The WWE™ (1 Viewer)

[Marvin Richardson]

Did I anywhere in my comments mention the Rock? No, I sure didn't. I'm not going to defend the Rock at all. He used to be funny, but the act has gotten old, and everytime he ducks out of the way and pretends to put his arm around the guy as they jump over him...uh, I mean "belly-to-belly suplexes" him I want to cry, especially when he does it to someone like Angle. But hey, what do I know, many of the fans love him, so good for him.

Never said Goldberg wasn't a great athlete, but calling him a wrestler is like calling Hulk Hogan an actor. It doesn't work. You liked Goldberg's interviews, eh? Where he looks at the camera and screams at the top of his lungs? Ok, but sounds vaguely familiar to Hulk Hogan to me. And of course the guy can have a decent interview once in a blue moon. The writers got lucky that night.

Oh, and there was a guy who was as physically gifted as him. Scott Steiner before he blew up. Some of the crap he used to do in the late 80's early 90's with his brother Rick was just absolutely amazing. Too bad now he's a big immobile hunk of meat.

And you know why that heel turn didn't work? There were two parties at blame; WCW and Goldberg. He didn't have the versatility to do anything with the part. Hell, even Hogan managed that! And so did Austin.

Hey, if you don't want to admit that Austin has wrestling ability and is an athlete, go ahead, but your opinions don't mean much to me when you say things like

As for wrestling, since when has Stone Cold done anything other than punch, kick, stunner.

Apparently my whole statement about wrestling Triple H and Angle last year went in one ear and out the other.

 

[Terrell]

Hey, I'm not saying Austin is bad. On the contrary. But let's face it, the WWF is a brawler's league. The majority of the wrestling fan's done care. Austin is good when he's in with a good opponent, as are most wrestlers. Yes, Austin had some wrestling talent. But nobody wants to see Goldberg wrestle a technical match, even though he has that ability. I know I don't.

Certainly, Goldberg is not the greatest on promos, but in his last two years, he gave promos as good as HHH, and I don't hear people complaining about him. Just because you don't cut over the top promos doesn't mean you're bad. Goldberg is about average on promos.

As for Goldberg's wrestling ability, you aren't born a great wrestler, you're made one. And Goldberg has the athletic ability to be one if he wanted. As for the marketing, Goldberg got over on less marketing than a lot of the big stars in WWF. Again, he used his own name and basically had no gimmick, ala The Rock or Stone Cold, not that there's anything wrong with that. Goldberg was practically over from the end of his very first match. He skyrocketed to the top for all the reasons Thi and I listed. And very little of that had to do with marketing. Certainly a big winning streak helped, but you can't just give anyone in wrestling a huge winning streak and make them into huge stars. That used to be an argument for people that disliked Goldberg.

You've got to have the size, the physique, the charisma, and the athleticism to become a huge star. Rock, Austin, Goldberg, Hogan, HHH, and a number of others have it. The vast majority don't.

 

[Terrell]

Yes, Austin had some wrestling talent.

But again, wrestlers aren't born, they're made. But nobody wants to see Goldberg wrestle. They want to see him fight. As for Steiner, he was a hell of an athlete. But he couldn't scoop slam and jackhammer Paul Wight, because he was never as strong as Goldberg. But he was a helluva athlete, and a great tagteam wrestler. As for Austin being a great athlete, well, let's put it this way. He's a good wrestler, but he's nowhere near the athlete that Goldberg is, and never was. He's more experienced than Goldberg and is a better wrestler now. But that's where the line ends.

Marvin, you don't become a megastar as fast and as big as Goldberg did without some talent. I know, at least from your tone, that you dislike him and don't want to give him any credit. But the man at one time was the biggest star in wrestling, and was always one of the top 3 with Austin and Rock. So give the man a little credit. I've given Austin some credit.

Another thing, calm down. You seem like you're ready to blow your top.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Mike, I believe the Austin match in question was against Chris Benoit when he gave him about 12 German suplexes in a row. That match was amazing on both an entertainment and technical level, really really great on both men's parts. If anything, Angle was copying that
Mind you, I LOVE Kurt Angle, I have since he originally hit the ring. The man took his world-class skill at amature wrestling and moved it into this new arena. The big thing is that he can actually act. You put him on the mic and he holds his own with the best guys in the buis (of which he is one), and has been that way from the get-go.
I just wish Mr. Perfect would wrestle on Smackdown, I always loved that character.

 

[Terrell]

Now Angle is a hell of a wrestler. I really like Angle. I even like Austin. Rock is getting old, well those over the top promos are anyway.

As for that match Jeff, it was Benoit that was utterly amazing. I though Benoit made Austin look better than he was. Benoit is great too. His only problem is he has not a speck of charisma. If he had charisma he'd be huge.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Agreed, Benoit is the exact opposite. Someone with HUGE talent, but no charisma or mic skills. Sometimes the fans do it right, and put someone over because they're that damn good.

