12. Brad Grenz

    Brad Grenz Second Unit

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  13. Morgan Jolley

    Morgan Jolley Lead Actor

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    Brad-

    They announced that, but then again, Nintendo and Sony have yet to release the Play Station (the SNES add-on that let you play CD games).

    Square is halting production on the remakes, and if they ever do see the light of day, it won't be a while and there is that chance they won't make it here. Due to the financial troubles, all their focus is going to new games instead of remakes.
     
  14. DarrylWHarrisJr

    DarrylWHarrisJr Stunt Coordinator

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    Yoshi, they are in the red because of the sorry ass movie they tried to make (make like the games next time Square, with Guardian Forces, magic users/summoners, black mages and theifs!!!)

    FFX was tons of exploration after you get control of the airship and go wherever you need to get things you may have missed on (it gives you the option to fight Sin or further explore)
     
  15. AndyVX

    AndyVX Supporting Actor

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    I personally think that FF7 was the best Final Fantasy game that has been released in the US.
    FF8 was a really great game, but the battle system bothered the hell out of me, that I wasn't able to get through it a second time. But, the story, music, art, characters were all great.
    FF9 was total crap IMO. I felt that there was nothing driving me to play through the game... like a decent story maybe. [​IMG]
    Now, I'm almost 40 hours into FFX and I must say that it is a really great game. Not quite up there with FF7's story though. Maybe things will change once I get to Zanarkand
    I also think that voice acting is the best thing that has happened to the Final Fantasy series in a long time. Bad voice actors aside, the voices really help with bringing out emotions. (I'd say that most of the voice actors have gradually gotten much better throughout the game...except for Yuna...her VA still completely sucks)
    I can't wait to see what FFXII turns out to be. Hopefully SquareEA will hire a really top-notch bunch to do the VA's for it.
     
  16. Sean Moon

    Sean Moon Cinematographer

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    It will take an act of God to trump the sheer genius of the old SuperNES Final Fantasy games.

    FF7 was amazing. Great story, graphics, gameplay, everything. It brought RPG's to everyone in a big big way and for that I am glad. And for that same reason I am incredibly angry with the game. Now I have to sit through each month looking at substandard RPGs being rehased out by every studio. FFVII also made the graphics more important than the story and gameplay, and that is the route every RPG maker(aside from Enix) is going for now.

    FFVIII.......

    Ask most people and they will say it is the best of all. Then ask the same person if they ever played the SNES games. 9 times out of 10 they will say no. Try convincing them to play the infinitly superior SNES games in the FF anthology or Chronicles and they will laugh at you, calling them too old school and silly looking.

    In other words they are not true RPG or Final Fantasy fans(in my opinion)

    FFIX was the best on PS. It felt like a big shiny new SNES game. It was made for those of us that remember the games back in the glory days.

    So far FFX is kinda disappointing. I have absolutely no care for the characters, and the story is just meandering...feels like it is going nowhere yet. I hope it gets better.

    Personally..I wish RPG's stayed as a niche market...catering to the fans, not the public. I think that soon RPG's will burn out and then after a few years there will be a rebirth of them, making them better than ever, kinda like what is happening with fighting games right now. We went YEARS with TONS of substandard crap to play, with a few shining stars coming through(Soul Calibur, DOA series) and now we have SC2 and Virtua Fighter 4.

    Another reason the FF games are stale now is they are coming out at least once a year. That is making them stale. I remember waiting YEARS for the next installment, it built up anticipation, and it meant the makers were taking a good damn long time making the game. Remember the feverish anticipation for Zelda on N64? The years upon years of waiting? It was worth it, because the creators made sure they had the BEST product possible, to deliver the goods. Same with Metal Gear Solid 2. The last two years have been murder waiting for it, and it was worth it(except the last half hour, it started to suck there...and what was with the LAME ending).

    Basically Square is pumping out too many games now and too much Final Fantasy, and it is drying up the franchise fast. It no longer feels special. They need to take a cue from Nintendo. Wait a while to release the next game in a series...when you are sure it is amazing enough to kick the ass of even the most rigid gamer.
     
  17. AndyVX

    AndyVX Supporting Actor

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    Sean,

    While I agree with you mostly, there is one thing you have to remember.

    FF1 on NES was FF1 in Japan(FC).

    FF2 on SNES was FF4 in Japan(SFC).

    FF3 on SNES was FF6 in Japan(SFC).

    So, while there were large gaps here in North American inbetween games, there wasn't in Japan. Just something to consider...

