Using Closing Logos to determine Print age (and other ramblings) (1 Viewer)

[Gary16]

I can't answer that but here is a comparison of the two sets that I posted in another thread after they came out:

[*]Neither set has perfect transfers. I compared several episodes on both versions. In some cases they looked the same. In other cases either Shout looked better of the UK looked better. If you're just looking at the opening animation it always looked good on the UK set and sometimes not so good on the Shout set but that had no bearing on how the rest of the episode looked.
[*]There is no "PAL speedup." The episodes are exactly the same length (within 1-3 seconds) on both sets
[*]The Shout set has 5-6 chapter stops in each episode. The UK set has NO chapter stops.
[*]The added Bilko documentary on the UK set is a nice bonus
[*]The booklet with the UK set is also very nice (although printed with very small type) with some nice photos and good background on the series
[/list]

 

[jcroy]

(Crossposted from another thread).

https://www.hometheaterforum.com/co...k-courtesy-of-vei.340549/page-34#post-4472777

This thread is probably more appropriate.

(More generally).

For a lot of 1990s era shows (and some late-1980s shows), I'm guessing many were edited entirely on sd videotape in postproduction.

I wouldn't be surprised if many of them are also using these same crappy sd transfers on various dvd releases, typically with the hard telecine left in intact (ie. the "comb effect").

The 1990s is probably also "too recent" for many movie companies to have created "newer" transfers for these late-80s or 1990s era shows which were edited on sd videotape. So unless a particular show is an A++ title (such as Star Trek: The Next Generation) or was done entirely in HD resolution from the start (such as Star Trek: Enterprise, CSI, etc ...), then most likely the movie studio isn't going to invest in an hd transfer. So we're more or less stuck with whatever crappy sd transfers were used back in the original first-run broadcasts or subsequent off-network syndicated reruns.

I looked more into this, in the case of the original Dallas.

The first eight dvd season sets of Dallas, have the early-mid 2000s era AOL-TimeWarner logo.

http://www.closinglogos.com/page/Warner+Bros.+Television

Going frame by frame, it appears the video is progressive. (ie. No comb effect). Most likely it is the film scanned in sometime during the early-mid 2000s.


Starting with season 9 (ie. the "it's all a dream" season), the video quality doesn't look as good. The colors are somewhat more faded, and the hard telecine is left in (ie. the comb effect).

The season 9 episodes have the orange/yellow Lorimar logo on a black background and also the "big W" on a red background Warner logo, except for the final three episodes.

http://www.closinglogos.com/page/Lorimar+Television

In the final three episodes of season 9, and over seasons 10 and 11, they have the Lorimar-Telepictures fireworks logo.

http://www.closinglogos.com/page/Lorimar-Telepictures

In seasons 12 and 13, they have the Lorimar logo on a marble background.


If I had to guess, I wouldn't be surprised if seasons 9 to 14 were edited on sd videotape in post-production and that the dvd versions are from the same old sd transfers from the late-1980s/early-1990s which were possibly used in the first-run broadcasts and subsequent reruns.

 

[ClassicTVMan1981X]

I've not seen one word about Paramount Television shows discussed in this thread, so here I go...

I know for The Brady Bunch, it is easy to tell which prints looked the most dismal: if they were those prints that came sourced from the 1975 16mm versions. When they switched to videotape around 1986, they got a little bit better. The closing logos on both prints were the same "Split Box II" used from 1969-75. I know the TBS print of the pilot episode, "The Honeymoon," had very dismal-looking colors, which leads me to believe the film-to-tape transferring process wasn't that great.

When Nick at Nite acquired the series in 1998 (they actually briefly showed the series in February 1995 as part of a Brady Bunch-themed marathon to promote the release of the Brady Bunch Movie in theaters), the end Paramount Television logo was replaced by the silent "CGI Mountain" version (Viacom byline).

While most Me-TV reruns of this series are derived from the DVD prints, one episode, "Kelly's Kids," had the same 1995 Paramount logo (from the Nick at Nite era), but with the original 1970 jingle intact!


~Ben

 

[Charles Ellis]

I have to give kudos to CBS/Paramount for restoring the 'blinking eye' end logo (pre-1966) for vintage CBS shows like Perry Mason- likewise NBC/Universal for its vintage westerns like The Virginian and Laramie- not only do you see the Revue logo in color, but the NBC 'snake' logo in variations. So here's the CBS 'blinking eye' from a TV broadcast of Perry Mason's ONLY color episode, 1966's "The Case of the Twice-Told Twist"- not only do you see the color closing credits, but the B/W 'blinking eye' AND the current CBS/Paramount logo!

 

[Sky King]

Charles,

Not to be picky, but the CBS Logo you refer to is actually called the "Iris" logo.

John

 

[Charles Ellis]

So sue me.

 

[Sky King]

Charles,

Just wanted you to be properly informed my friend.


John

 

[ClassicTVMan1981X]

I also want to discuss about Hanna-Barbera cartoons and replacement logos...

When USA Network had the rights to show most of the second- and third-rate Hanna-Barbera cartoons on their Cartoon Express block from circa 1984 until 1992, on many of these the original respective H-B logos were replaced by this 1983 version of the "Swirling Star" logo (including on Jabberjaw, Dynomutt, Dog Wonder and The New Fred and Barney Show to name a few):


But on The Pebbles and Bamm-Bamm Show the same logo actually followed the original 1960s H-B logo...

(the DVD actually has this differently... the first episode has the same 1979 version of the Swirling Star intact, but the 1960s H-B logo seen before it has the Taft byline intact as well)

The 1974-1977 shows (and one 1978 special: Little Big League) originally ended with this "H-B Rainbow" logo:


From 1977-1979, the "H-B Rainbow" was made smaller...

(1977)


(1978-1979)


~Ben

 

[ScottRE]

I reallllly love this thread! Period logos are such an interest for me when I get a series. I actually prefer to watch the compressed Mill Creek release of I Dream of Jeannie because they restored the original Screen Gems logos.

Shout Factory's complete set of T.J. Hooker apparently has the original logos at the end of season 3 - 5. The first two are just direct ports of the Sony release.

Cannon: I'll start with what is considered to be perhaps the most troubled of all series when it comes to older prints. To put it bluntly, Cannon stands out as being the worst looking show that I currently own on DVD. Fans were disappointed when CBS DVD dropped the ball by not remastering the series, and they were disappointed again when VEI released the same ancient prints several years ago. The prints of Cannon are marred by being sourced from beat-up film prints which are rife with dirt, debris, and film jitter. These prints were transferred to tape (BetaSP according to the CBSTVD Syndication Bible), which add numerous other flaws to the already imperfect image.

Oh man, then you wanna pick up Branded, the Chuck Connors western series. You'll feel soooo much better about Cannon.

 

[Lecagr]

I'm actually satisfied with the Cannon DVD's from VEI. Episodes are complete with all scenes intact which to me is the most important thing. I have the original release, the 31 disc set which is preferable to the 20 disc set released a year later that has compression issues with more episodes crammed on to the discs. After I received the 31 disc set, I became aware that the 3rd disc of season 4 had a defect with one of the episodes, but VEI corrected the error and sent me a replacement disc so all is good.