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Veronica Mars Season 2

Discussion in 'TV Shows' started by ThomasC, Sep 14, 2005.

  1. Ken_McAlinden

    Ken_McAlinden Producer
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    The DVDs came out as soon as they were ready. The only way they could have avoided this was to delay the premiere of the second season by three weeks. UPN probably got more juice out of all of the simultaneous cross promotions by launching their shows close to the same time then they would have by delaying it for almost a month to coincide with the DVDs. With that being the reality on the ground, I wish they had taken another month or two to add supplements to the DVDs. The reason that they went barebones was to get them out before the second season, which they weren't able to do after all.

    Regards,
     
  2. Robert Ringwald

    Robert Ringwald Cinematographer

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    They were ready to go in early September. Warner Bros. held them back so as not to compete with the DVD releases of Desperate Housewives and Lost. While it was a good plan in theory... it killed the chance for people to catch up with the show.

    However, considering the 4 episodes this season have been half a million up from the AVERAGE of last season it's a good thing. It hasn't dipped below 3 million, and last season had many episodes that scored only 2.1, etc, etc.

    The show was renewed based on the idea that it continues to improve and show growth potential. Buffy scored ratings that were just "okay" for The WB until it moved to Tuesday nights and the premiere on that night blew everyone away by breaking records for the show.

    UPNs been really generous with Mars, and it appears to be working. Considering Sex Lies and Secrets can barely muster up a million viewers... Mars shows them what a hit for them is.
     
  3. CherylJ

    CherylJ Stunt Coordinator

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    As much as I would like to share your optimism, America's Next Top Model and Everybody Hates Chris are really showing UPN what a "hit" for them is. The ratings for VM are far behind both those shows.

    OTOH, VM is up against the behemoth of Lost, and is doing better than the WB show in the same slot (Related), and VM is doing better than Kevin Hill was last year (I think), so it's not all bad. And you are right that SLC totally tanking has to help VM, because UPN has to have something to put on . . . I think.

    I just wish VM was doing a little better at holding on to the ANTM audience, and I'm sure UPN does too. But a good portion of those ANTM viewers must be switching over to Lost. (I don't see the ANTM audience as that compatible with VM, but apparently UPN does, or wants to believe that there is a lot of crossover. To me, it's apples and oranges, although both shows skew to females.)
     
  4. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    Well, I know of at least one who watches both [​IMG].
     
  5. CherylJ

    CherylJ Stunt Coordinator

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    Oh, there are plenty of people who watch both, but the shows are so different and the core audience I would think would be pretty different.

    For example, the median age of the VM viewer is about 32 according to the latest demos. I'm guessing the median ANTM fan is a bit younger and is overwhelmingly female, while VM has more male viewers. I know lots of guys who watch VM but I've never met a (straight) one who will admit to watching ANTM. Plus I doubt ANTM attracts many viewers over 35, but I know VM casts a fairly wide net, particularly for a show labeled a "teen" show (that term is so misleading).

    Then again, I don't see any show on UPN that has much in common with VM or would attract a similar audience. Maybe EHC would even be a better fit than ANTM, but I don't know.
     
  6. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    Well, I know of at least one who will [​IMG].
     
  7. Robert Ringwald

    Robert Ringwald Cinematographer

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    · At 9PM VERONICA MARS scored its best ratings ever in women 18-49 (2.0/4) and matched series highs in women 18-34 (2.6/6) and adults 18-49 (1.4/3).

    · VERONICA MARS had strong week-to-week growth across key demos including +37% in women 18-34 and +18% in women 18-49.

    · VERONICA MARS beat an original "Related" on the WB in all key adult and female demo breaks.

    · From 8-10PM UPN ranked second in women 18-34 (3.7/10) behind only ABC and was third, ahead of NBC and the WB, in adults 18-34 (2.5/7).

    · From 8-10PM UPN posted strong gains versus the year-ago time period in adults 18-34 (+19%) and women 18-34 (+6%).

    That's for this past Wednesday. [​IMG]
     
  8. Matt Stone

    Matt Stone Lead Actor

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    Nice stats, Robert! I'm glad to see that the show continues to improve. UPN may never have a bonafide "hit" (ala Lost, DH, etc), but I think it would be smart of them to stick by a show that continues to wow critics and steadily increases it's audience size.
     
