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TWILIGHT RELEASES LACK OF INTEREST (1 Viewer)

bruceames

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Robert Crawford said:
Just to be clear, I own three region-free BD players and have about 9300 discs in my film library including 1900 Blu-rays so I understand the benefits of physical media. However, I'm not going to deprive myself of enjoying as many movies as I possibly can because some of those movies are restricted in the way I can view them. There are times when people have to adapt to different ways in order to get as much enjoyment out of life as possible especially those of us who's time is getting shorter each day that goes by.
That's an impressive library. Mine's probably 1/3 that large. I have an Oppo 95 and 93 in use, both region free and Iso-capable. So it's like having the best of both worlds.
 

LouA

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Robert Crawford said:
Have plenty of large bookcases.
Thanks. I do have a lot of them on bookcases, and some on specially built DVD shelves from Gothic Cabinets . Still, I've outgrown my shelf space .
 

bruceames

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LouA said:
Thanks. I do have a lot of them on bookcases, and some on specially built DVD shelves from Gothic Cabinets . Still, I've outgrown my shelf space .
I use the 14mm 6 disc cases that you can get for a quarter each. Just take those DVDs that are least important to you, group them into genre (ie, find six comedies that you wouldn't mind sharing the same case), and start swapping cases. The covers you can either set alongside each case, or you can put them inside the sleeve (although if they are thick they can cause the case to bind when you close them). For spine art, I just use Excel and type the names of the movies in a big a font as possible so that they fit. Then I number it, classify it by genre, and note it in Excel (although I use DVD Profiler as well, Excel is easier for me to see a lot of entries at a glance and make quick changes in location). What you'll have in the end is no different than a 4 disc comedy pack that you'll find on Amazon.

Anyway, it cuts down storage space by 80% and I can fit over 100 discs in a foot of space and still have them in amary cases and read the names of the movies on the spine. As everyone knows, it's the amary cases that are sucking up all the real estate and I place no special value on those that look like thousands of others. For titles with special packaging, I just leave those alone (until such a day where it may not be so special to me anymore, if that day comes).
 

Richard Gallagher

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bruceames said:
If it means an overall increase in releases then yes. If it simply means a replacement of one business model for another, then no. I'm not too keen on the idea of having $30 be the norm for catalog on Blu-ray.
I don't see that happening. The difference between TT and other distributors is that TT isn't in this just for the money. Sure, they want to be profitable, but they also are movie lovers who want to release films that they care about with the highest possible quality. The limited edition concept obviously works for them or they would be out of business by now.

The studios want sales volume for the product they release. That's why Fox Connect periodically has sales where you can pick up even their newest releases for a fraction of MSRP.
 

bruceames

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Richard Gallagher said:
I don't see that happening. The difference between TT and other distributors is that TT isn't in this just for the money. Sure, they want to be profitable, but they also are movie lovers who want to release films that they care about with the highest possible quality. The limited edition concept obviously works for them or they would be out of business by now.

The studios want sales volume for the product they release. That's why Fox Connect periodically has sales where you can pick up even their newest releases for a fraction of MSRP.

I agree it's not going to happen either. The catalog market (on either format) is not collapsing nearly as much as what's being made out to be. I think there are some that would want to have you think that's the case in order to get people in panic mode so that the $30 price sticker seems more appealing. For example last year in France, an obscure Universal title from 1932 called "Back Street" just made its DVD debut (released on the Universal label). If DVD is still churning out hundreds of debut catalog every year and at good prices, then Blu-ray should be around doing the same many years from now.

Fox Connect has been having some great sales and I'm waiting like a spider to buy a bunch more from then on their next one. Also TCM Archives has been having good sales too. It's nice be able to see Amazon getting a run for its money. :)
 

Robert Crawford

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bruceames said:
I agree it's not going to happen either. The catalog market (on either format) is not collapsing nearly as much as what's being made out to be. I think there are some that would want to have you think that's the case in order to get people in panic mode so that the $30 price sticker seems more appealing. For example last year in France, an obscure Universal title from 1932 called "Back Street" just made its DVD debut (released on the Universal label). If DVD is still churning out hundreds of debut catalog every year and at good prices, then Blu-ray should be around doing the same many years from now.

