Video switching

Discussion in 'Beginners, General Questions' started by Dick Knisely, Oct 23, 2005.

  1. Dick Knisely

    Dick Knisely Second Unit

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    Looked through the forum and FAQ (good info there BTW!) and didn't see this but it may be obvious to everyone but me.

    The issue is video switching throught the AV receiver. In my case its a Denon2802 but that may not matter. Based on the not-very-clear-to-me info in the manual, I think I've read that the unit can't switch between dissimilar inputs. That is, if the output line to the TV is from "S-Video Monitor" then any S-Video inputs can be selected and will be sent to the TV, but composite or component inputs won't.

    Basically the wording in the manual is that "...signals input to the units S-jacks are only output from the S-jack outputs." It kinda makes sense that the receiver doesn't do conversions but I'd been assuming I could do that switching without thinking about it.

    My current setup was simple enough that I now do video switching at the TV (audio at the receiver) but I'm changing things and I'll end up with more sources than inputs on the TV so it makes sense to route things to the receiver and use it for switching. The obvious thing to do is to try it but I lack needed cables and rewiring things is a literal pain in the back so I was diagramming everything out.

    So the bottom line is: do I understand the manual correctly? And is this the case with all AVR's?

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. Thomas_A

    Thomas_A Second Unit

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    your Denond does not do componant up-conversion...true.
     
  3. Dick Knisely

    Dick Knisely Second Unit

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    Is this true of all, some, most AVR's ?
     
  4. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    With the advent of component video, it’s becoming more common for receivers to do “upconversion” – i.e., convert lower-level composite and S-video signals to component (even though the original resolution stays the same. This is because there are many sources – cable boxes, VCR’s, camcorders etc. – that don’t use component video )and in the case of VCRs and camcorders, never will).

    What I’m not sure of is if these receivers will upconvert composite to S-video. Be sure and check that out before you plunk your money down on a new one.

    In the meantime, I believe you can get a little in-line gizmo that converts composite to S-video. Post a question on our Audio/Video Sources Forum and I’m sure someone can tell you where to find one.

    Regards,
    Wayne A. Pflughaupt
     
  5. John S

    John S Producer

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    With your AVR and still most AVR's, I just wire the output of each type to the display.
     
  6. Charlie Campisi

    Charlie Campisi Screenwriter

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    Hey John. The OP indicated he was changing up his system and was not going to have enough inputs on the tv and that's why he was interested in the upconversion/switching.
     
  7. John S

    John S Producer

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    Right,, Use the AVR to switch, that was the gist of my post. Just hook up every type video connection it can switch is what I am saying.

    I meant from the AVR to the display.
     
  8. Dick Knisely

    Dick Knisely Second Unit

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    John,
    Gotcha. Understood your comment and that's basically what I've drawn out as an interim solution. The immediate change is from analog cable with no set-top box to a digital cable with one. That adds an S-vid output but the current TV has no component, one S-vid and one composite input. Thus the need to do the switching at the AVR at least for the S-vid inputs.

    In the slightly longer term I'm looking at a new TV (Panasonic 37" plasma) that has 2 video inputs of each type so I can hook everything up to it and do all the video switching there which seems best from a signal view. Of course, as you suggested I could still do the switching thru the AVR since it supports 4 S-Vid inputs, 4 composite inputs, 2 component inputs and a output-to-monitor of each type. But since I still end up with selecting an input at the TV either way, it actually seems operationally simpler to go back to doing all the video switching at the TV.

    Wayne,
    Thanks for the tip on the converter. If for any reason I decide that doing all the switching at the AVR is important that's what I'd need to use S-vid for everything and route everything through thru the AVR and make a single connection to the TV (new or old).

    I often don't feel like I know much but I know from experience that I'm a lot more willing/able to figure this stuff out than many (most?). And with so many options that don't all work, it's a wonder that a typcial consumer ever gets this stuff hooked up and working.

    Anyway, thanks again guys.
     
  9. Wayne A. Pflughaupt

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    Yup. Pretty sad, isn’t it? They can send a man to the moon, but they can’t make a plug-’n’-play home theater system.

    Regards,
    Wayne A. Pflughaupt
     
  10. John S

    John S Producer

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    Well, if you runn all video to the TV and all audio to the AVR, you still have to select the display source, and then select the audio source.