  9. Matt Stone

    Matt Stone Lead Actor

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    have no idea how this post got here
     
  10. Robert Ringwald

    Robert Ringwald Cinematographer

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    If UPN and others want to continually compare the show to BUFFY... it certainly stands that it's going to be a little while longer before the show is really the cult series they want it to be. At least give Entertainment Weekly a shot at doing a cover story (where is that story BTW?)

    I think we need to start a petition... [​IMG]

    ALSO,

    UPN just cancelled their new series "Sex, Lies and Secrets"

    The production was halted a while back with only eight episodes completed. UPN has now stopped airing the series with four left to go. The show was pulling in just over a million viewers each week.
     
  11. CherylJ

    CherylJ Stunt Coordinator

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    Good question. EW does mention VM a lot and called it one of the top 5 best returning shows, but a cover would be nice. One of those "best shows you're not watching" things or something. Now that it's getting a bit old for AD, it's time to let VM wear that mantle.

    I'm guessing the cancellation of SLC can only be good news for VM, because now the JLo midseason show will replace SLC . . . . Right . . . ??
     
  12. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Studio Mogul

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    10/26/05

    Loved Veronica's "bug" for Lamb.

    Jackie is really becoming a nasty piece of work. Let's hope VM can use the bit about Lamb and Jackie's dad to get ahead.

    Wallace is distraught and makes a decision that takes him on a road trip with pops.

    Keith should have used the voicemail recording to undermine Lamb's mudslinging.

    Overall, an average episode, but still better than most shows on a great night.
     
  13. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    10/26/2005

    Good call on the pills for Jackie.

    Lamb is an ass or should I say a bug?

    I'm amazed the number of plots getting piled on, now with Wallace taking off with his dad.

    I think Rob Thomas is a master juggler.
     
  14. CherylJ

    CherylJ Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes, RT is a master juggler! There are so many subplots and mysteries going on now that it's hard to imagine how they are going to resolve everything . . . but I know they will, and will do it well.

    I thought this episode was very solid, and it was my second favorite so far this year (after "Cheatty Cheatty Bang Bang," which I loved). It was nice to see an episode revolve around Wallace and the sucky way he sometimes gets treated by his BFF.

    One of the best things about the show is how much VM walks the line on the likability factor, and this week she was almost the villain as well as the heroine. It was so great that Wallace called her out on her sometimes self-centered view of the world. She doesn't mean to be that way, but she is sometimes and he deserves a better BFF.

    Having said that, though, I don't think I would have been able to consider his feelings either because Jackie needs to die. NOW. I hate that girl with as much passion as Veronica herself must hate her. I loved Veronica's expression when she saw Jackie with Logan on the dance floor. No. Freaking. Way!

    If Jackie makes a play for Logan, Veronica is going to cause her serious bodily harm as well as stage some sort of public humiliation. I just don't think Veronica will be able to stop herself from going after Jackie, even if Wallace pleads with her not to. Then she will spend the rest of the time begging Wallace for forgiveness and baking him snickerdoodles to make it up to him. Although if Jackie and Wallace are totally over and Jackie really does go for Logan, Wallace may not care if VM takes her down.
     
  15. David Rosen

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    Absolutely!
     
  16. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    When Wallace called V. on her self-centeredness I couldn't help thinking of Buffy and the recurring "it's all about her" issue from that show.

    And I thought Percy Daggs did a great job with that scene. His pleading to V. to let the incident go showed a great mix of fear, love and pain.
     
  17. CherylJ

    CherylJ Stunt Coordinator

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    Percy Daggs was fantastic in the entire episode imho. I had my doubts about him early last year, but he has improved tremendously and really stepped up to the challenge in this episode with some very difficult scenes. Kudos. I hope he's not gone too long, if indeed he's off to Chicago with his maybe Dad.

    I enjoy the characters of Keith, Wallace and Logan so much and all of their relationships with Veronica are endlessly fascinating and entertaining to me. It's only her relationship with Duncan that I find lacking, although I don't attribute that completely to the actor, but more to the writing.

    We don't see enough of her relationship with Weevil much anymore, as he is barely on the show this year. But I do find their banter amusing when we see it and their "unlikely allies" dynamic is entertaining. They're not really friends and they aren't interested in each other romantically, but there is a mutual respect and backscratching going on. They use each other and they are fine with that, so long as it's tit-for-tat.
     
