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Warner Archives in 2015, Take A Shot!

Discussion in 'TV on DVD and Blu-ray' started by Frank Soyke, Nov 25, 2014.

  1. Jack P

    Jack P Producer

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    I'm sorry but no one could ever with a straight face call CBS/Paramount's release of "Odd Couple" a case of "quality" and "correctly spending the money with all the music edits and butchery they did to the final three seasons, ruining a number of episodes in the process. At least with Warner, there is *never* a worry that I'll be getting edited content.
     
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  2. Dave Lawrence

    Dave Lawrence Supporting Actor

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    Cheers set - contains edits
    Laverne & Shirley set - contains edits
    Taxi set - contains edits
    Happy Days sets (except Season 1) - contains edits
    Odd Couple - contains huge edits (Jack described it best - butchery.)

    I'm not going to claim that Warner is perfect, but for someone to suggest that Paramount's approach is somehow a model of quality that Warner should strive for - and then list 3 examples of what NOT to do (edited episodes) - strikes me as more than a little odd.

    (Note: I own several of those Paramount sets, since I have no expectation that they will ever re-do them the right way, and something is better than nothing. But I know that the product is not ideal and that the company putting these sets out is opting for the quick, cheap approach rather than "quality work".)

    I prefer the Warner Archive approach. It's frustratingly slow at times, but they will put off releasing something rather than put out a set with edited episodes or a set that's missing episodes.
     
  3. Frank Soyke

    Frank Soyke Screenwriter

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    Honestly at this point i would rather them go on and release the detective shows with music replacements rather than waiting forever for them to realize they can't afford to pay the money for the rights to the music and not getting them at all.
     
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  4. mrz7

    mrz7 Second Unit

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    I have to say when Warner Brothers/Archive does release a t.v. show series....they do an outstanding job!!! But, like Frank said earlier, I am seeing the drop off as well. What I do hate about Warner is that they start off shows like "Falcon Crest" and "Alice" (in the archive program) and "Knots Landing" and "The Drew Carey Show" (in the retail front with a couple of season sets) and then they stop for years on end, and it takes forever to get a straight answer out of them. It's frustrating!! Now the four shows I mentioned, are not "one-hit season wonders".....they went on for years and were very popular. Maybe not as popular as "I Love Lucy", "Dallas" or "Batman", but popular enough to have loyal fan base for a full series release of these shows. I know there is a lot of factors the studio needs to make money to release a show on DVD (example, music clearances), but I thought that was part of the reason for the Archive program was develop......was to make some of the less popular shows "on demand" and on DVD-R's (although some shows like "Alice" were on pressed discs when first released) to save the studio money verses releasing these shows in retail. I find it very hard to believe it has taken this long for a show like "Knots Landing" to get released in the Archive program. Seasons 1 and 2 were released in retail (many moons ago.....2009 was the last release for 2nd season). Then retail releases stop due to low sales. Warner developed the archive program and started "Falcon Crest", and stopped at the 3rd season. Now "Knots Landing" has always had the issues of music clearances, especially Seasons 4-6 , where Lisa Hartman sang a lot popular 80's tunes....but what happened to season 3?....there is very little music to clear in that season, so why couldn't the Warner Archive program release this season while getting the rights cleared for the Seasons hard hit with music clearances? And what about "Falcon Crest"....I am not as familiar with this show as I am with "Knots Landing", but did "Falcon Crest stop with the releases because music clearances issues? Low sales? That is the only problem I have with Warner Brothers....you can't really get a straight answer from them for when a show is stalled on DVD? Once again, when Warner does release a t.v. show on DVD (or Blu Ray for that matter), they do an outstanding job. When "Friends" and "Batman" were released in complete sets on Blu-ray (and DVD) they rate up there and are really excellent collections!!! Warner did a great job on both sets. Even the seasons that "Alice" was released in the Archive program (seasons 1-4) and the sister show "Flo" (seasons 1 and 2) were all done very well. They were nothing fancy with extras, but the episodes were all in decent shape, lots of music were in many of the shows (Linda Lavin sang a lot)....everything was perfect!! But now, "Alice" seasons 5-9, are on hold....for probably years on end??? At least Warner Brother's is 100 times better than 20th Century Fox, who care very little about their t.v. catalog.....yes, "Lost In Space" was a rarity to be released on Blu-ray because of the owners of the show backed up the costs and a studio head really had a passion for this show. But like someone else said earlier, if it was up to 20th Century Fox alone, they would not have released the series on Blu-ray. 20th Century Fox doesn't even treat it's current t.v. series right. In fact, just recently, I bought "Empire" on DVD. I thought about buying it on Blu-ray, but I didn't because I didn't want to get stung again for buying a series on blu-ray without future Blu-ray of the series not being released (example...."Modern Family" which only seasons 1-4 were released on blu-ray and then stopped). However, I did buy "Gotham" (season 1) on Blu-ray because I knew it was Warner Brothers releasing it , and I know they will continue to release future seasons of their shows on Blu-ray!!! Sorry, for the long rant on this.....it's been a bad Monday for me, and I just needed to vent on this subject!!! :)
     