Fox Connect has been having some great sales and I'm waiting like a spider to buy a bunch more from then on their next one. Also TCM Archives has been having good sales too. It's nice be able to see Amazon getting a run for its money. :)
It has collapse for the general public! I don't understand how any of us can argue against that reality. I consider those that frequent this board or other similar boards daily as a niche market. Even though, we're a small part of the general public, there's just not enough of us to make a discernible difference in the profit margins for the large studios. That's the reason why the catalog market has collapsed for the general public. The general public in the states aren't buying DVD or BD from France. Film buffs that are knowledgeable about internet purchases and are buying video product from other regions and smaller domestic companies will buy a DVD or BD from France. But, we are small in our numbers which is unfortunate for us.
 

Persianimmortal

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A quick look in the international sub-forum here shows that some classic movies are being released in Europe with a 1,000 unit limit. Makes TT's 3,000 units seem almost generous in comparison. In any case, if these low numbers are not a sign of ultra-niche status for deep catalog titles, what is?
 

Towergrove

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Robert Crawford said:
It has collapse for the general public! I don't understand how any of us can argue against that reality. I consider those that frequent this board or other similar boards daily as a niche market. Even though, we're a small part of the general public, there's just not enough of us to make a discernible difference in the profit margins for the large studios. That's the reason why the catalog market has collapsed for the general public. The general public in the states aren't buying DVD or BD from France. Film buffs that are knowledgeable about internet purchases and are buying video product from other regions and smaller domestic companies will buy a DVD or BD from France. But, we are small in our numbers which is unfortunate for us.
While we are not the general public we have always been one of the largest buying group for home video and the ones who fork out or are willing to fork out the most for releases. We are also the ones that can make or break a release based on our reviews of the product that's been released. We do have buying power and the studios attention. Also has the general public ever been a big buyer of catalogue cause even years ago the numbers for most catalog releases were very low and that includes rental outlet sales in that tally. The studios cater to us cause they know we will $pend. Is a business category that sells over $9 billion a year a niche? Asked my Eco professor and he says NO.
 

Towergrove

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Persianimmortal said:
A quick look in the international sub-forum here shows that some classic movies are being released in Europe with a 1,000 unit limit. Makes TT's 3,000 units seem almost generous in comparison. In any case, if these low numbers are not a sign of ultra-niche status for deep catalog titles, what is?
Are these titles that have been mined on other formats in the past cause most people will not rebuy over and over. Doesn't mean the title isn't popular with a 1000 run may be because it's been sold before again and again. How bout the studios release some new never before released catalogue?
 

bruceames

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Robert Crawford said:
It has collapse for the general public! I don't understand how any of us can argue against that reality. I consider those that frequent this board or other similar boards daily as a niche market. Even though, we're a small part of the general public, there's just not enough of us to make a discernible difference in the profit margins for the large studios. That's the reason why the catalog market has collapsed for the general public. The general public in the states aren't buying DVD or BD from France. Film buffs that are knowledgeable about internet purchases and are buying video product from other regions and smaller domestic companies will buy a DVD or BD from France. But, we are small in our numbers which is unfortunate for us.
It's never going to be mainstream like it was back in DVD's heyday, but remember classic/obscure movies were never mainstream to begin with. And new-to-DVD or new-to-Blu-ray classic release volume has not "collapsed" at all. It's still be churned out a pretty good rate. Low selling? sure. $30? Only if it's TT (or a few other rare exceptions).
 

bruceames

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Persianimmortal said:
A quick look in the international sub-forum here shows that some classic movies are being released in Europe with a 1,000 unit limit. Makes TT's 3,000 units seem almost generous in comparison. In any case, if these low numbers are not a sign of ultra-niche status for deep catalog titles, what is?
I believe those are pretty much all genre titles. They're not doing it with dramas or comedies AFAIK (except TT of course, they do it with all movies), and I doubt they are outselling the genre titles.

And when has deep catalog NOT been ultra-niche? Bottom line is that it's viable to release low sellers for a reasonable price and it happens all the time.
 

Persianimmortal

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Towergrove said:
Is a business category that sells over $9 billion a year a niche? Asked my Eco professor and he says NO.
What "business category" are you referring to? In this thread we're talking about the market for classic titles on Blu-ray. The latest figures I've seen show that total sales of Blu-ray and DVD combined, for both new and catalog releases, was $8b and dropping fast as streaming and download rise rapidly. Add to that statements from Warner's that 80% of catalog sales are on DVD, not Blu-ray, and more importantly, many of those catalog sales are probably not deep catalog, given they're sold in places like supermarkets.That's why classic movies on Blu-ray are a niche. Go back and present the full facts to your Economics professor, then re-ask the same question.
 

