What is the most "accurate" color temperature

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by SteveK, Mar 11, 2002.

  1. SteveK

    SteveK Supporting Actor

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    A common feature on most newer televisions is the "color temperature" selection. On my Sony Wega, I have a choice of "warm", "neutral" or "cool". According to the manual, "warm" gives the whites a reddish appearance, while "cool" gives them a bluish appearance. The manual doesn't say what "neutral" does, but my guess is that it doesn't tint the whites at all.

    As stated in the header, which of the three color temperatures is most "accurate" in terms of the overall color spectrum. I realize this may vary by television, but which of the three settings is likely to produce the most accurate colors (not just whites, but all colors)?

    I've tried all three, but am not totally satisfied with any of them. Neutral seems to be the best, but sometimes the whites look somewhat ghostly. Also, would I need to redo the calibration if I select a different color temperature?

    Any recommendations would be sincerely appreciated.

    Steve K.
     
  2. ChrisMatson

    ChrisMatson Cinematographer

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    I have my XBR450 set on "Neutral." The most important thing may be to properly calibrate your set using AVIA (or Video Essentials) with a red filter to accurately set color and tint. I think that most people state that "warm" is closer to the standard 6500K temperature, but I find that to be too red for my set. I believe that each TV is slightly different coming from the factory, so unless you mess around with service menu items the best bet is to do a proper calibration and set it up so it pleases YOU.

    -Chris

    BTW--I calibrated all three temperature settings and all of the "Modes."
     
  3. SteveK

    SteveK Supporting Actor

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    Chris- Thanks for the prompt reply. I've sent a PM with a followup question.

    Steve K.
     
  4. Jeremy Engel

    Jeremy Engel Extra

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    I use the warm setting on my 36hs20 but I also adjusted the red push in the service menu. At first it took a little getting used to but now if I switch to neutral or cool it is way too blue. Try each for a week or so and see what you like best.
     
  5. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    The NTSC system defines a neutral white to be D6500K ...

    In the Sony ... this is supposed to be the warm mode ... NTSC standard.

    It's only a reddish white because you are too used to seeing blue whites ...

    If you had 2+2=5 pounded into your head all the time ... when someone tells you the correct answer is actually 4 ... not 5 ... suddenly 4 doesn't seem right either ...

    Regards
     
  6. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    It should be noted also that most mass-produced televisions have the NTSC-neutral 6,500-kelvin setting labelled as "Warm."

    FYI: All these color temps are wrongly labelled--"Cool" is in truth very hot (blue-white, as in way high; we call it "cool" because people associate blue with cool); "neutral" is also usually very hot; and "Warm" is the coolest.
     
  7. ChrisMatson

    ChrisMatson Cinematographer

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    Old post...

    I switchhed to Warm and recalibrated with AVIA last night. I'll give it a week to see how I like "warm" as opposed to "neutral."
     
  8. Rod Melotte

    Rod Melotte Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm confused - show me the error in my thinking. Why not calibrate everything using neutral. Then won't your colors be correct?
     
  9. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    Because, Rod, television manufacturers simply don't tell the truth, pure and simple. "Neutral," in the vast majority of mass-produced sets, is still blue-tinted and off the NTSC scale for the most part. For example, in the WEGA owner's manual, Sony does label "Warm" as the NTSC 6500K standard, despite its being called "Warm." It's psychology; the OEMs are telling their customers what they think they want to hear.
     
  10. Guy Kuo

    Guy Kuo Supporting Actor

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    Typically, the warm setting on a consumer set is the one closest to the standard D65 color for grayscale. Unfortunately, even those are considerably off compared to a the actual desired D65. I'm afraid a fair number of people will try the "warm" setting and decide that the color is off kilter. The natural conclusion would for most people be that since the "warm" closer to D65 looked bad then D65 isn't that big of a deal. That's just not true. Those sometimes badly tinted "warm" settings don't give you a real impression of how amazingly relaxed and natural feeling a D65 calibrated set creates for the eyes. There is a certain, affinity for the image that happens when white balance is corrected. The rest of the colors fall into place. Unfortunately, only the very few who have had their displays professionally calibrated with instrumentation ever get a chance to experience that type of quallity of imaging.

    Bottom line, yes, you can try the "warm" setting and it will most certainly be less blue than the usual modes on a TV, but it is still likely to be not quite the real color of gray you are trying to achieve.
     
  11. Rod Melotte

    Rod Melotte Stunt Coordinator

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    The WARM/COOL settings are just labels that are put on different temps right. And if you calibrate your HT using AVIA (or what ever) why even worry about the bogus WARM/COOL settings.

    I'm just trying to understand this whole concept of those settings. Am I wrong in thinking that they are only for people that do not want to bother calibrating?

    Sorry for being anal but as I was calibrating last week these very questions came up in my amazingly small brain.
     
  12. Guy Kuo

    Guy Kuo Supporting Actor

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    Rod, those warm, cool, neutral settings affect the underlying grayscale. They don't alter the same things as the controls you are setting using the basic video section of AVIA or HTT. Think of those like changing the tint of a lamp lighting up a painting. You can make some pretty significant changes to how the pictur looks by changing the coloration of the lamp. The user controls then are like altering the paint with which the picture is drawn. They both affect the picture, but in different ways.
     
  13. Rod Melotte

    Rod Melotte Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks Guy - that's interesting and corrects an error in my thinking, makes sense.

    thanks
     
  14. ChrisMatson

    ChrisMatson Cinematographer

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    I have to report that I am now happy with the "Warm" setting on my XBR450. I recalibrated with AVIA (needed minor adjustments only) and gave myself a little more than a week with the new settings. I watched Training Day last night, and the colors all looked very natural. Now, if I switch back to "Normal," the picture does seem a little off.
     
  15. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    As was stated earlier, many people need to get used to an accurate color temp, conditioned as they are by watching televisions in torch mode. But once you're used to accurate gray scales, there's no going back.
     
  16. SteveK

    SteveK Supporting Actor

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    I think I may be getting accustomed to the "warm" setting on my Sony Wega now too. I used to prefer neutral or even cool on some programming, but now the "warm" looks acceptable. So either I'm getting used to it or it has less red push than it seemed to have just a few weeks ago when I first bought the set. I'm not saying it's perfect, but it does seem much better than it was before.

    Steve K.
     
  17. Robert Mayrand

    Robert Mayrand Stunt Coordinator

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    What would be the best setting for a samsung set?
     
  18. MikeyWeitz

    MikeyWeitz Supporting Actor

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    If you have a TSL series Sammy like I do, warm is the setting for sure.
     
  19. Robert Mayrand

    Robert Mayrand Stunt Coordinator

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    Actually it the TXL, but i think it's just the next generation.....so it should be about the same!
     
  20. MikeyWeitz

    MikeyWeitz Supporting Actor

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    The TSL is the HDTV, I think the new ones are TSM, the TXL is non flat. non hdtv right?

    My guess would still be the warm setting.
     

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