What are the rules... (1 Viewer)

[Chris PC]

Immaturity is crappy. I once spoke to a younger woman about going rollerblading and she stood me up. Called her from a pay phone and probably caught her off gaurd. She made up some talk about some crap about going somewhere and I just said "OK then, bye" and hung up. Kinda weird because I was really pissed off but not upset cause I didn't have any feelings for the person yet, they just interested me. I basically got over that in about 15 minutes

 

[MarkHastings]

Immaturity is crappy.

I once met this younger woman at a restaurant. She was the hostess and my friend kept saying that she was "checking me out". I didn't believe her (my friend) so I ignored it. She kept insisting I say something, but I still refused, finally my friend went to the girl and asked for her number (for me). She was more than thrilled to give it to me.

Anyways, I called a few times and got her answering machine. After a week went by, my friend asked how things went and I said that I gave up because I couldn't get hold of her. She told me to try one more time, so I called and this guy answered. He said that the girl moved away to another town...Whatever! I called my friend back and told her the story. She thought it sounded suspicious and decided to try the number herself...She called and the guy answered...when my friend asked for the girl, the guy said "Hold on" and put the girl on the phone...My friend made up some story about a wrong number and hung up.

Talk about immature. What the hell was THAT all about???

p.s. I have a couple other stories that are even MORE mind blowing, but I don't want to hijack the thread.

 

[Tom Meyer]

my immaturity story:

Met a girl at a New Years Eve party, musta been 1993 or 1994. I was 24 or 25, she was a year younger. We went out a buncha times (~10-12) in the next 6-8 weeks or so and shacked up a couple times as well (tho didn't have sex). Around late February, the return phone calls stop coming for some reason. One day I got a hold of her at work and after she waffled about going out again, I was like "So, should I really be bothering with this anymore ?" and she said "well, probably not". She apparently had met someone else, so whatever.

What galled me was the fact that she said she had just *left me a message on my home answering machine* saying the same thing. I mean, only the most immature idiots do that sort of thing after seeing someone for more than a date or three and for me, the phone message strategy ends after you see someone naked. Needless to say, when I listened to the message, I left *her* a message saying how immature and juvenile I thought she was.

 

[Jared_B]

p.s. I have a couple other stories that are even MORE mind blowing, but I don't want to hijack the thread.

Hey, I'd love to hear 'em!

 

[MarkHastings]

I'd love to hear 'em!

Ok, here's another:

I worked with this girl (when I was in college) and we seemed to hit it off. I'll never forget her name "Veprore"...it was beautiful and so was she. I forget who asked who, but it was kind of a mutual "wanna do something sometime?" deal. She had asked me to call her on a Saturday. I called her and her sister answered and said she wasn't there and to "try back later". I called later on and her sister answered again. I asked where Veprore was and she didn't know and said I should call back tomorrow.

I called on Sunday and still no sign of her. So I waited 'till I saw her at work (later on in the week). She said she had gone to her best friends place and spent the weekend there. She apologized for not being around and told me to call her again the upcoming weekend. I called a few times the next weekend with the same results (I never actually got a hold of her), so I gave up.

The next week, I was walking through campus and I hear my name being called. It was Veprore, she seemed really excited to see me. I asked where she was and she said that she was around all weekend and didn't know why she didn't get my messages (I didn't realize at the time, but OBVIOUS lie!). So she said she'd definitely be around the next weekend and that I should call.

Now, being the sucker that I am, I called one last time. And guess what? NOTTA! So I finally gave up.

The next week I see Veprore at work and I ask where she was and she gets all psycho on me...this next part threw me for the biggest loop and I kid you not when I tell you that she said "Stop harassing my family!"

WTF??????

p.s. I'll let that experience sink in before I break out the others

 

[Aurel Savin]

I once met this younger woman at a restaurant. She was the hostess and my friend kept saying that she was "checking me out". I didn't believe her (my friend) so I ignored it. She kept insisting I say something, but I still refused, finally my friend went to the girl and asked for her number (for me). She was more than thrilled to give it to me.

Mark ... this sounds like the same thing that happened to me recently.