Keith Cobby

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I have bought many DVDs for films first made available on that format which I would not watch again and have therefore recycled the disc. I only upgrade to blu-ray for favourite titles that I will watch again. I am buying about 10% of titles on blu-ray that I have bought on DVD (of course many titles I want have not yet been released on blu-ray). I can appreciate why the general public are not buying catalogue blu-ray and just hope that in time many of the films I want will be released, probably on a limited edition basis.
 

Rob W

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I think this forum itself provides perfect evidence that things ain't what they used to be, volume-wise. Like many of you, I check this site several times a day as it's possibly my favorite internet site. Lately I've noticed how infrequently new posts appear compared to the old days, and an awful lot of the posting activity comes from a small pool of about 40-50 regulars. Even as I type this reply, there hasn't been a post in this forum for over 3 hours.
 

bruceames

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Persianimmortal said:
What "business category" are you referring to? In this thread we're talking about the market for classic titles on Blu-ray. The latest figures I've seen show that total sales of Blu-ray and DVD combined, for both new and catalog releases, was $8b and dropping fast as streaming and download rise rapidly. Add to that statements from Warner's that 80% of catalog sales are on DVD, not Blu-ray, and more importantly, many of those catalog sales are probably not deep catalog, given they're sold in places like supermarkets.
Physical media sales are dropping but at a fairly constant rate, and not what I consider fast (well at least not "collapsing" fast). It's been about 6-8 percent a year for the last 5-6 years or so. In fact, I think the decline has been almost impressive given the much more competitive climate it's in now. Also keep in mind that some of the decline is because all the major catalog titles have already been released. And obviously as both formats dig deeper into their wells you get increasingly more obscure titles that replace more popular titles debuting a few years earlier. Of course those aren't going to sell as well.

Warner and Fox make them viable through their respective archive programs for DVD and release hundreds of new catalog every year. They could do the same thing for Blu-ray if they could do it on burned discs like they do on DVD. Are there so many players out there that won't play BD-r as to have to throttle back releases 10-20 times as much for everyone else. Which is the lessor of two evils? My guess is that those with incompatible players should be responsible for knowing its limitations and Warner and other studios should just start releasing BD-r titles. The Blu-ray format is really being handicapped with such a limitation and it's at that point in its lifecycle where they really need it.
 

OliverK

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I wonder how much it will cost to bring a title to Blu-ray including the image harvest from the remaining elements, I doubt the studios are able to do it below 100.000$ per title and often costs will be considerably higher. Now divide that by the money made on each disc for the studio and there you have the minimum numbers of discs to be sold at a certain price point to break even from purely a business perspective which is probably what applies for titles that need not be saved or preserved with a certain urgency.In the case of Sony it is at least interesting that they do not even try to release discs from some of their new 4k masters themselves, a good example being Hard Times that looks fantastic. So even with the master ready to go they do not want to do a release - that should tell us something about how they gauge the interest in this particular release, another example that is certainly more shocking (4k harvest and release from TT) is Philadelphia which I would have considered fairly popular.
 

Keith Cobby

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I know that those of us committed to discs are becoming a minority. The home video market will replicate the audio market where downloading and streaming (lower quality but convenient) are quickly replacing CD's. My wife is not interested in upgrading from DVD to blu-ray and uses her mobile phone for listening to music. My mobile phone doesn't have that capability (not smart!) and you will not be surprised to learn that I listen to music from my CD collection. I think we are the last generation to load discs.
 

bruceames

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Rob W said:
I think this forum itself provides perfect evidence that things ain't what they used to be, volume-wise. Like many of you, I check this site several times a day as it's possibly my favorite internet site. Lately I've noticed how infrequently new posts appear compared to the old days, and an awful lot of the posting activity comes from a small pool of about 40-50 regulars. Even as I type this reply, there hasn't been a post in this forum for over 3 hours.

There's a couple of reasons why forums like this aren't as active as they used to be. Back in DVD's heyday and early in the HD formats, there was a lot of excitement over the novelty of HD on disc and the format war itself. There are none of those conditions anymore to generate activity. Also social media sites have successfully competed for the viewers time and gaming is more popular than ever (especially among adults). Both of those activities are time hogs and leave less time available for traditional forums.
 

bruceames

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Persianimmortal said:
Or they could just license the titles out to third parties with no risk and no fuss...
That would be great. The more avenues the better. I wish Warner felt the same.
 

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