    (Ahh, FF6(3) was a great game though...I remember playing that for months when it first came out on the SNES)
     
  18. Marshall W. Carter

    Marshall W. Carter Stunt Coordinator

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    Frankly, I really liked VII, and it was the only one that really captured my imagination in a way similar to the SNES titles, particularly III/VI...at least initially. It was the reason I bought a Playstion in the first place, because up to that point, the Saturn had the better RPG's. The story was well-crafted, Sephiroth was the best villain since Golbez, and the death scene of Aerith takes the cake as *THE* saddest moment in a video game...
    As for VIII & IX, well, it took a while, but I finally got to appreciating them for what they are, instead of comparing them to past chapters in the series. I received IX for Christmas *LAST YEAR*, and quickly lost interest. For some reason, I popped it in during the Thanksgiving holidays, and something just clicked. It was nice to be treated to a PS Final Fantasy set in a world more like those of old, although the character designs kind of had me scratching my head, particularly Quina. Vivi was the best though, an ode to the NES Final Fantasy if ever there was one. The limited ability to Summon and fighters that can actually do some damage was a welcome change after VIII, and the story, if not particularly original, was well done, and provided just enough of a twist at the end to evoke some actual thought and emotion. As an old school, NES-playing Final Fantasy fan, I was also quite happy to see the Four Fiends (Chaoses in this game) from the original NES game make a comeback...heh, as well as a character by the name of Garland.
    For some reason, VIII is the achilles heel in the series, at least for me. The junctioning of magic is a bit of a bore, but not overly so, and does add a bit of challenge to the whole system. Frankly, what got me was that there were no armor/items to equip, and that the battles relied so heavily on the Guardian Forces. The story is OK, but the whole memory/orphanage concept was a bit lame, at least to me. I like the game, but it's the weakest in the series as far as story goes, which is the most important concept IMHO.
    As far as I'm concerned, and I have yet to play X, Final Fantasy III is still the best of series. The story is well-paced, the battle system is well-done (I like the Espers, as well as the way it's worked into the story) and it has characters with, well, character. My favorite, in particular, was Cyan, the swordsman, whose family (and kindom) were destroyed when poisoned by Kefka. First he rages, then he mourns, only to be reunited with his family before being taken to the other side on the Doomtrain. After the 'rebirth of the world' or whatever they called it (when Kefka usurps the power), you lose track of him, only to find him later on due to his carrier pigeons, where he's working on his hobby of making silk roses?!? And you can't forget the side-quest into his inner consciousness where you must face the 'Three Dream Stooges' in order to free him from his inner demons (and in this case, it's actually a demon). It's a bit messed up, but it's good, and he's one of the lesser characters.
    Has anyone played Xenogears? It's Square's best PS RPG for my money, and the story gives any Final Fantasy a run for its money, even III, with all the twists, turns and gut wrenches. Love that game...and I like big mechs/gears [​IMG]
     
  19. Sean Moon

    Sean Moon Cinematographer

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    Yes, Xenogears was a godsend...amazing game

    And III/VI was the greatest. Every character was equally developed and also had a unique fighting style.

    My favorite was Sabin and his blitzes! I still have my program pad and when I first start up the game I program the blitzes into the extra buttons to make the battles smoother. Other than him...Strago was the man. GRAND TRAIN baby...coolest spell since ULTIMA!

    and Relm was alright, but once I drew DOOM, one of the final bosses. (Relms ability was to draw, mimicing abilites thru her pictures.) Cool shit man.
     
  20. Romier S

    Romier S Producer

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    I agree with allot of what has been said so far.
    I liked Final Fantasy 7 allot and thought it was a good game but FF6 was by far the last great Final Fantasy game IMHO.
    FF8 had the most annoying combat system and I also thought the story was a bit contrived.
    I just couldn't connect with any of the character in FF9. The combat was enjoyable but I just could not get into the game.
    FFX just got dull very quickly for me. I wanted to more active time playing and less cinematics. I played through about 30 hours of it now and Its kind of on the back burner until I get to it again and finish it. The combat system is by far the best since the SNES games and I do give Square thier due on that.
    Oh and I agree...Xenogears is the second coming[​IMG]. I loved every minute of this game. Excellent, deep story with controversial religious overtones that kept you guessing the whole way through. The combat system was fantastic (for the humans and the Gears). It just got everything right IMO. I am eagerly awaiting Xenosaga.
    Vagrant Story is another excellent Square game that does not get allot of attention. The complex and intricate combat system is very appealing and you can spend hours just trying to create different weapons. The story is very well written and plays it very nicely during the course of the game. I hope Square is smart enough to release a sequel to this excellent title. (although I heard it did not sell well)
     

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