There is a great little restaurant in my neighbourhood where I went with a dozen friends or so for my birthday this past November. Saw this great new waitress there that was super attentive to my needs all night and my friends were all teasing me about her. Very good looking Czech girl!!

Going back there a few weeks later, with a friend and his wife for lunch, we saw her again and could not help feeling that we were checking each other out across the dining room. She actually sat down next to us as the place was pretty empty and we managed to invite her to a party at my house the next week. She agreed to come and gave me her number. I called her a few times during the next week to shoot the shit and she was cool and excited about the party.

Well the day of the party comes and she is asking me if she can bring a roommate .. i said no problem as I figured she would feel more comfortable this way. Well I went to pick her up and it turns out the roommate is a GUY. That was a shocker! Bummed me out for the whole night as she was really hanging out with him and talking to him in Czech.

Anyway, next few days roll by and I decide to call her and ask her for a date ... just me and her. She agrees and seems very excited about it. We go out and have a good time and seem to have a lot in common. She was actually born the same day as me and we can almost read eachothers mind.

I call here a few times days after the date and I get the infamous roomate on the phone saying she is not there and he will pass the message along. Noting for a few days.... Call again and this time the voice mail comes ... leave a message and nothing still! Almost 3 weeks pass and she calls me out of the blue and asks me out for a date! I was surprised to say the least ... WTF! But I agree anyway as I want to see what happens. At this point I like this girl but I already do not like the games here and have this don't give a shit attitude!

We go out again and we have an even better time. She is really easy going, but she mentions to me that she has a BOYFRIEND but he is an a-hole and is racist and all this good stuff. Now, I am wondering why am I here on this date? So I ask her .. as I am not sure what is going on. She tells me she likes me and liked my company last time. Date ends on a good note.

A few days later is New Years Eve and a few friends, we go to the restaurant to party. My friends have this tradition to go to church at midnight and I decided to stay with her for the midnight festivities and even invited her to go to a dance party after hours in Manhattan. She says no to that .. which is cool as I diod not give her advance notice.

Still waiting for my friends to come back from the church and while this is happening she asks me if I can give her a ride to this party she is going to a few blocks away! Ok .. I bite .. just waiting here and doing nothing anyway. So I go to the party and drop her off and she does not even have the dignity to ask me in for a drink ... as it is New Years and all! She just gets out and says Good Night ... That really got my blood boiling .. and that was the last I went out with her. No need for inconsiderate people.

Since then I went back to the restaurant a few times as it is a regular hangout and she is super attentive now to me and constantly craving attention and trying to start converstaions with me... but I had enough of her, no matter how good she looks.

Whew ... had to get that off my chest.

 

[Martin Fontaine]

Yeah, me too I've been treated pretty badly by girls. The last one I gave up after a few weeks because I'm pretty sure she wasn't interested.

I was at Future Shop some day last summer to buy 2 CDs and while there was some weird problems with the computer system not recognizing the UPC Code I chatted a bit with the cashier and then I asked her if she heard of the 2 singers I just bought CDs of and she said no, and then asked about the band I was wearing a T-Shirt of and again no, and she mentionned something about not knowing much about music and that it would be cool if someone made her discover some good ones. Being a bit in a rush that night and that one of the 2 CDs was not being recognized by the system, I told her I'd come back the next day to buy it. So I offered her to give her a few recommendations on artists to check out and she gave me her name so I could just ask for her.

So I came back the next day, but she was very busy so she just took a piece of paper and wrote down a few names I gave her. I offered to come and see her after she finished work but she said she was busy that night. Fine, I didn't push it...

Then I came back the next week to buy a DVD at the same place and she was there, this time answering the phone so it was easier to have a longer conversation with her in between calls. So that was cool, but again, she seemed to insist on not giving me her number, or taking mine, nor seeing me other than at her job.

So for another 3-4 weeks, I could speak to her for like 3-4 minutes as I was buying CDs and/or DVDs and again, no chance of seeing her other than at her job. So I came to the conclusion that she was either:

- Not interested in me.
- Found me annoying but couldn't tell me off since insulting a customer would result in her losing her job.
- Probably has a boyfriend, and was waiting for me to develop feelings for her until the perfect timing where telling me about him (or worst, introducing me to him) would be the most painful.

