What's so good about Panny RP91? (1 Viewer)

[Jake T]

I appreceiate all the replies. Thanks for your help.
Jake T

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Phil,
tell me more about the Malata DVD-N966. Did you see it? Read a review? Is it some weird Asian import type thing or something one can "buy over the counter" in the U.S.?
-dave

 

[Brett G]

how do native 1.33 discs look on 16:9 sets? Is there scaling on full-frame material?

It doesn't scale 1.33 discs really, but it will put them in a 16:9 window with black bars on the side. This allows the TV to stay in full mode, and gives you black bars instead of grey (which most TV use for 1.33 material).
Phil: That player sounds interesting. I don't know if those features would have any real use except for anamorphic material that is less than 1.78:1 (which is extremely rare). Side cropping should simply not be an option. The RP91 has no chroma bug, so these new scaling options are the only things it has going for it at the moment. Of course, there may be other reasons to go for it over the RP91, but I definitely wouldn't choose it just for these advanced scaling options. Pretty intriguing, though.
-Brett
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[DanG]

Actually it scales 1.33:1 quite nicely. I tried it on two DVD's. NAXOS DVD-Video audio disc of Vivaldi Four Seasons, 1.33:1 non-anamorphic and shot with HiDef cameras and the second was the AVIA setup DVD.
With both, setting the 4:3 Aspect to NORMAL will fill the entire 16:9 screen. Using ZOOM aspect stretches the picture vertically by 10%.
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[Brett G]

DanG,
Can you explain this a bit more. What do you mean by scaling, in this instance? Are both of the titles full frame (4:3)? When you watch these discs as mentioned above, is the aspect ratio unchanged (which is impossible, I think), or is it stretched horizontally.
I'm not arguing, I'm truly curious. How does this scaling differ from non-anamorphic widescreen (which is really 4:3)?
Thanks,
Brett
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[DanG]

quote: Originally posted by: Brett Glasscock
Can you explain this a bit more. What do you mean by scaling, in this instance? Are both of the titles full frame
(4:3)? When you watch these discs as mentioned above, is the aspect ratio unchanged (which is impossible, I think), or is it stretched horizontally.
[/quote]
You know Brett I keep forgetting when I make these posts about the RP91 that I am in the minority with a 16x9 RPTV. The majority of DTV users are 4:3 owners and by observations obviously wouldn't have much relevance for them, as the scaling modes seem to be reserved for 16x9 sets.
Bear with me as I try to present my observations in a format that you can clearly see what I did. DAMN I have to get a Digital camera again!
First I used the AVIA(1.33 NTSC DVD) overscan pattern so I can quantitatively explain what happens. In case your not familiar with it, here is a shot of the overscan pattern:

First thing I did was to put the RP91 in interlace mode and cycle the overscan pattern through the my RPTV aspect modes.
The four numbers represent the percent of overscan for all four sides of the picture.
*********ZOOM
****OFFSCREEN>15
7************************ ******5
****OFFSCREEN>15
*********FULL
**** *********3
6**************************5
**************6
*******JUSTIFY
**************3
5**************************5
**************5
Now you understand why I don't like TV generated ZOOM modes. They spread out the convergence lines to vertically scale the image and it ends up looking ghastly.
Then I put the RP91 back to progressive and changed the aspect there. In SHRINK mode, the image was 4:3 with vertical black bars. NORMAL and ZOOM are 16x9 full screen images.
********SHRINK
**************4
2**************************0
**************4
********NORMAL
**************4
5**************************5
**************4
*********ZOOM
**************15
5**************************5
**************15
Qualitatively viewing the NAXOS disc it translates to what the numbers show. In NORMAL mode the people look slightly vertically compressed. In ZOOM mode they appear a more normal "NTSC" height. I hope this helps.
By the way, since I had hardly any takers to a previous post I made, I've decided to ask it in my replies.
When your RP91 laser head moves large distances across the DVD, say from promo back to start of the movie, is it totally silent?
Dan
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P.S. "Movies are always in the dark just because thats the way they were intended to be viewed"
Where's your backlighting?
[Edited last by DanG on July 25, 2001 at 11:59 PM]

 

[Robert Dunnill]

If you have a 16:9 display, there are no alternatives

A good HTPC should do as good or better on scaling as the RP91, provided the disk is properly mastered.
BTW after less than two months, my RP91 went on the fritz (I hope the problem is covered under warranty). Now my HTPC is the only means I have of playback.

