TV shows with music clearance problems... (1 Viewer)

[Glenn Overholt]

James, the rights change just like they do for movies. I have seen a few Parlaphone records, but not in this country.

I am wondering about Ally McBeal, though. Since Wanda Shepard sang most of the songs and she was part of the cast, maybe they have set up something a little bit different regarding her rights for it.

And for the rest of them, I'd like to know what percentage of the groups don't know that their agents have asked for prices that forbid their songs from being used in a movie.

Glenn

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Part of the problem is that so many different people are involved in these things. Using an original recording of a classic rock tune can involved the label, the band, the composer and the lyricist - each of whom has certain rights and a say in how things are used. You can't just hand a check to the record label and say "done". If you hire a cover band to record the song, you've still got to pay them (although much less), possibly the original lable and certainly the composer and lyricist.

Some people who are willing to allow a song to be used in an emphemeral TV broadcast don't want a recording of their work to exist - because this may compete with sales of their own CDs or DVDs. Unless the DVD studio is wiling to pay them as much as the song might make in other formats, they aren't willing to nake a deal. And some people would rather protect their rights to possibly do something in the future and make lots of money than allow someone else to do something now and make a little. (For years Warner Bros, which had no intention of releasing Babylon 5 on home video because they couldn't see a market for it, resisted licensing the series to Columbia House and Image, who did see a market, for VHS and LD release. To do so might reduce the value of the future release they had no plans for. Read that again if you want to understand the concept of "studio logic". When they finally gave in and licensed the show it sold so well that they started their own VHS release for sale in retail outlets.)

With all of that said, can someone explain to me how Sports Night (a great show that uses lots of music) ever managed to get released?

Regards,

Joe

 

[James Reader]

I am wondering about Ally McBeal, though. Since Wanda Shepard sang most of the songs and she was part of the cast, maybe they have set up something a little bit different regarding her rights for it.

Peter Staddon has already stated that music issues mean that R1 season sets of Ally McBeal are unlikely.

 

[JohnAP]

That release of Sport's Night, along with Once & Again and Felicity, from Buena Vista last year was a surprise. Those, to me, seem like three of the most important tv dvd releases so far, not because of the quality of the programs, but because they didn't fit the standard for what had been released so far by other companies and, hopefully, opened the door for similar shows to see release. I think the only thing that prompted Buena Vista to release them was that they saw the shows were low-rated, but had significant fanbases who would buy them.

Did Sport's Night make it with all of the music intact? People were saying the Felicity set didn't. The only one of those three releases I own is the Once & Again set and, not having seen the first season when it originally aired, I can't speak as to whether or not all the music from the original broadcast was on the dvd.

 

[Dan Rudolph]

Vonda Shepard would be reasonable for Ally, but they'd still have to pay off the writers/owners of the songs. Plus, there are all the musical guests.

 

[Jeffrey Gray]

I have read (and believe) that the reason for all these music rights problems is because, when the music rights agreements were originally written up, television broadcasts were the only form of exhibition that the rights were cleared for. That's why several song sequences are cut out of video/DVD releases of, say, A Muppet Family Christmas, but when someone decides to rerun it on TV, they can include those scenes without problems.

Thus, if video/DVD is included in the contract from the beginning, as the case must be with recent movies (as we rarely hear about this problem regarding movies), wouldn't these clearance issues be neatly bypassed?

And how is it that studios have no problem clearing music rights for DVDs of older movies that have had music clearance issues in the past (cases in point: Johnny Dangerously, Trading Places, etc.)

 

[Mark Cappelletty]

Ugh-- what a depressing thread, particularly in regards to "WKRP," one of my favorites off all time. I'm absolutely appalled that reruns have been altered; I had no idea.

The music in "Homicide: Life On The Streets" hasn't been changed at all, has it? Best use of music on a TV show (that and "The Sopranos") ever.

 

[Joshua_Y]

I cant believe no one has mentioned Beavis and Butthead...what the hell is happening with getting those on DVD's...season sets...wasnt Paramount gonna do that after they saw the big preorders for the History set? I understand not putting the Videos on there...that would be just hell to get all the rights again...

 

[David Lambert]

I mentioned Beavis & Butthead back in post #31!

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Beavis and Butthead will NEVER be released in "full" form, music nightmare

Frankly I always wanted to FF past the videos anyway

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Did Sports Night make it with all of the music intact?

