Upgrading RPTV, which brand?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Steve Young, Mar 22, 2002.

  1. Steve Young

    Steve Young Stunt Coordinator

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    I currently have the Toshiba TP50H95 and I would like to upgrade to a HD widescreen. I have had my Tosh now for 3 years and have loved the picture. I had a basic ISF calibration done on it too. I would like to stay with Toshiba, either the 50HX81 or maybe the 57HX81 (can't decide, $1000 price diff.). Are there any problems with this new line in Toshiba? Or should I consider any other brands, like Panasonic, Hitachi, Sony (available in my area)?

    I would appreciate any comments on this.

    Thanks

    Steve
     
  2. Steve Young

    Steve Young Stunt Coordinator

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    I've read that the Toshibas have to upconvert a 480p signal to 540p and this degrades the original image.

    But i've also been told that this is very hard to see, and most people wouldn't even see this if pointed out to them.

    Any comments on this?

    Thanks

    Steve
     
  3. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

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    Steve,

    Michael TLV has reported that Toshiba's conversion from 480p to 540p for progressive scan dvd does degrade resolution compared to sets that display 480p natively. Owners of the new Tosh sets, however, are generally very happy with them, and they are pretty highly regarded as good bang for the buck around here.

    I love my Sony KP57HW40 and would not swap it for anything within 1.5k of the price.

    That being said, the Toshibas I've seen and played with in the stores have looked pretty darn good.

    Since you already own and are very happy with a Toshiba, you'd probably be more comfortable sticking with that brand.

    My only suggestion would be to purchase from a local retailer with a no-hassle 30 day return/refund policy.

    I had originally bought an Hitachi widescreen, based on my excellent experience with an Hitachi 4/3 analog set (similar to your situation with Tosh). After 2 weeks of frustration trying to tweak the set into some semblance of a decent ntsc picture I returned it for the Sony, with which I am quite happy. I was very glad I had bought from a store with a liberal return policy.

    While you're more than likely to be quite happy with a Toshiba set, it would be nice to have the return option.
     
  4. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    If you are set on the Toshiba sets ... visit the Keohihdtv site and look at the article on 540P upconversion with the accompanying photos.

    If you don't care that the TV does what it does ... then buy the TV. (Note that the images of the 65" Toshiba are a mild case of this problem ... I have seen others where it is much more severe.)

    Regards
     
  5. Chris PC

    Chris PC Producer

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    Michael,

    I'm curious about the upconverting too, could you provide a link?
     
  6. Jack Henley

    Jack Henley Auditioning

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  7. Chris PC

    Chris PC Producer

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    Yep, I found it. So Toshiba's upconverting hasn't been all that great. I have been looking at HDTV's like the following:

    Pioneer SD-533HD5 53"

    Mitsubishi Platinum series WS-55809 55" HDTV HD upgradable

    Sony KP57HW40 & KP51HW40

    I have seen and i dislike the Toshiba's. I will view them again making sure that the DVD player is progressive, just to get an idea of what they look like. I think maybe the last time I looked at them the picture looked bad because the dvd player was interlaced.

    What about the Panasonic like the one PT-47WX51C compared to the Toshiba in the Keohi link? Do they upconvert 480p to 540p or something else? How does their upconversion compare to Toshiba and Hitachi?

    Can I include the Panny PT-47WX51C on my short list of HDTV displays???
     
  8. Jenna

    Jenna Second Unit

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    I recently purchased a Sony KP57HW40 and LOVE IT! The picture out of the box was fantastic, and after calibrating with the Avia Home Theater disc, it's superb!

    I had narrowed my purchase down to the Toshiba 57HX81 and the Sony. Although the Toshiba had a great picture at a great price, the "540 upconversion" was a major factor in my decision to purchase the Sony. The high-def image on it is simply too good to be true.

    Whichever set you decide upon, I'm sure you'll be pleased.
     
  9. Steve Young

    Steve Young Stunt Coordinator

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    Well I am getting the 57HX81. I am not that critical of a person so the upconversion doesn't bother me. For the money i feel the Toshiba has the best picture. I can't wait to get this set and get it calibrated.

