What a Sony rep told me today about MPEG/VC1.

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Frank@N, Oct 8, 2006.

  1. Frank@N

    Frank@N Screenwriter

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    A Sony rep was at my BB today, so we talked about a wide range of topics but the most interesting was MPEG vs. VC1.

    He told me that MS requires studios who want to use VC1 to produce movies for HD DVD (and then they can use it for Blu-ray if they want).

    Since many studios don't want to support HD DVD, VC1 is out for them.

    The rep said Sony was working on it's own codec, but that they were a long way off from completion (!).

    Until then, they would switch to dual-layer discs so as to avoid having to compressing sound or video (!).

    He agreed that MPEG was out of date as far as compression goes, but that they could use it simply to play uncompressed video with no downside other than disc space used (!).

    He said uncompressed 1080p + uncompressed audio would easily fit on a 50GB disc and no one would ever care about MPEG because the A/V would be top notch (!).

    MPEG only hurt them on single-layer because they had to use it for compression, he said (!).

    I have no clue if any of this is true...
     
  2. Robert Crawford

    Robert Crawford Moderator
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    If true then how come Disney and Fox are producing BRD with VC-1 without supporting HD DVD?
     
  3. RobertDW

    RobertDW Stunt Coordinator

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    Not really true. MS can't require anyone to produce HD DVD titles. The thing is the MS encoder was designed for HD DVD authored titles and later on they (Microsoft) added a utility to convert a HUD DVD stream to a BD stream. So to author a BD titles with the MS encoder one must first author a HUD DVD then use the utility software to convert that to a BD title. Now if they (studios) wanted to use the HUD DVD transfer they could but no one if forcing them to do that.
     
  4. GlennH

    GlennH Cinematographer

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    Please correct me if I'm wrong, but MPEG2 is still compressed video. I don't think even a 50GB Blu-ray disc could hold uncompressed video for a full-length movie. Uncompressed multi-channel PCM audio yes, video no.
     
  5. RobertDW

    RobertDW Stunt Coordinator

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    True but they could increase the video bit-rate to fill the 50GB disc and should be able to at least match the picture quality of a VC1 encoded 30GB HD DVD. For audio they would be much better off (disc space) if they used DD+ or even TrueHD but the problem there is no BD players decode the newer audio formats yet.
     
  6. Rob Zuber

    Rob Zuber Auditioning

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    This is close, but not quite correct. A studio can target BD (say with BD's higher bandwidth or capacity), and so not end up with an encode that is compatible with HD-DVD. Amir discussed this at the AVS Forums.
     
  7. RobertDW

    RobertDW Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes I know but it didn't seem prudent to cloud the issue with more tech than necessary. [​IMG]
     
  8. ppltd

    ppltd Producer

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    I would believe that the lack of use of VC1 by Sony is more to the fact that they would have to pay a royalty to MS.

    Thomas Eisenmann
     
  9. Michel_Hafner

    Michel_Hafner Screenwriter

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    Of course it's compressed. By a factor of 50 to 100 usually. Most studio master tapes are compressed too, but much less.
     
  10. Frank@N

    Frank@N Screenwriter

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    Whenever I speak to industry reps, it's often fun to see how much they can get wrong.

    I knew this guy was dropping bombs all over the place, but it was a fun chat.

    How also went on about how Samsung tried to block the PS3 because Samsung was the primary developer of BR and was suppose to have a large uncontested BR player launch window.

    Sony got around that by arguing that the PS3 was a game machine which happened to be based on BR discs, not an actual BR player.

    The Sony guy said that Samsung knows things about BR that even Sony hasn't figured out yet.

    He also appeared very worried about whether the PS3 would work or not (!).
     
  11. Sean Bryan

    Sean Bryan Sean Bryan
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    Wow. That rep certainly had a great deal of shit coming out of his mouth. Hope he brushed his teeth after spewing that crap.
     
  12. Hayes Preston

    Hayes Preston Stunt Coordinator

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    Well pretty much everything he said about "uncompressed" video is just plain wrong. By definition, a video codec is an algorithm whose funtion is compression and decompression. All video on DVD, HD DVD and BD is compressed.

    The Sony rep has no understanding of the basic concepts of digital video media.
     
  13. PeterTHX

    PeterTHX Cinematographer

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    Well, actually they are using AVC or MPEG2, they are the only studios (besides LionsGate and Sony/Columbia/MGM) not using VC-1.

    The studios that support both formats, Warner & Paramount, use VC-1 on HD DVD...so far Warner is the only BD studio using VC-1. Paramount's titles are MPEG2 at this time.

    Since MS is the largest shareholder in HD DVD (other than Toshiba) it's possible that this is true, though unlikely.
     
  14. Fredster

    Fredster Stunt Coordinator

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    Or co - coder, dec - decoder
     
  15. Mike Williams

    Mike Williams Screenwriter

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    As a television program editor, I can tell you that uncompressed video is roughly 1 GB per 1 minute of video.
     
  16. Andrew Bunk

    Andrew Bunk Screenwriter

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    According to the Blu-Ray reviews at DVDtalk, many of the WB Blu-Ray discs are using VC-1. Is this true?

    I was under the impression no one was using VC-1 with Blu-Ray yet. Is it because those transfers pre-existed for HD-DVD?
     
  17. ppltd

    ppltd Producer

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    Frank, I am not shoting the messenger here[​IMG]


    Sure you do. Like politicians, Marketing reps can not help themselves. They normally have the body functions of the upper and lower body reversed. Genetic defect I think.[​IMG]
     

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