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  5. Jack P

    Jack P Producer

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    I think experience has demonstrated that if Warner Archive stalls a title it's for one reason only. The next season has a clearance issue. I already saw that "Dr. Kildare" went through more than a year's delay between S3 and S4 after getting S2 and S3 only a few months apart because S4 has a bunch of original songs in a "variety show" episode as well as a pop song for the three-part "Rome Will Never Leave You" episode. "Alice" I think as the years went on started giving us more "variety" episodes and Linda Lavin singing showcases that weren't as plentiful in the earlier years.
     
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  6. Neil Brock

    Neil Brock Producer

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    Really? CBS/Paramount owns all of the CBS/NBC & ABC shows as well as Paramount series. I think they own way more than Warner does.
     
  7. bretmaverick2

    bretmaverick2 Supporting Actor

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    WA, while not perfect, has let me get two complete Maverick series and get some other good western series that I probably wouldn't have seen otherwise.

    Sure there are a few other series I would like to see but I can't complain to awfully much
     
  8. Frank Soyke

    Frank Soyke Screenwriter

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    Depressing statistics for the second half of the year thus far on the vintage front. Since the June 9th release of Daktari, there has only been one pre mid 80's non animated release (Lawman-Season 2 on 8/25). If history is an indicator, they are about to go on haitus for the holiday in 6 weeks, so things are not looking good folks. The only older shows they have made any committment to complete are Medical Center, Kildare, and Lawman.

    While anything can happen, it at least appears that they may be heading the way of CBS shortly. Remember that before CBS stopped releasing stuff altogether, their first step in that direction was a steep dropoff in the classic releases. Don't know if thats the case here, buts let say it feel just a little too familier.
     
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  9. phenri

    phenri Second Unit

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    There is one major difference between the two studios, and that is that WB has a successful archive program, so they don't have to commit to as much as CBS.


    I think that WB has come to the point where they have not been able to clear as many obstacles to releasing some of their older shows, mostly due to music. Whether these are cleared in the future is anybody's guess.
     
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  10. Flashgear

    Flashgear Screenwriter

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    I'd just like to reprise a suggestion that other members have already offered here...IF this is the only way to release them...GIVE US THE WARNER TV DETECTIVE SERIES WITH CAREFULLY AND APPROPRIATELY SELECTED MUSIC SUBSTITUTIONS...at this point I almost don't care if the entire underscore is replaced with Warner proprietary music...as long as the theme and closing title music is original...it's also nice to have the fabulous remastering, but if that's holding up some B+W TV releases that already have very good 1980s and 1990s tape transfers...DON'T WAIT...I remember Neil Brock bemoaning the fact that perfectly serviceable TBS tape transfers of MR. NOVAK have existed for 25+ years...

    George Feltenstein is a good and honourable man, and we thank him for his driving and innovative initiative in establishing Warner Archive...I suspect it continues to bother him personally that one of the very first titles he mentioned upon the launch of WA was 77 SUNSET STRIP...unfulfilled after 6 years waiting for it...
     
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  11. Frank Soyke

    Frank Soyke Screenwriter

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    AGREE 100%. Just put em out already. Both 77 and Eye
     
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  12. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Lead Actor
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    Would love to see the Matrix Trilogy in a UHD Blu-ray / Blu-ray combo.


    UDH-Bluray

    3,840 X 2,160 resolution

    Dolby Atmos Remix and Dolby True HD or DTS X and DTS HD Master Audio


    Blu-ray 2D and 3D

    1920 X 1080 resolution

    Dolby True HD or DTS HD Master Audio


    If not then just a new blu-ray release with DTS-X or Dolby Atmos
     
  13. Neil Brock

    Neil Brock Producer

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    You're forgetting one little thing. Subbing music costs money too! All of the work involved is time consuming and costly. Not like they can just snap their fingers and just insert songs. Which, by the way, you are also talking about cutting because every episode of Hawaiian Eye, Roaring 20s and The Alaskans, has Connie Stevens or Dorothy Provine on stage belting out numbers. You can't just replace a song when the performer is singing it!
     
