Warner Bros. – We Want A Richard Donner Re-Cut of Superman II (1 Viewer)

[Kevin Skinner]

A Richard Donner version of Superman II.
To be quite honest, that would be an absolute dream come true. There are so many treasures out there somewhere in regards to footage of Donner's Superman II, before being replaced by Richard Lester. As great as Superman II already is, it is my firm belief, and MANY others out there that Donner's Superman II would more than likely blow it out of the water. If all of the Marlon Brando footage could be found and legally incorporated into the film, and other footage as well, seen on international broadcasts, and tightly edited, and perhaps with a new score (that may be asking for too much, but as long as we're asking), Superman II: Donner's Version could be one of the best motion pictures ever made.
Warner Brothers, if you are indeed reading these posts, you are sitting on a gold mine. It would be VERY easy to release Superman: The Movie into theaters, and a few months later, release Superman II, and do it the way Fox did it with Star Wars, touting the never before seen footage and enhanced effects and the likes. The test run in San Antonio means nothing. These films would do HUGE business. With Smallville hitting high ratings, Superman is once again in our culture, and to release the first two and the BEST Superman movies would be to your benefit, and to ours. Please, Warners...think about it. And keep us informed. It would be a dream come true to see these two movies on the bigscreen, the way they should be seen. Thank you for your time.

 

[Sherry Z]

Please seriously consider re-editing this film. I can think of approximately 500 people who would buy a copy.
The timing is perfect for this film, perhaps to even go into theatres, again.

 

[RandallKing]

Another copy sold!
The reason Superman II is half the film it is is because Dick Donner's vision (and some footage) found its way into the second film. Also, Tom Mankiewicz's great writing, Geoffrey Unworth's brilliant cinematography, and the work of many other talented people left over from the first film. (Take a look at Superman III and you'll see how talented Lester is.) To be fair, Lester was given the difficult task of finishing someone else's story and vision on Superman II.
Along with other people who have mentioned this, I'm willing to pay much more money if needed (to tackle legal hurdles associated with Lester, Brando, etc.).
We want this, WB!

 

[James Christie]

Woah!!!! This is the most amazing thread ever!! So much so it inspired me to post for the first time! It's this kind of thing that really makes me believe in the magic of movies, that makes me believe that dreams can come true. To think of all that lost footage sitting in a film can at Pinewood Studios, and to think it represents a whole different/alternative magical world to the Superman myth is almost too much to bear. A Donner re-cut of Superman II would be simply awesome!!! We only have to look at what a stunning piece of work was done on the Special Edition STM to glimpse at the potential of this new project... Films just aren't made like this any more, epic films and classic storytelling!! A re-cut of Superman II would right one of the biggest wrongs in Hollywood history IMO. If Donner could have finished his masterpiece I think the franchise could have rivalled - neh - surpassed the popularity of the Star Wars franchise. Hope I haven't rumbled too much but from the way this thread is going it looks like I'm not the only one who would love to see this! Sure - it might not be cheap, but how many more times can Superman II be re-sold as it is? It is badly in need of a lick of paint, and with the love and attention that was shown to it's predecessor it could become the classic it was always ment to be. Not to mention a new money spinner with the potential to run for years. Put me down for a dozen copies if it will help make it happen!!!!!!!

 

[Todd K]

This would be a good movie made great. If Donner had actually completed his version of Superman II, two two films together would have been unstoppable. This is a chance to rectify the situation. He wasn't able to fully complete his filming, but with new seamless branching technologies, a DVD release would be great. His footage outshines Lester's every step of the way and deserves to see the light of day. He put his heart and soul into the filming of those two movies.

 

[Kenneth s]

I am in complete agreement that taking the time and money to restore all of Richard Donner's footage would be a truly important cinematic achievement. To see that vintage Marlon Brando footage is the stuff that dreams are made of. Everyone wants to see it of course, but the question is the money. Even the time it would take to re-edit in all of Donner's footage that is sitting in a can in London is not the issue.
The key to making money from this is to play up the Marlon Brando footage. His death scene must be extraordinary and this needs to be stressed as an IMPORTANT piece of our cinema heritage. Brando dying for his son, Superman, the greatest comic hero of them all.

 

[James Christie]

I couldn't agree more! This would be quite simply like no other Special Edition or Director's Cut ever! We're not talking about a couple of minutes of extended scenes - we're talking about sensational footage featuring one of the greatest actors that ever lived. This simply cannot be left to rot and lost forever. This is a chance to make movie history - and introduce some movie magic to the MTV generation! A Richard Donner Superman II would blow away a lot of people's minds. Might even help launch a new Superman movie franchise. I think with all the technology that is now available, it would be cheating the fans for this not to happen. True film fans have a hell of a lot of respect for companies that brand and associate themselves with these kind of restoration projects, that's for sure. Also, the press certainly within film circles) would be amazing!