So I gave up, never went to see her again.

Anyone think I did right or did I missed an opportunity there?

 

[Philip_G]

Anyone think I did right or did I missed an opportunity there?

no, not at all.

 

[MarkHastings]

Aurel,

I hear ya! I went out with one of those girls. There was this girl (a year older than me) who grew up in my town, but moved a few states away for a few years. She (Mary) met this guy and they dated for a while. He was a real A-hole to her and she was knew she was with him more for the security than for love.

A few years goes by and her father dies and she moves back home (my town) to take care of her mother. Since she's SO far away from her boyfriend, she starts thinking that maybe it's time to dump his ass and move on.

I was set up with this Mary through a mutual friend. My friend figured Mary needed to go out with someone "nice" so she could see what a loser her boyfriend was. We seem to hit it off really well. My friend told me that Mary was so excited to actually be with someone who didn't treat her like crap. Things were going well (she even mentioned to my friend that she was ready to dump her old boyfriend), but when I wanted to progress the relationship, she said "No, I can't...I'm still with (whatever his name was)". I was kind of devastated, but I said I'd stay friends with her (hoping she'd realize what a jerk this guy was and dump him), but things got worse.

She drove all the way down (a few states away) to go see her boyfriend and he basically saw her as an inconvenience to his golf game and made her sit around his apartment while he golfed all weekend long.

After I heard this, I was realized that she was too screwed up in that relationship and that my kindness was being wasted on her.

About a month later (after not talking to her), I saw her at a bar with my friend...I TOTALLY ignored her the whole night. The next day she CALLS me! She was actually turned on by the fact that I ignored her all night. I realized that this girl was so used to being crapped on that she thrived on it. She was practically begging me to go out with her again, but I refused...

About a month later, she got married to the jerk.
Whatever!

 

[Martin Fontaine]

no, not at all.

To what? The "I did right"? Meaning that I did wrong or the Missed Oppurtunity meaning that I didin't miss anything?

 

[Philip_G]

no, I think she was being pretty clear. No missed opportunities there. You tried.. it didn't work out, no big deal

 

[Chris PC]

Wow,

I don't know whether to call those good stories, or really bad stories, or good horror stories. They all sound so familiar.

Here's what I can say. Try not to go after someone because you "think they like you" and count on them liking you. They may appeared to, and maybe they did or do, but things change. Go after someone because "YOU LIKE THEM". Once you turn that around, if they irk you, you can walk away because you no longer LIKE THEM.

Also, communication is pretty messed up sometimes, its not the getting the answering machine or the other person that should annoy you, its the personal communication that is bad that should annoy you. I haven't the greatest communication with a younger friend of mine I kinda like, and she has a boyfriend. I asked her out not knowing she had a boyfriend, and there was some delay in communication, but eventually, she became a reliable communicator, even if just by email. This maintains my interest because she is reasonably decent for someone with a boyfriend, even if I suspect she is avoiding getting together. I've eased off and there is no friction really and things are open and fairly even tempered. Maybe she'll marry this guy, or maybe they'll break up some day, but at least she's treating me fairly. Her loyalty to her boyfriend is rather attractive too. I only worry she thinks I want her to see me behind her boyfriends back and that would suck for her to think that. Anyways....

Anyways..interesting stories non-the-less.

I would like to make a commitment here and see how many others would be interested in joining me. My commitment is to make more inquiries, more advances, plain and simple, asking woman out who I find attractive. No waiting, no humming and hahhing, just asking them out. The more the better. And making the effort to not be affected as much by whether or not I think they like me. That is a confidence issue and woman like confidence. When they sense you are unsure they like you, they read that as a lack of confidence. Gotta relax and trust that your liking them is enough to have them make a go of seeing if they like you. Sounds weird, but it makes sense.

Markhastings,

Wow. that story is a good case in point. I'm amazed when us guys can actually use our brains and not fall into a trap where we are actually in a situation where we have the "upper hand". That kind od stuff is only useful for sex I guess. If you did go out with her because you ignored her, she would have needed to thrive off of you're being an assho$% or she'd leave because you;d turn out to be a decent guy. Either way, what is, is.