Since I never watched the show during its network run, only catching some of the reruns at 2 or 3 in the morning on Comedy Central, I couldn't swear to it either way. However, the fact that I noticed the number of recognizable popular songs used in the series, some seemingly recordings by the original artists, would indicate that the all or most of the music is the same.

I was especially amused to notice this in Sports Night because it has to be one of the few series in the history of television that actually made music rights and royalties a plot point. (Dan is presented with a bill from the network's legal department for a royalty payment for use of the song "Happy Birthday" - which is, indeed, still protected by copyright. Dan had sung it on air for Casey's birthday a few months earlier and the rights holders had somehow become aware of it, and submitted a bill.)

Re: Buena Vista getting it right (to the surprise of many. ):

As noted is currently being argued in another thread, I think DVD is the perfect way for the studios to realize a profit on short-run series that will probably remain a dead loss on their books otherwise. (Since most series cost more to produce per episode than the networks pay in licensing fees, and since it is very hard to syndicate a series with few than 100 or so episodes. There are plenty of one season or even half-season series that have serious fan bases that would love to own the shows on disc. Apart from hardcore genre shows of the type that are attractive to the Sci-Fi Channel as "chain-reaction" fodder, there is almost no other market for a show with between 13 and say, 75 completed episodes.)

Regards,

Joe

 

[Keith Paynter]

Home video is not the only format to suffer this scenario.

Does anybody have the CD Box Set of Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy radio series? Take special note as in one episode as our heroes land on Magrathea and explore it for the first time, strains of 'Shine On You Crazy Diamond' are heard on the soundtrack:

Arthur Dent: "Do you know that robot can hum like Pink Floyd? What else can you do Marvin?"
Marvin TPA (depressingly, of course): "Rock and Roll..." (heavily roboticized version of the Beatles singing "Rock And Roll Music" plays)

Later in the episode the 2001 theme is heard.

These segments were removed from the CD releases but were part of the broadcast version.

 

[Dave Miller]

Great discussion, btw.

I'm puzzeled by why music clearance rights are such an issue in many of the above TV shows. Help me understand this. Could the same thing be said about Forest Gump or Moulin Rouge that we are saying about WKRP or Miami Vice? Yet the previous two are out on DVD. Is there a difference in how movie liscensing works vs TV liscensing? Is the difference just the sheer volume of songs that would have to be cleared for a WKRP or Vice release? I'm sure Gump and Rouge weren't easy to release and may have even been in the nightmare catagory, but they are now out in their original form, so what gives?

I had no idea the Wonder Years is currently out in an altered home video version. Nor did I realize that some broadcasts of WKRP have been altered as well. This is crazy! When you think about those shows as well as Vice, what do you think of? THE MUSIC!!!!!!

These shows promote music, so why would the music industry not support the clearance of rights tbat would promote more of their product? Am I being too simplistic here?

Peace,

DM

 

[Ike]

Could the same thing be said about Forest Gump or Moulin Rouge that we are saying about WKRP or Miami Vice? Yet the previous two are out on DVD. Is there a difference in how movie liscensing works vs TV liscensing? Is the difference just the sheer volume of songs that would have to be cleared for a WKRP or Vice release? I'm sure Gump and Rouge weren't easy to release and may have even been in the nightmare catagory, but they are now out in their original form, so what gives?

As was mentioned earlier, Moulin Rouge and Forrest Gump were probably signed with clearance for home video versions. During WKRP's run, they had no foresight to license for video.

There have been some similar things for films-check out the Hunter S. Thompson film Where the Buffalo Roam.

 

[Matt.Koz]

"SCTV"! If only they could get all the clearance for that series...

Season 1 appears to be tentatively scheduled for Christmas of this year (possibly end of October).

 

[PienSavaca]

The series with hefty music rights need to be released in smaller chunks.... 4 episodes a disc, not full season sets.

More expensive total cost, but available.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Pien, it's an all-or-nothing situation, and they would get much better deals buying blocks of songs from labels

 

[EdHoch]

Great news on a potential "Ed" release....now if I could just get "Cupid" out there on DVD....

 

[Dan Rudolph]

Could the same thing be said about Forest Gump or Moulin Rouge that we are saying about WKRP or Miami Vice? Yet the previous two are out on DVD

These movie are both under the two and a half hour mark. They have a lot less music than the 8 or 9 hours of a season of a half-hour show. Plus the movies sell bigger to better offset the cost.

 

[Matthew_Millheiser]

Oh... so now I know what happened to Dokken's Into The Fire in Nightmare on Elm Street 3. :frowning: