What may drive hirez acceptance... (1 Viewer)

[Jack Briggs]

John, I remember The Perfect Vision suspending publication, but I certainly don't remember The Abso!ute Sound shutting down temporarily.

Ah, the old magazines. For in-depth reviews of recordings of serious music, High Fidelity was hard to beat. Its equipment reports, though, often mimicked Stereo Review's: Neither publication ever met an amp they didn't like.

Audio was the most technically in-depth of the mainstream magazines, and I loved Edward Tatnall Canby's eccentric essays (and Bascom H. King's fine amplifier reviews).

Then you had what we then called the "underground press." TAS, before it started accepting manufacturers' advertising, was irregularly published (sometimes coming out once or twice a year). At its lowest ebb, Stereophile (while still under J. Gordon Holt) was a digest-size, black-and-white publication printed on non-coated woodpulp stock (even the cover wasn't coated).

So, as I said earlier, audio as a hobbyist persuit never has been that big with the public. A Sony Walkman is all that many think they need.

They haven't heard of SACD and DVD-A. CD is "state of the art" as far as they are concerned. So, this crowd will be hard pressed to be convinced of their "need" for SACD and DVD-A.

 

[Jack Briggs]

BTW, I have the first thirty issues of The Abso!ute Sound is abso!ute mint condition. The first issue is protected by plastic. Wonder if many people out there would want something like that. To read about a time when the Dahlquist DQ-10 was the American speaker to beat. The Audio Research SP-3 and D-60 and D-120. Dynaco PAT-4s and PAT-5s.

Oh, what a time...

 

[Lee Scoggins]

They haven't heard of SACD and DVD-A. CD is "state of the art" as far as they are concerned. So, this crowd will be hard pressed to be convinced of their "need" for SACD and DVD-A.

Jack, but shouldn't we push for wider hirez acceptance if we do not want to limited to an MP3 world?

I am curious...Do you have hirez playback ability in either DVDA or SACD form?

If yes, what do you think?

Also, do you think hirez will never gain wider acceptance? By wider I mean beyond audiophile and hardcore music fans, not fully mainstream.

By the way, I used to own every Stereophile since 1987 and every journal has had a coated cover and first class appearance since then. I can't speak to issues before then. I do remember the days of classic Audio Research gear like the SP3, but I think we are also in an Audio Research Golden Age today with the new EH tubes and VS110/Ref2Mark2 amps.

 

[Angelo.M]

Neither publication ever met an amp they didn't like.

And Rolling Stone has never reviewed a mediocre album that it couldn't find a way to give 3 stars. Off-topic, but I couldn't resist...

 

[Angelo.M]

CD is "state of the art" as far as they are concerned.

We should be so lucky. MP3 is more likely their "state of the art," and iPods are the accessory-to-have.

 

[Seth--L]

Not to sound like a troll, but unless you have a study that you can share with us, comments like that mean nothing.

 

[Carlo_M]

Music is something to have on while you are doing something else.

Unfortunately true - and given today's quality of "mainstream" music, is it any wonder? But it's a chicken and egg scenario. Which drives which? Does the mediocre/poor state of pop music desensitize the listener? Or does a less attentive listener make for disposable but flashy pop?

(And yes I know that there's plenty of good music out there to be found - I've got my current faves too - but I'm talking about most top-40 stuff these days)

For the boy bands & Britney, MP3 is about all you need. Sure as hell don't need SACD/DVD-A for her.

 

[Lewis Besze]

A couple of weeks ago Music Direct sent me a link to an article,regarding some take on SACD and Hi-Rez music in general,from some unnamed recording studio people.Besides the fact that they didn't wan't to spend a lot of money to accomadate DSD in their gear, they also said that LP still outsells both DVD-A and SACD combined.
If that's true there is much to be done,to make this a commercially viable format let alone mass acceptence.

 

[Thomas Newton]

You may doubt that Super Audio will gain mainstream acceptance, but the opposite extreme is bleak.

Who wants to be left only with lossy downloadable music like MP3s?

This is a classic fallacy of the excluded middle. You have repeatedly ignored the existence of Red Book Audio CDs.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

This is a classic fallacy of the excluded middle. You have repeatedly ignored the existence of Red Book Audio CDs.

I have not ignored it-in fact I was talking about "the opposite extreme" and responding to specific MP3 discussion.

