What may drive hirez acceptance... (1 Viewer)

[Lee Scoggins]

And finally, why do I have the feeling that if I committed to hi-res, I'd be left at the altar by studios--fearful of piracy--withholding my most desired recordings? (The same plight awaiting HD-DVD, I'm afraid.)

Perhaps you are reading too many pessimistic threads on the internet.

I think the copy protection afforded by hirez is what makes these new formats attractive to the record business. Sure, it will eventually be hacked to, but at some point down the road. I have heard more than a couple record execs point to the copy protection as a big plus for hirez.

I think they also see the ability to "churn" back catalog out to new formats for extra profit is attractive as well. And that also applies to new HD-DVD obviously.

 

[ElevSkyMovie]

Columbia Records' Aware label has announced that the new album by rock singer John Mayer entitled "Heavier Things" will be released in separate CD Audio and Multichannel SACD editions on September 9, 2003. This makes the album the first Sony Music "day and date" CD and SACD release.

Does this mean the SACD won't be a hybrid? I don't want to have to buy the ablum twice. *wallet cringes*

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Does this mean the SACD won't be a hybrid?

No, it is a HYBRID SACD.

 

[Angelo.M]

Angelo, I am curious what would drive you to add hirez?

If they stopped pressing redbook CDs tomorrow, then maybe! Kidding aside, I don't envision using a multichannel setup for music listen anytime soon. I like to listen to music critically, on my dedicated system, in my office at home, where two speakers is all I'm going to deal with. So, thinking only of hi-rez, 2-channel mixes, I'd have to say that I can't truly think of a reason to make the jump. I'm happy with the vinyl and redbook software I have. Yeah, maybe the SACD of Patricia Barber's Cafe Blue sounds a bit better, but the redbook sounds pretty damn beautiful to me. Lee, I don't dispute the enhanced resolution of SACD/DVD-A, I just don't see a need to replace software that is perfectly adequate for me.

 

[Marc Colella]

I think the copy protection afforded by hirez is what makes these new formats attractive to the record business. Sure, it will eventually be hacked to, but at some point down the road. I have heard more than a couple record execs point to the copy protection as a big plus for hirez.

Copy protection is not a selling point to consumers, and is actually a deterent.

Why would consumers want to move to a new audio format that provides little difference in sound quality (best case opinion of the average consumer) but can't be ripped/copied?
Where's the incentive?

Now before someone responds with Hybrids as the solution, I have to ask where the incentive is for the labels to move to hybrids for copy protection since the CD layer can still be ripped?

 

[Michael St. Clair]

One could argue that there are already 2+ million players in existance therefore Super Audio is already at the laserdisc level you previously mentioned.

What are they using these players for? Boat anchors? With 234,000 total high-res software titles sold in over half a year, they sure as hell aren't listening to music on them!

I'm sorry, but your assertion that current high-res beats the zenith of laserdisc is laughable. It wasn't unusual to see a Camelot records store give 10%-20% of their floor space to laserdisc software inventory. Virtually every major new picture was released on LD within months of the VHS release...and sometimes day-and-date.

High-res is near-invisible compared to laserdisc, and anybody who lives in the real world knows there aren't millions of high-res consumers and that the overwhelming majority of stealth-hybrid buyers have no freakin idea that there is something special about their disc...until they try to play it in their PC or DVD player and it locks up.

 

[Philip Hamm]

High-res is near-invisible compared to laserdisc, and anybody who lives in the real world knows there aren't millions of high-res consumers and that the overwhelming majority of stealth-hybrid buyers have no freakin idea that there is something special about their disc...until they try to play it in their PC or DVD player and it locks up.

I'd be willing to bet that 99% of the owners of Sony DREAM systems have never bought and will never buy any SACD software other than stealth hybrid inventory. My brother has a Dream system and he hasn't even cracked the shrink wrap on two of the three free discs they sent him. The only SACD other than the one Aerosmith track on one of the SACD bonus discs that he's even heard is Dark Side of the Moon and only because I brought on a visit out of curiosity.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

My brother has a Dream system and he hasn't even cracked the shrink wrap on two of the three free discs they sent him.

I think its dangerous to extrapolate too much from just one personal experience.

I am sure part of the 2 million players is for primarily DVD use, but it still counts to have the equipment out there. As the format grows, those not listening to SACD may find a title they like and already having the right gear makes for a low barrier.

 

[Angelo.M]

I would have personally preferred single inventory but this could be a "big selling" pop title and single inventory may have proven challenging from a production standpoint.