 

[AdamC_B]

Yes this is an absolute must Warner Brothers, I think that Richard Donners footage put into Superman II could well make the film better than Superman The Movie. I am sure that there is so much unseen Donner footage that a theatrical release must also be considered. C'mon Warners, please make this happen.

 

[TrevorSH]

Add one more to the list of buyers if a Superman II:SE is released. I've already purchased the 4-DVD Box Set, but I'm willing to spend again on a Superman II:SE DVD if Warner Bros. is willing to go the distance and release a "Richard Donner re-cut".
The Richard Donner vision of Superman is the best to date in my opinion. What was intended as a fantastic two-part epic was horribly altered and a potentially great franchise essentially lost its way when Donner was let go. The epic feel was discarded and we were left with mere sections of Donner and "creative consultant" Tom Mankiewicz's insight, in a mix of awful humour and awful edits. This is a chance to "re-write" history, so to speak, and finally offer the fans what they all know to exist and what they've all been longing to see - the remnants of Richard Donner's vision of 'Superman'. These film elements ("missing scenes") are sitting in some vault collecting dust. It is time to show the world how a great movie should be, and what a great a movie 'Superman II' could have been...
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A.K.A. "Kryptonian" on the SupermanCINEMA message boards
[Edited last by TrevorSH on October 24, 2001 at 02:48 PM]

 

[Anthony_H]

Another vote to see Donner's cut...hopefully before I die...

 

[chris w-c]

Almost there, keep the posts coming for good-quality re-cuts.
*knows Jacob will be happy when we reach 100*
-Chris W-C

 

[James Pine]

A Richard Donner re-cut of Superman II would be great! And, actually, this movie should be more in demand than the Special Edition of Superman: The Movie, because even with the added scenes and improved effects its still essentially the same movie the fans have always loved. But, a Superman II with completely different (and better scenes) would be awesome, a must have! And, I would hope that with enough support for this project and the adoration fans have for the first movie would convince the producers which direction they should take with the brand new movie that's been in the works for quite some time.

 

[TheBat]

this is going much faster.
JACOB
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The #1 Unoffcial Site Of Sarah Douglas
www.sarah-douglas.com
Please vote for the uncut version of Conan The Destroyer on dvd
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/002724.html

 

[John Koehler]

What more can I add to the argument PRO Donner? I won't hold my breath, but still I can at least hope to one day see HIS version of S2.

 

[James Christie]

I would love to hear some feedback from Warners. This post is really encouraging, I don't think I've ever seen so much enthusiasm or demand for something on a film message board before. This is something that clearly a lot of film loving fans want! (And are willing to pay for!!) I heard a rumour once that Richard Donner was approached to do a cut of SII during the work on STM: SE, but turned it down. I also heard a rumour that he was quoted recently as saying he wanted to give the fans the chance to see what they missed out on!! Dick Donner is a lover of film as well as being a director, he's one of the biggest enthusiasts or 'fans' of us all and has a true desire to provide magic and versimilitude in his movies. If he were to witness not only the demand, but the affection for this subject - it could really happen!!! Warner Bros please update us!

 

[TheBat]

here is part of an interview with actor jack O'Halloran. He played in Non in Superman 2. This is what he had to say about the problems relating to superman 2. I also posted the link for the complete interview. It was done by Steve Younis from the supermanhomepage.
JACOB
http://www.supermanhomepage.com/movi...ohalloran.html
Q: What was Richard Donner like to work with compared to Richard Lester?
Jack: It was great to work with Donner. Richard Lester was as big an @$$hole as the Salkinds.
Q: There are stories that Richard Donner filmed much of "Superman II" while filming the first Superman movie, and that it was later scrapped and the second film made. I have heard that the scrapped film exists but has never been shown. Have you ever seen any of those scenes? If so, can you tell us about the scenes that were in that film?
Jack: Richard Donner shot eighty percent of "Superman II", in fact we were so caught up in II they had to stop to finish one because of contracts on delivery of Superman I. The movie "Superman II" WOULD HAVE BEEN 1000 TIMES BETTER HAD THEY LET DONNER FINISH WHAT HE STARTED. And yes, I saw all the scenes, I worked in a lot of them, it was a great movie. What no one will tell you is that it was Donner's version that got Warner Bros excited about the film. Then the Salkinds f#%*ed everyone, Brando, Donner, Hackman... it was pathetic what they got away with. Trust me "Superman II" would have been a classic of classics had Richard Donner finished that movie.
Q: Is "Superman II" substantially different from the original Donner version? I have heard that it was not, and that many of Donner's scenes were basically reshot by Richard Lester. Do you have any insight as to why the Salkinds wanted a different version?
Jack: Yes your correct, the scenes were just reshot, but understand the look was different. Donner had a magic touch and was a great Director, Lester was a Television hack who did it as cheap as he could. Anyone ever tell you the story about when they shot the Eiffel Tower scenes in Paris? They took the Superman 50 million dollar project into Paris as a cheap western production because it was cheaper to shoot in the pouring rain rather than wait for a dry day... just to save money. Just look at the scenes when Margot was talking to the French policeman trying to sneak into the tower elevator. The windscreen wipers on the cars are working away and the drops were hitting the shirt of the police officer... it was horrendous what Lester did... all in the name of money.
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The #1 Unoffcial Site Of Sarah Douglas
www.sarah-douglas.com
Please vote for the uncut version of Conan The Destroyer on dvd
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/002724.html