RD

 

[Brett G]

Dan,
I have a 16:9 display as well. I am probably wrong about this, but I don't consider what you are describing to be scaling. In my mind, scaling is the process of changing the resolution of an image without changing the aspect ratio. You are probably right, though. That probably is considered scaling as well. Your process takes the place of FULL or TW mode, much like scaling non-anamorphic discs takes the place of a zoom mode. Like I said, in my mind it is not scaling if has makes the output disproportionate. Nevertheless, the RP91 will manipulate 4:3 in different manners as desired.
Oh, and when my RP91 makes large laser jumps, it is not totally silent. It is not very loud, but I can hear it.

A good HTPC should do as good or better on scaling as the RP91

I won't argue with you there. I was mainly talking about stand-alone DVD players. Going the HTPC route costs quite a bit more and is more cumbersome, but like you said, if you have a specific need they can be quite effective (and worth it).
-Brett
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[Eugene Hsieh]

I posted this in the online Panny 91 purchase thread, but then I thought it'd be more suited for here. Note that I just got this today.
This thing is better than I thought. I have a direct view 34" widescreen with built-in line doubler, and the image out of the Panny is superior. And, my Toshiba locks into widescreen mode when it gets a progressive signal, so the aspect resizing function of the Panasonic is welcome even though it's only mediocrely implemented (limited sizes, subtitles get cut off). Also, the presence of both an optical out and coax digital out is a life saver. (I will not buy a DVD player without both.) I hate the menu system. Complicated, and the icons suck. But it's certainly better than my Apex.
My all region version of Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon had lots of MPEG artifacts on both my cheapo Apex and on my RCA. They are much less noticeable on the Panasonic when properly set up.
And of course, I'm listening to MP3 on the thing (off CD-R) at the moment.
Hmmm... what to do... that now brings me to 5 DVD players in my 2 bedroom townhouse.
P.S. I picked up an electronic rice cooker (Panasonic/National SR-MM10N) at the same time. I swear, this thing is more complicated than some of my stereo equipment. Goes well with my Samsung vacuum cleaner though.
Oh and I almost forgot. When I drove home, I came across a Corvette with "Paradigm" as the licence plate. One of the owners/employees of this illustrious company???

 

[DanG]

Quote:

"Paradigm", eh. Obviously your located to the south of the Great White North
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[Eugene Hsieh]

quote: I know the audiophiles look down on MP3's, but some of those 256K ones sound pretty good.[/quote]
Actually, I find the format superior to MiniDisc, yet many are keen on MiniDisc (except for the true purists of course). The problem with MP3 is the rip quality and the encoding method so proper procedures must be followed to ensure reasonable quality. Furthermore, good systems definitely bring out the deficiencies of MP3, and even at 256 or 320, MP3 can sound mediocre or even outright poor if not done properly.
In any case MP3 is a convenience format (like MiniDisc), and as a convenience format it is excellent. However, the Panny is clearly not suited for MP3 (and that's fine). It simply plays them, as if an MP3 disc were a super long CD, but that is problematic for navigation esp. when one has 150 songs on one CD-R.
quote: "Paradigm", eh. Obviously your located to the south of the Great White North[/quote]Eh? I actually live in Toronto. Not sure if it's the Paradigm we all know. There are a lot of companies with that name around here.
Anyway, back on topic. I wish the Panny were stronger built, and it had more flexible sizing options for progressive mode aspect ratio. Furthermore, I wish it had a button on the remote for this, and didn't require me to navigate through the menus (which suck IMO) to correct the aspect ratio.
However, given the picture quality and overall features, I'm quite happy with the sub-US$500 (tax-in) price I paid. And I love the Champagne colour.
[Edited last by Eugene Hsieh on July 27, 2001 at 08:59 AM]

 

[Robert George]

...the aspect resizing function of the Panasonic is welcome even though it's only mediocrely implemented (limited sizes, subtitles get cut off)

There is a vertical scrolling feature when the RP91 is in "zoom" mode for non-enhanced letterboxed material. The image can be shifted up to accomodate subtitles.