One thing is for sure....don't think of being the nice guy, as that wastes time. Being nice is fine, but the nice guy gets taken advantage of and we don;t want that. I don;t even know exactly how to achieve this, but we don't want to be the "Nice Guy", but being genuine decent people who aren't asses who treat gurls/woman like crap, we are the "Good Guys" I'd rather be known as a "Good guy" than a "Nice Guy". Can anyone relate?

 

[MarkHastings]

we are the "Good Guys" I'd rather be known as a "Good guy" than a "Nice Guy". Can anyone relate?

I hear that. Once a woman says I'm a 'nice' guy, I know it's the kiss of death.

There's a Budwieser commercial (the "TRUE" campaign) where the "nice" guy is sitting around a bunch of women and they all keep telling him how they want to find a "nice" guy. He tries to tell them that he is a "nice" guy, but they ignore him and act interested in his "loser" friend.

I ALWAYS have that same experience. I have this friend who I am SO attracted to, and one day she was complaining about guys to me and said "Why can't I just find a nice guy like you?" I eventually asked her out, and she replied "but we're good friends" That's what always happens when you are too nice, you never get past the 'good friend' point.

 

[Aurel Savin]

Now that we completely hijacked Jared's thread

I think being yourself is the most important thing. I am a "nice guy" but not to impress girls. I am just nice to women This has been my downfall a few times, but then again it helped me in most of my relationships more than not.

I am not nice to the point of being a pushover, I just treat women nice. Actually when I play the aggressive a-hole type, which I have done on occasion it never works and my BS comes right through ... hell even I don't believe me

That being said, I think everyone just is attracted to a particular type of person. So you can only be who you are ... in my case this Czech chick was into the a-hole, frat type of guys, and I think she liked guys that treated her like shit. Being with a nice guy is unfamiliar to her and hence scary ...

 

[Chris PC]

As a responsible hijacker, I'll qualify this tangent we're on as being related to the "worrying" that guys do. Worrying about when to call is trying to plan life too much. Worrying what is right and what is wrong. If your plan is to get laid, then ask someone else, as I don't know the calling rules for that. But if you're interested in someone in a genuine way, then you call them when you feel like it. I'd say it should vary. Call the day after if it feels right. Don't call for a few days if you're busy and don't have plans or if you feel like not calling.

But back to being a "nice guy".

Its not easy, but here are some examples of maximizing your attractiveness to woman. I imagine the nice guy thing is a guy tries to be nice in order to receive attention and positive interest, or so that woman will agree to go out with us when we ask, and continue to date us and be interested in seeing us more in the future. What is better is to think of things more generally. Treat men and woman equally in terms of "being nice". Don't favour woman too much and be too nice to them. Be a good friend to both men and woman. Also, be a good friend to yourself. If you find yourself doing too much, feeling like you are a pushover, try to turn the tables and see if you'd expect what you are doing, of someone else. If you are good to yourself, you'll find yourself doing good things for people, for the woman you're interested in or find attractive. This is good and its important to attract a genuine woman who isn't into jerks, but you'll have those moments when you think, "no, I won't do that, that's asking too much from me". Not doing too much and not being too nice will get you respect. Its a fine line, but I'm working on it. Just use common sense. Don't do too much for a woman you like because she'll take you for granted. I think the above is good info and observation, but putting it into practice isn't so simple. You have to think about what you're doing a little more often.

Any of the above make sense?

 

[Jared_B]

I would like to make a commitment here and see how many others would be interested in joining me.