    Thanks all for your input.

    Steve
     
  10. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    The Panasonic does not upconvert ... it shows the signals native ...

    The Hitachi upconverts to 540P, but it is done far better than the Toshiba ... only about 20 to 25% as bad as on the Toshiba ... and no crushing of the high end detail.

    Note the Horizontal resolution wedge on the upper left.

    Notice what detail is missing ... about 60 lines of detail or more ...

    Regards
     
  11. Chris PC

    Chris PC Producer

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    Weird. So I've been under the wrong impression then. If thats the case, then how does the Panasonic compare to the following in terms of picture quality? Is the below list a rough representation of their relative quality?

    Pioneer SD-533HD5

    Sony KP57HW40 & KP51HW40

    Mitsubishi Platinum WS-55809 55" HDTV HD upgradable

    Panasonic PT-47WX51C or PT-56WX51

    Anybody jump in with advice. I guess the Panasonic has the worst line doubler? How do the above sets compare in their line-doubling? I'm concerned how they work with NTSC cable, vhs and laserdisc.
     
  12. Michael TLV

    Michael TLV THX Video Instructor/Calibrator

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    Greetings

    I hope you realize that you cannot buy Mits sets in Canada.

    Mits sets are usually said to have the worst line doubler of the bunch you listed.

    The others are really about the same ... and they all do 3:2 ...

    I am not about to be a spokesperson for Panasonic so buy what you want ...

    All the images look about the same in post calibrated stated ... with the Pioneer getting the slight edge ... in detail ... but oh the price premium.

    Regards
     
  13. Roy H

    Roy H Stunt Coordinator

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    Steve, even though you seem to have decided on what you were going to buy, you can still see the 540p push!!!!!!!!!! The funny thing is, that if one post's about DVI (COMING SOON THIS FALL) or 4:3 VS 16:9 they are soundly, and quickly pounced!

    In my opinion you have made a choice, just enjoy your TV. If you get into all the (NON JOE6PACK) garbage you will never be happy with any TV you buy. It's just a TV, or even a HT, just enjoy it. The rest is all, well let's just say bad reception!

    Just my opinion.

    Roy.
     
  14. Chris PC

    Chris PC Producer

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    True enough, you don't want to get too involved with the techno babble, but then again, you want to choose whats best.
    Before you decide what to get, why not do some comparing in the store with a progressive DVD player connected to the Toshiba and a Pioneer, Sony or Panasonic? I know that you say you are not that critical of a person so the upconversion doesn't bother you, but see what it actually looks like and then decide. I've sat and watched Toshiba sets with what I thought was progressive dvd and it looked so soft I was embarassed to ask the sales people why it looked so much worse than the other sets.
    As I said, I am going to choose between the Pioneer as the best choice, the Sonys as a solid middle bet and the Panasonic as a DVD display with lousy ntsc display properties.
    I figured the Mitsubishi wasn't available in Canada. I was looking at Mitsubishi vcr's last summer and was surprised to find them absent from Canada. Our first vcr was a HI-FI 2 head Mitsubishi. It was solid but needs work [​IMG]
    Before you make a decision, check it out. And if you buy it and don't like it, find that out as soon as possible so you don't have trade in problems.
    Otherwise, if it looks good, then enjoy [​IMG]
     
  15. JohnnyG

    JohnnyG Screenwriter

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    Michael's pictures are accurate, but I tend to watch VIDEO with my TV and not test patterns [​IMG]
    As far as I'm concerned, if you can detect this in motion video, it's far from objectionable. I've compared a calibrated PT-47WX51 next to a calibrated Toshiba 50HX81 with the same material at the same time and find little, if anything, to be bothered about.
     
  16. Mike I

    Mike I Supporting Actor

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    DVI is not coming this fall...The congressional DTV commitee just told told the MPAA and the manufactures they have 18 months to come up with a compromise agreeable to all or Congress will come up with the solution....
     

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