 

[Eugene Hsieh]

There is a vertical scrolling feature when the RP91 is in "zoom" mode for non-enhanced letterboxed material. The image can be shifted up to accomodate subtitles.

Yes, but what I was expecting was that the subtitles would be independent of the vertical scrolling. ie. No matter where the image was shifted, the subtitles would still be on screen. I suppose I'm just being picky, especially since this resizing feature doesn't even exist on most other players, but I'm guessing this would not be a a big problem to implement in future models though.
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Eugene Hsieh, VisorCentral FAQ Editor
1000 km on a tank of gas??? Check out the Prius and drive the future now!

 

[Wayne_T]

Eugene, I have used subtitles on several disks because we are trying not to make too much noise after the little guy goes to bed. I've not had any falling off the screen. They always seem to be in the same place. I think there is a menu setting that allows you to lower/raise the subtitles without moving the picture.
Re: Paradigm license plate, I didn't think we could use that many letters.
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[Eugene Hsieh]

Eugene, I have used subtitles on several disks because we are trying not to make too much noise after the little guy goes to bed. I've not had any falling off the screen. They always seem to be in the same place. I think there is a menu setting that allows you to lower/raise the subtitles without moving the picture.

I assume we're both talking specifically about when using zoomed screens to better fit some 4:3 shows on a 16:9 TV. If that is the case and what you said is true, then I've simply missed the settings. I find the menu system counter intuitive so that may be the reason.
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Eugene Hsieh, VisorCentral FAQ Editor
1000 km on a tank of gas??? Check out the Prius and drive the future now!

 

[Mark Zimmer]

With all the good things people are saying about this player, I would probably run out and get one, if the zoom feature had a setting for 1.66:1 nonanamorphic discs so they would fill the height of a 16:9 display and have narrow bars at the sides. But until that happens, I'll wait for an upgrade. Still paying off the 16:9 anyway.

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"This movie has warped my fragile little mind."

 

[Jeff Leigh]

From what I have read, the way subtitles are displayed is a matter of how they are encoded on the disc. Some subtitles are encoded in the letterbox region on non-anamorphic discs and will get cut off when the picture is zoomed to fill the whole screen. Hopefully discs like that are rare.
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[Matt_Stevens]

Is it possible tp play 1.66:1 Non-Anamorphic discs on this player, on a 16x9 HDTV, in actual 1.66:1?
In other words, instead of using the HDTV's zoom, making it 1.85:1 and cutting off picture, can you put the HDTV in 4:3 mode and use this zoom function on the player to zoom in slightly to a 1.66:1 image?
Am I describing this correctly? Hope so.
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www.deceptions.net/superman

 

[DanG]

Panasonic really should have chosen a better term than ZOOM. My Toshiba 5109 zoomed, my Panasonic 16x9 HDTV zooms, while my RP91 does not zoom, it SCALES.
Name a few 1.66:1 non-anamorphics and if I have one in my collection I'll try it.
As everybody knows by now, the RP91 is very astute in scaling 1.85 and 2.35 non-anamorphics to anamorphic size and geometry.
I found it curious though in what it did to my non-anamorphic 1.33:1 DVD's. It scales them to full screen. If you use "ZOOM" (ugh) it will stretch the image a little more vertically than NORMAL mode. The manual is very vague in this regard.
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[Matt_Stevens]

How about TRUMAN SHOW or UMBRELLAS OF CHERBORG?
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