 

[Paul P]

Count me in on this one. I would love to see the Donner version.
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There are [at least] 21 paths to the top of the mountain. If anyone says
he is on THE path, he isn't even on the mountain. --Jack Schwartz

 

[Conor R]

I totally want this. So does everyone I know. Jack O' Halloran (Non in STM and SII) even said himself that if Donner had to have finished it that it would have been the classic of all classics. Make this happen. The film will sell.

 

[Jaime_Weinman]

O'Halloran is way too harsh about Richard Lester. Artistically, Lester had a better career than Richard Donner -- Lester was a major figure in the cinema of the '60s (with Hard Day's Night and Petulia), while Donner has never really been anything more than a competent, likable director of bubblegum movies. The difference between Donner and Lester on Superman is not that Donner was great and Lester was a hack (though Lester had turned into a hack by the time he did Superman). The difference is that Donner cared about the movies and had a vision for them while Lester was in there strictly for the money, doing the ultimate hack job of stepping in for an unjustly fired director. The difference shows. It would be nice to see Donner's labor of love instead of the bastard child that passes itself off as Superman II.
Put in my vote for a Donner re-cut of Superman II.

 

[James Phillips]

It's clear that Warner Bros. have discussed the possibility of a Richard Donner re-cut of Superman II, and Donner has also recently expressed an interest in reinstating his deleted footage into the film.
The Superman II that exists today is an insult to Donner's original vision, and it would be a tragedy for Donner's footage to languish in a film vault at Pinewood Studios forever. Hopefully, Warner Bros. and Richard Donner will see the comments on this forum, and realize just how much (and how many) people want to see Donner's version of Superman II, and they will be persuaded to do what everybody here wants them to do, and release a restored version of Donner's film.
It's estimated that Donner shot approximately 80% of Superman II. This includes the Brando scenes, all the Fortress of Solitude scenes, all the scenes featuring Gene Hackman, the Daily Planet interiors, New York location footage, the interiors at Niagara Falls, and the White House scenes.
The scenes Donner didn't complete are believed to be the Super Villains arriving on Earth, the exteriors at Niagara Falls, Zod, Non, and Ursa destroying cities across the world, and the battle between Superman and the Super Villains in Metropolis.
Obviously any new version would include all of the existing Donner footage. The problems lie with the scenes Donner didn't complete. These are my thoughts on how a near 100% Donner version can be achieved:-
The original opening with the nuclear missile exploding in space releasing General Zod, Ursa, and Non should obviously be reinstated (the model effects for this sequence were possibly completed in 1977 or 1978 during the making of Superman, but could be recreated with either models or CGI), and incorporated into the existing scene of the Phantom Zone shattering.
Richard Lester's Mission Control scenes should have the "curl" scene removed. Also, in one of Donner's scenes on the moon, a thick black wire is visible under the Russian Cosmonaut's arm, which should be removed. Many scenes require wire removal work in this film.
If Richard Lester's exterior footage of Niagara Falls is all that exists, then only the first scene where Superman saves the boy should be included. The second scene where Lois jumps into the river should be removed, as it's a rehash of Donner's Daily Planet fruit stand scene.
If Lester's footage of the Super Villains arriving on Earth is used, the fisherman and the section where Non attempts to burn the snake with his X-Ray vision should be removed. These comic elements would seem out of place in Donner's film.
In one of the most sinister scenes in Donner's script the Super Villains encounter two Texas Rangers in a highway patrol car. The scene was adapted for the Ursa screen tests, and shows just how sadistic the character was intended to be. Unfortunately it looks as though Donner never shot this scene, which creates a continuity problem, as the scene leads directly to the Super Villains heading to Washington. If Donner could film a seamless new version of this scene with Terence Stamp, Sarah Douglas, and Jack O'Halloran, then it should definitely be included. In any case, the replacement scene with the Sheriff and Deputy in Lester's version should be removed, as it's too comedic, and doesn't advance the Donner storyline.
Donner's scenes of the Super Villains destroying landmarks across the globe should replace Lester's East Houston scenes, which Donner always said he hated.