I simply feel that redbooks are not really high fidelity enough for music lovers and they don't provide enough copy protection for the music business.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

A couple of weeks ago Music Direct sent me a link to an article,regarding some take on SACD and Hi-Rez music in general,from some unnamed recording studio people.Besides the fact that they didn't wan't to spend a lot of money to accomadate DSD in their gear, they also said that LP still outsells both DVD-A and SACD combined.

Lewis,

Can you provide a link to the article?

Also, the fact that overall LP may outsell hirez formats may be an indication of more title coverage which is understandable as that is a previously established format. The more relevant comparison is how LP is selling on the same titles where an SACD or DVDA may be available. Even in that case, it does not indicate that hirez is not doing well, only that vinyl is doing better.

As far as commercial viability of Super Audio, we would have to know more information such as:

1. How much profit is there for Sony/Philips in the pro gear business.

2. How much profit is there in software royalties.

3. How much profit is there in hardware sales and royalties.

4. How fast this profit pays back initial investment and what return on capital parameters Sony expects on new formats.

 

[Justin Lane]

Even in that case, it does not indicate that hirez is not doing well, only that vinyl is doing better.

Vinyl certainly isn't taking the world by storm. Actually for a sales and availability standpoint vinyl is in a terrible state. If SACD is doing worse than vinyl, then it is in worse shape than I expected as a format.

J

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Justin,

I just found this really cool site (courtesy of Audio Asylum) for Sony products that shows the new 555ES player.

It looks like Sony is upgrading prior ES players with better technology.

http://www.agoraquest.com/print.php?sid=155

 

[Marc Colella]

And the rapid growth of DVDs suggest it is more convenient than a video tape.

Lee,

with DVDs it's a different situation.
DVDs are a great convenience when compared to other video formats, and just in general - since most people aren't going to watch a film on the go. Audio on the other hand needs to available in abudance wherever people go. There's a great convenience to having ALOT of music avaiable for you wherever you are. CDs and SACDs do NOT offer that convenience.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

There's a great convenience to having ALOT of music avaiable for you wherever you are. CDs and SACDs do NOT offer that convenience.

Those with portable players may disagree.

The ipod is a cool product, but I think it is difficult to create a device like that that preserves payment to the artist for his good work. I think it is just too tempting for people to steal with the MP3 format. This is why I think the labels are looking to do something different than CD or MP3.

I'm glad you are just ripping CDs though and not file sharing.

 

[Angelo.M]

...just because people like MP3s doesn't mean they steal them.

Absolutely. I have an Alpine mp3 player in one of our cars, and we love the convenience of copying several albums worth of music to a CD. But I've never downloaded or shared an mp3, and I wouldn't. Doesn't make me a saint, just goes against how I feel about sharing music.

 

[Bill Cowmeadow]

Just how pervasive is copying music?

True story...

I was at the car wash two weeks ago and the gentleman in the bay next to me was done washing and was working on the interior of his car. I did not know this guy from Adam. I asked him the title of the music he was listening to at a moderate volume level because it was familiar to me. America, Anthology, he said, would you like me to burn you a copy?

Now if a total stranger finds it appropriate to offer copies of music to me, things are out of control.

I actually bought an America CD from walmart later that evening.


Hi-rez will happen, and I think it will occur over night when it does.

Bill

 

[Rachael B]

Lee, I just caught up on this thread. You are so detached from mainstream thought. I think it's time for an S & M session. In a half hour I'll have you begging to listen to some MP3 files of the New Kids Who Can't Rock.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

I'm not convinced that 90% of MP3 users are pirates. I know several people who rip their own CDs to their PC hard drives to listen to at work, and to iPods and other portable players to listen to on the go (at the gym, jogging, on business trips, etc). I only know one person who downloads unauthorized MP3 on a regular basis, and he quit after these most recent RIAA/Kazaa lawsuits.

Gathered, these people are all professionals, not high-school and college kids with little disposable income.

Luckily when I was younger Clear Channel hadn't killed radio yet and you could sample good, new music on the radio. I think the death of quality radio certainly contributes to piracy among the younger crowd.

 

[BrianB]

I simply feel that redbooks are not really high fidelity enough for music lovers

So to love music, one /must/ be an audio snob? Not everyone is in a position to pour thousands into their audio equipment. Hell, frequently not even hundreds. That doesn't mean they love music any less than you do.

I think Rachael's bang on the money.