    With it through the AVR, just select the source on the AVR, then select the input on the TV.

    Not so different really.
     
  11. joseph westcott

    joseph westcott Second Unit

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  12. Dick Knisely

    Dick Knisely Second Unit

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    John -- yep, I agree, it isn't very different. If I could easily do AV source with "one button" then doing it via the AVR would make sense. Since I can't, keeping things split that way will result in less confusion with the other primary user in the house since that's what she's used to now.

    Joe -- no argument but one thing at at a time is about all I can convince she-who-writes-the-checks to go for [​IMG]

    Dick
     
  13. Charlie Campisi

    Charlie Campisi Screenwriter

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    Dick-

    You may want to look into a Harmony universal remote. Take a look at remotecentral.com or the logitech website. The Harmony was a big hit with my family and babysitter. Hit "Watch TV" or "Watch a DVD" and one touch of a button configures all the components the way you want. My 6 year old can run my system with a tv, avr, dvd player and satellite box, as can my wife and 13 year old babysitter with 30 seconds of explanation. Amazon has the 659 for $90 free shipping. You might be able to find it slightly cheaper on fleabay but amazon has a free return shipping if you don't like it or get a bum unit.
     
  14. joseph westcott

    joseph westcott Second Unit

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    Charlie has a great suggestion and should make switching your inputs on the display a "one button" solution.

    I would suggest the Harmony 688 for one major reason. It is supported by Next Generation. They make RF systems so you can control your AV components from anywhere, almost.

    Just future proofing suggestion if you decide you need a solution that also addresses non line of sight operation in the future.
     
  15. Charlie Campisi

    Charlie Campisi Screenwriter

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    I'm not a fan of the 688 because the buttons are close together making it harder to operate in the dark or without looking at it, but that's just me. The Harmonys are great remotes.
     
  16. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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  17. LarryR

    LarryR Agent

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    My problem is similar but slightly off the subject. I have a Denon AVR 3805. I want to see OSD, especially during the set-up, on the TV screen. I connected a video cable from the AVRs monitor out jack to my Samsung DLP TVs AV1 input. I am unable to see OSD. I understand that the Denon AVR 3802 had instructions in the manual that only a S-Video connection would work. There is no such statement in the AVR 3805s manual. Should I be able to see OSD on my TV screen from the AVR? I have tried several different buttons on the remote. Anybody know how to see the OSD onscreen?
     
  18. joseph westcott

    joseph westcott Second Unit

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    I am stuck using an S Video from the H10 DBS Recevier to the 3805 and it does work in this configuration.

    The H10 will not put out a 480i signal via component output even though it states it will in the manual.
     
  19. Allan Jayne

    Allan Jayne Cinematographer

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    A long standing method of connecting up things is to have three categories -- composite, S-video, and component -- using Video 1, Video 2, and Video 3 on your TV. Three cable sets, one for each category, go back to the AV Receiver outputs. All your source devices connect to your AV Receiver but you have to remember which of the 3 categories each device is in.

    Digital cable or satellite TV is sometimes better off in two categories at the same time, composite and S-video, or composite and component, with two sets of cables going to the AVR. This is because analog channels sometimes look better using composite video while digital channels always come out better using a different format. If the AVR does not upconvert, both video cables coming from the cable box can go into the same input bank of the AVR.

    An AVR that upconverts composite to component or S_video may sometimes give a worse picture compared with outputting composite to the TV. It depends on how well the upconversion is performed.

    Video hints:
    http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/video.htm
     
  20. LarryR

    LarryR Agent

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    Joseph: I think you are probably right on. I am waiting for a reply from Denon's tech support before I buy an S-video connector, just to make sure.
    Allan: I also thank you for your reply, but I needed an answer to only the monitor out to the AV1 connection from the Denon to my TV for on-screen viewing, i.e., when doing the set-up.

    I mounted all my speakers today and without doing any finessing with set-up, etc. I watched my first HD movie (cable) with the front speaker and the surround speakers mounted in their correct places. Wow! The person helping me to mount the speakers was astonished and stated he now has to go out and buy a system. I will use my Avia set-up guide with my Denon mic in the next two days to tweak the system.

    Again, thanks to all who reply to these posts.
     

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