I'm in! Perhaps we should have a thread were we can all post our experiences - kind of a support group. You just asked out a girl? So tell everyone how it went. I think we might be able to learn from the experiences of others.(working on a cute one at the supermarket myself )

 

[Chris PC]

Wow. I like the commitment idea now that someone responded. We should frame it. Let's not make it too much of a contest. Let me think about this. I for one wouldn't want it to turn into a "I asked out another woman two days ago and had another one night stand! I rule!". Although I personally doubt I'd have that problem myself I still think its not in the spirit of my original idea. Here is how I thought it may work:

The commitment - You commit to personally acknowledging the woman you find attractive and you act on your attractiveness by asking them to get together with you, meet you for coffee, or do whatever. The explanation above means that you want to act on the people you are most attracted to. Admit your attraction and go for it. You want to go for the people who normally make you perhaps a little nervous etc, or the ones that give you a "feeling". You could do this thing here and ask out people you don't find particularly attractive, although you don't find them "un-attractive", but thats not going to have the same result, but its good practice? Perhaps this will give you some good experience. The idea here though, is to act on the ones you want to ask out the most, the ones you feel the most attracted to.

The reason for doing all this is to realize that we only live once, and we want to minimize the "I wonder what could have happened"? We want to get rid of the "What if's"? We want to improve our odds of meeting someone and get better at asking woman out, at dating and generally communicating and spending time with woman we are attracted to. You don't have to spend each and every day seeking out woman to ask on dates.

So all you have to do on here is agree that you will make a concious effort to ask out woman that you meet who you find attractive. You don't have to report the fine details here, just whether you made and effort and whether it went anywhere, positive or negative. Having brought this up, I will commit to making an effort.

As far as asking people out, I think there are a few obstacles. The first is boyfriends, fiances and husbands. You gotta look for the ring of course, and even when its not there, you gotta assume there is a good chance the person you are attracted to has a companion. If they are not married or engaged, they are fair game, but the catch is, you won't get as far asking them out on a date. Obviously, try to find single woman, but they are far and few between, so if you eliminate the ones with boyfriends, you are limiting yourself. When woman are in a relationship, they still shop, no matter how honest and loyal they are, they are smart, they look around and pay attention to other options.

So with this in mind, I would suggest that people adapt "asking out" methods according to your gut feelings and the situation. If you are going to participate in the resulting thread because you hope to find a secret recipe to asking people out successfully, I'd say don't bother. Who knows though, maybe you'll find out what is more likely to get a positive response and what is normally not so great an approach. The circumstances are probably going to be too varied to draw many generalized conclusions.

Having said that, I don't recommend asking if a woman has a boyfriend or is married, but maybe thats not a bad idea, maybe you find out with an indirect question. Otherwise, one decent option is to ask woman out for coffee, to grab something to eat, do something together or attend an event together. Asking to "take them out" is a date and actually implies that they are single. Sometimes you may be wise not ask them "out on a date" or to "take them out" offering to treat them and pay for them up front. Use your own judgement. If you're 100% sure they're single, then that may be fine, but if they are in some degree of a relationship, some gray area, "chat over coffee" or "getting together for lunch" may work better. Plus if they are in a relationship, you don't want them thinking you're trying to get them to see you behind their companions back and cheat on them.

So thats my idea for a "commitment to asking people out thread", and some more of my input. I don't even know if I feel comfortable looking for people to date right now, as my life is in flux job and career wise, but maybe thats not a good reason to wait. My life is always going to be going through changes, why wait?

So what do you folks think?

 

[Chris PC]

Maybe just make a personal commitment and come on here if you like to type about it. A big commitment on here would add pressure I think. Just make an extra effort in 2003 and feel free to report about it here. We'll see who starts the first thread as a direct response to this "personal commitment"

 

[Jared_B]

Totally agree, Chris. You can't just go around asking out every hot woman you see. I try to do as much research as possible before asking anyone out on a "date". With the most recent one (the original post in this thread), our conversation turned to what we did over the weekend. The weekend in question happened to be Valentine's Day, and I asked what she did on Friday. When she said she didn't do anything, I was fairly safe in assuming she wasn't involved. I think more casual questions like this work great. You can slip them in and not sound too obvious. On the other hand, this method requires a little more time.

I think my version of "the commitment" will be this: Ask out (or ask to coffee) the girls who I'm definitely interested in, but wouldn't normally have the nuts to ask out.

 

[Chris Lockwood]

> Ask out (or ask to coffee) the girls who I'm definitely interested in

Yeah, get the number, call her, invite her to something casual like coffee, & save dinner for later dates. It's a waste to take someone you've just met to dinner.