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  14. LouA

    LouA Screenwriter

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    In my opinion the shows would lose something without those ladies' performances.
    I wonder though, all of those musicals WB has released - everything from Busby Berkley , Mickey Rooney /Judy Garland to Elvis- they all lots of have songs in them .
    They are all out on DVD for many years now , and WB didn't seem to have much trouble getting clearance for the songs performed .
    Is it that the TV shows don't have the same status or priority, so they really don't rate the expense involved in clearing the songs ?
     
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  15. Frank Soyke

    Frank Soyke Screenwriter

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    The longer this goes, the more I'm feeling is that they overstate the music rights angle for the purpose of giving we collectors a "valid" explanation why this stuff isn't out yet. My personal feeling is that if they truly had any intent on bringing this stuff out, it would have been out by now. I think deep down they know the shows are too old and have a limited appeal to the buying public but they don't want to tell us that.


    Face it - This isn't like WKRP and Wonder Years where they probably had to break the bank paying for rights to Beatles, Hendrix, Zepplin, Dylan, Stones, etc. These are very old standards they are paying for. I'm sure they aren't going to get bankrupted on that stuff. IMHO.
     
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  16. bretmaverick2

    bretmaverick2 Supporting Actor

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    Here comes that dead horse I like to beat - I'm still waiting, impatiently, for the completion of the Maverick material with the release of YOUNG MAVERICK.
     
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  17. LouA

    LouA Screenwriter

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    Do you think 77 Sunset Strip has less commercial potential than shows like Bronco or the Dakotas? I really don't think so, and I'm guessing that the music clearance issue has a lot to do with the lack of releases for these particular shows .My guess is that WB doesn't think they'll get enough sales to offset the expenses that clearing various musical performances would incur. Sugarfoot with no clearance problems means a complete release for that program.
    I'm not holding my breath waiting for those 4 or 5 detective shows even t.hough I'd love to own them
     
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  18. Flashgear

    Flashgear Screenwriter

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    Good point, Neil Brock, I forgot those showstoppers...yes, I know compiling a new underscore would be time consuming and have it's costs...what happens behind the scenes at Warner Archive is a mystery with a multitude of factors coming into play, no doubt...the potential catalogue is huge and the fans are never satisfied...there have been a number of feature films also that seemed to have imminent release that they've drawn back from (Last Summer, among others)...I'm rather desperate to have 77 Sunset Strip in an official WA release...I just remember my nostalgia at rediscovering the better episodes of this series sourced from great quality 16mm, with the bumpers intact...maybe I'll have to settle for less than official...
     
  19. Randy Korstick

    Randy Korstick Producer

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    By all accounts I have read WKRP and Wonder Years were also not big money makers so I think they overestimated the potential market on those and spent a lot of money clearing music and making extras.Those shows have been in TV circulation for along time which takes away from potential Sales. I don't think you will see Shout rushing to do any releases like those in the future.

    77 Sunset and the other Warner detective shows have not had regular TV circulation so there will be a lot of blind buys for those shows based on reputation and word of mouth on the shows. I have heard about 77 Sunset strip for 20 years from family members but have never been able to see it. Plus there are the sales from those that originally saw the show and have been waiting for its release. I think sales for these shows are being underestimated but WA knows the sales potential which is why they are still working on releasing it. Their reasons are valid. There are others shows were they give a more final answer of : Clearance issues prevent us from releasing this. They are much more clear on their answers for the detective shows stating music clearance is needed and that they are working on it. If they were not intending to release them they would say so people would not keep asking about them. They wouldn't sell well enough for retail but I have no doubt 77 Sunset Strip would one of the top sellers or the top seller for WA.

     
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  20. Randy Korstick

    Randy Korstick Producer

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    Warner archive have been dropping hints about Hank so that can be added to the strong possibility list for early next year along with the previously hinted at Colt .45 and The Alaskans. So as others have said WA is a different model than retail studio releases and they release stuff as it is cleared so we have no idea if the next release will be a 50's, 60's 70's or 80's show. So its not really realistic to try and gage their releases because they are so random. They are still releasing classic TV so that's what really matters.
     

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