  18. Jesse Blacklow

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    Add another to the Percy Daggs props for this episode. I've been wondering when Veronica and Wallace's relationship would come to a head, since there've been hints for some of last seasons and most of this season. I really hope they're not writing his character off by sending him to Chicago, but I'm thinking if they were to write anyone off, it would be Weevil, since he's had no screen time this season.

    All in all, I think this was the strongest episode so far, since it did a lot of both plot advancement and character development without feeling jam-packed (like the season premiere). The ratings news is great, since theose kinds of numbers are good for a UPN show. I know it's probably due in some part to "Lost" running a repeat, but I'm not going to complain. Hell, since some of the "Lost" folks are "Veronica Mars" fans, I'm sure they're doing a little rooting for the underdog.

    ETA: I was upset to read that Michael Muhney's (Sheriff Lamb) dad was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. He's running a 10K to raise money for research, and is asking for sponsorship through donations. As unlikeable as his character is (a testament his acting skills, I think), I've heard nothing but praise for Michael himself, so if you'd like to help out, you can follow the link.
     
  19. Robert Ringwald

    Robert Ringwald Cinematographer

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    UPN'S “TOP MODEL” FASHIONS A FIRST PLACE FINISH AT 8PM IN WOMEN 18-34 AND 18-49 WHILE "VERONICA" CLIMBS TO SERIES HIGHS ACROSS THE BOARD

    TOP MODEL Ranks Second in Hour in Adults 18-34 and Third in Adults 18-49

    UPN is Wednesday's Number One Network From 8-10pm with Women 18-34; UPN Ranks Third among Adults 18-34

    · "AMERICA'S NEXT TOP MODEL" WON THE 8-9PM HOUR IN WOMEN 18-34 (4.8/14) AND WOMEN 18-49 (3.9/10).

    · "TOP MODEL" TOOK SECOND IN ITS TIME PERIOD AMONG ADULTS 18-34 (3.2/10), BEHIND ONLY THE FINAL GAME OF THE WORLD SERIES ON FOX. TOP MODEL ALSO RANKED THIRD IN ADULTS 18-49 (2.6/7), BEHIND ONLY FOX AND ABC.

    · "VERONICA MARS" CLIMBS TO ITS LARGEST AUDIENCE (3.5MIL) AND BEST RATINGS EVER IN ADULTS 18-34 (1.9/5), ADULTS 18-49 (1.6/4), WOMEN 18-34 (2.9/7) AND WOMEN 18-49 (2.2/5).

    · OVERALL, UPN WAS THE NUMBER ONE NETWORK FROM 8-10PM AMONG WOMEN 18-34 (3.8/10) AND RANKED THIRD IN ADULTS 18-34 (2.5/7), BEHIND ONLY ABC AND FOX.

    · THE COMBINATION OF "TOP MODEL" 5 AND "VERONICA MARS" IMPROVED UPN'S WEDNESDAY VERSUS THE SAME NIGHT A YEAR AGO BY:
    14% IN ADULTS 18-34 (2.5/7)
    5% IN ADULTS 18-49 (2.1/5)
    6% IN WOMEN 18-34 (3.8/5)

    AMAZING!!!
     
  20. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Studio Mogul

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    11/9/05

    Still can't believe this show occupies an hour timeslot when it feels like it covers 90 minutes to 120 minutes of material.

    Too bad Keith lost the election, but he still has a few tricks up his sleeve. What did Keith find under the seat in the bus? Looks like a dead rat.

    Logan's get back at Weevil (Logan assuming it was Weevil's gang that burned down his house) was classic rich boy, but funny nonetheless.

    Veronica shows off her P.I. skills, and even gets in some double team action with Clarence. Even Joss Whedon (and the winner of the role on VM from America's Next Top Model) popped up during the car rental scenes.

    Veronica showed compassion towards Kuntz on his death bed, allowing him to think good thoughts of his only daughter.

    The whole "Dick" discussion between Veronica and the new mayor's daughter produced a chuckle from me. Kids, these days, just roll with the punches of having a good friend sleep with their step-mom, and then flip it around on with more needling of Logan about having the same thoughts towards his mom.
     

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