"Could be" a big seller? Lee, I think it's a close to a sure bet as you'll find that Mayer's next album is going to be big, bigger than Sting's newest I daresay. Would have been a perfect opportunity to put a SACD into the hands of millions of folks.

Can't argue your point about the production logistics. But, really, there seemed to be more than enough DSOTM discs around when it was released. Granted, Mayer's album will be much, much bigger in terms of sales.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

Well, that makes around 5% each...and the 10% to 20% of laserdiscs at a Camelot Records back in the day was 10% to 20% of the whole store...music, movies, t-shirts, posters, accessories. It wasn't unusual to carry more laserdisc than VHS, because the latter was largely a rental medium.

As the format grows, those not listening to SACD may find a title they like and already having the right gear makes for a low barrier.

That's a totally different argument than the one claiming high-res is bigger than laserdisc. People with laserdisc players specifically had to seek out and buy a player, it wasn't included as a hidden bonus feature in something that they might buy anyway. Because of that, they used the product and bought software for it...you don't pay $300-$1500 for a player and then not use it.

I agree with some of what you have to say, but not the high-res >= LD argument. High-res has a way to go to be a niche that large.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

Oh, and there was no big wait for Star Wars on laserdisc. It came out in 1982, same year as CED and VHS.

Eventually a small grass roots group of loyal fans created a big enough marketplace for the studios to start releasing big films. I still remember how big the Star Wars Trilogy was.

???

 

[Brian Perry]

10% of my local Best Buy is a selection of DVDA and SACD.

Really?

 

[Rachael B]

LD was a smashing success in Asia. SACD isn't a smashing success anywhere in particular yet. I did market research about LD back in the early 90's. The estimates I got then were all in the 2 -3% range of homes. Needless to say, I didn't open an LD rental store.

No matter how many people have players capable of playing SACD's, my quesstimate is that less than 0.5% of consumers actually buy SACD's, knowingly. SACD might actually be relatively successful, for it's age, if it even had 3% by now.

 

[BrianB]

10% of my local Best Buy is a selection of DVDA and SACD.

You mean 10% of their CD section floorspace, right?

 

[Justin Lane]

"Could be" a big seller? Lee, I think it's a close to a sure bet as you'll find that Mayer's next album is going to be big, bigger than Sting's newest I daresay. Would have been a perfect opportunity to put a SACD into the hands of millions of folks.

Once again goes to show how Sony is shooting themselves in the foot. We have seen Lee spout over and over again like a broken record the benefits of single inventory discs, increasing foot traffic in the CD section, etc. etc., and now it appears Sony themselves does not believe in this hybrid strategy. Universal similarly does not believe in this strategy, replacing zero of their redbook releases to date with Hybrid counterparts (Sting may change this record at least for one disc). This tells me Sony is taking a very guarded approach to SACD, it is not about to bank the farm on its success.

J

 

[Rachael B]

Lee, why do so many folks aggree with my accessments on this thread and not your's???

 

[ElevSkyMovie]

High-res is near-invisible compared to laserdisc, and anybody who lives in the real world knows there aren't millions of high-res consumers and that the overwhelming majority of stealth-hybrid buyers have no freakin idea that there is something special about their disc...until they try to play it in their PC or DVD player and it locks up.

So if I get the new John Mayer SACD, it won't play in my pc? What about my dvd-audio player, will it recognize the cd layer? This sucks...

 

[Dan Stone]

we seem to be on a pace of 1,000 new titles per year in Super Audio lately

If that's accurate, and the total number of high-res software titles (BOTH DVD-A and SACD) sold in over half a year is a staggering 234,000 copies, then what does that say about the unit count sold for each of these 1,000 titles?

That's downright anemic, and I would say it's still got quite a ways to go yet to even consider being close to the levels that Laserdisc obtained.

 

[Bill Cowmeadow]

At the recent So Cal HTF meet visit to DTS (I was there), this was exactly the sentiment of the cheif execs of the company. They quoted the number of blank CDR's Best buy sold last year vs the number of redbook cd titles. You had better believe this will be the main driver for Hi-Res titles.

Bill

 

[Marc Colella]

At the recent So Cal HTF meet visit to DTS (I was there), this was exactly the sentiment of the cheif execs of the company. They quoted the number of blank CDR's Best buy sold last year vs the number of redbook cd titles. You had better believe this will be the main driver for Hi-Res titles.

But how do hybrid SACDs counter piracy?

I can still rip the CD layer. Why is everyone ignoring this fact?