It's believed that a large amount of special effects footage was prepared for this sequence before Donner was fired, including a plaster model of the defaced Mount Rushmore, and optical effects for the Moscow scenes.
The scene begins with General Zod stood on the point of the Washington Monument, informing the people of the world that he is now their ruler. There then follows scenes of fire engulfing Tokyo and the Kremlin in Moscow, Non flying over Paris and melting the Eiffel Tower with his X-Ray vision, and Ursa defacing Mount Rushmore. The scene ends with Zod destroying the Washington Monument.
Even if the effects footage wasn't completed, this sequence could still be recreated fairly easily.
Non melting the Eiffel Tower can be completed by combining model or CGI effects with flying shots of Jack O'Halloran lifted from other parts of the film. Possibly some of the Paris footage shot by Richard Lester could also be used in this sequence.
The existing effects of Mount Rushmore being defaced could be reused, and shots of Sarah Douglas landing and defacing the monument could be digitally lifted from another part of the film (perhaps from Lester's Fortress of Solitude scene), and placed into this scene.
It's necessary that we see Zod delivering his speech. If Donner didn't film this scene during his initial shoot, there are a couple of ways it can be recreated. Zod does deliver part of his speech in one of Lester's East Houston scenes, and it's likely that the whole speech was filmed and only part of it used. If that's the case then the footage could be lifted from this scene and placed into the new one. Another option would be for Donner to bring Terence Stamp back to film a new version. This isn't as unrealistic as it might at first seem. Stamp doesn't really look any older now than he did back in the Seventies, and with the correct use of make-up and the same soft camera filters used on Superman, he could look exactly the same as Zod, and it would give the scene a much greater impact. He should, at the very least, be brought back to record a new voice-over for this sequence.
The Metropolis battle seems fairly dull and small-scale in Lester's film, compared to the spectacular battle in Donner's script. Apparently, a large amount of model work was completed for Donner's version, including a scene where the Statue of Liberty is partially destroyed by Non. If this is true, the footage should be restored. Obviously, much of the existing footage would still have to be used, but it should be tightened and re-edited to remove the 'comedy' elements, and incorporate new special effects. For example, the shots of the man on roller skates etc, should be removed and replaced with new footage, such as the police cars and SWAT trucks being blown down the street into the distance. Much of Donner's original script could be restored by lifting shots of the Super Villains in action from Lester's East Houston scenes. There must also be several unused Zoptic and matte shots of Superman and the Super Villains that could be incorporated into this scene.
In Donner's script, during the scene where Lex Luthor and Lois Lane are being flown to the Fortress of Solitude on the backs of Ursa and Non, there's a hilarious section where Luthor's toupee gets caught in the wind and flies off his head! Since the scene features Gene Hackman, it was presumably shot by Donner and still exists. If that's the case, it should be reinstated into the film, replacing the Luthor double used in Lester's version.
The Lester scene where Clark Kent wipes Lois Lane's memory with a Super Kiss should be removed from the film. The question is, did Donner film an alternative ending with Clark and Lois? We know the original ending had Superman reversing time, and that Donner shot some Daily Planet footage for the end of the film where Clark is insulted by a man he bumps into, and remembers the bully in the diner. If Donner didn't shoot a different ending, perhaps the film should just end with Clark leaving the Daily Planet for his encounter with the bully. After all, Lois promised she wouldn't reveal his identity, so maybe she's as good as her word?
In addition, if John Williams could be brought back, either to compose new themes for the film, or to supervise a re-orchestration of his music from Superman, it would make a huge difference to the film.
Anyway, those are my thoughts on how a Donner version of Superman II can be completed. If all the Donner footage was reinstated, and the Lester footage pared down, I estimate we could end up with a film that's at least 95% Donner.
It's over to you now, Warner Bros. Please make it happen!
James Phillips
[Edited last by James Phillips on October 25, 2001 at 10:26 PM]
[Edited last by James Phillips on October 25, 2001 at 10:32 PM]
[Edited last by James Phillips on November 11, 2001 at 01:22 PM]