 

[Bill Geiger]

To answer some questions, as Jim Ross noted on the WWF website in his Ross Report, Nidia is getting ready for her first match in OVW, I believe.

As for Hayabusa, last I heard he is in re-hab. I don't believe he has any feeling in his lower half (neck down). That guy is just incredible and really, a loss to the Japanese wrestling scene. I don't get to watch wrestling from Japan as often as I would like, but I have/had a tape of him and he is something to see. Picture Sabu, with a mask.

Also, as was reported on 1wrestling.com Billy & Chuck vs. APA has been pulled from WM X-18.

 

[Bill Geiger]

Also, I believe it was Kurt Angle that gave Austin the 12 suplexes. The match was one of the best matches I have ever seen. This was during the Austin (Alliance) time and when the announcers were claiming that Austin could not beat Angle.

Some of the best Raw matches ever in my opinion... just to add something new....

Bret Hart vs 1-2-3 Kid (X-Pac) (WWF Championship)

Austin/HHH vs. Benoit/Jericho (WWF Tag Team Championship)

Triple H vs Taka Michinoku (WWF Championship)

Jericho vs Triple H (WWF Championship where Jericho won and then was overturned).

Also want to mention that I feel Kane is very talented and has come a long way since Issac Jankem and "The New" Diesel. One of his best matches was against Steve Austin, (No Way Out, 1999 I believe) where he won the WWF title, then later lost it on Raw the next night.

Also, be on the lookout for a split in the company.... should give others some time to shine.. and maybe, just maybe, give the lightweights some decent air time. If Paul Heyman is given the chance to show what he can really do, his booking is some of the best. Just take a look at what he did for ECW. Misterio vs. Juvi, Eddy Guerrero vs. Dean Melenko just to name a couple.

Long live Brakkus... hee hee.... now that was something else.

 

[Robert Cranwell]

I hope you guys realize this stuff is just a constant soap opera with a great deal of involvement of physical ability. No one wins the Title per se. Its what works for ratings and to make a great story keep going week to week. Did anyone ever see how much is involved to make just one match go. I've seen one of Pat Patterson's playbooks for one match and its as big a TV guide. Most of these guys are good friends, that have to be. They spend more time with each other than their own families.

 

[Timothy Alexander]

I hope you guys realize this stuff is just a constant soap opera with a great deal of involvement of physical ability. No one wins the Title per se. Its what works for ratings and to make a great story keep going week to week. Did anyone ever see how much is involved to make just one match go. I've seen one of Pat Patterson's playbooks for one match and its as big a TV guide. Most of these guys are good friends, that have to be. They spend more time with each other than their own families.

I just love people who think wrestling fans don't know this.

 

[Marvin Richardson]

I hope you guys realize this stuff is just a constant soap opera with a great deal of involvement of physical ability. No one wins the Title per se. Its what works for ratings and to make a great story keep going week to week. Did anyone ever see how much is involved to make just one match go. I've seen one of Pat Patterson's playbooks for one match and its as big a TV guide. Most of these guys are good friends, that have to be. They spend more time with each other than their own families.

Gee, thanks for the revelation there guy. I don't know too many people who watch wrestling who are over the age of ten who don't realize that. Some people just kill me.
By the way, did anyone watch Tough Enough 2? Did you see that guy who was talking crap about Taz, and then he's reaction when Taz showed up at the end and got in his face? That was hilarious!

 

[Terrell]

I hope you guys realize this stuff is just a constant soap opera with a great deal of involvement of physical ability.

You can't be serious.

 

[teapot2001]

It was great when Benoit did one German suplex after another, I didn't know when he would stop. I enjoyed it so much that I started laughing.

Goldberg is good on the mic. His style is different, and I admit it took me a while to warm up to it. His hatred for WWF is nonsense: WWF right now has been toned down to what WCW used to be, and he wants to be a hero to children but he crushes his opponents and supposedly acts violent in public.

How about the news of Bret Hart being offered to appear at Wrestlemania?

~T

 

[Chuck C]

What?

 

[Marvin Richardson]

"I personally believe that everything I stood for when I got into the ring would be compromised and succumbed to the circus-like atmosphere that's out there, and that's putting it mildly," Goldberg said. "I would would be an imbecile if I gave up half my money to work for a company I didn't respect."

Funny, he didn't seem to have a problem being in an angle with Scott Steiner where he jack-hammered Midajah through a table and Steiner put his "wife" (I'm not sure if she was his wife or just an actress) in the Steiner recliner. I see, violence against women is okay but bra and panty matches aren't. Ok, I get it.

 

[Mike Miskulin]

Thank god the Billy & Chuck/APA match has been pulled. After watching Smackdown, I saw all I needed of that match and look forward to something with a little more razzle dazzle at the big show.

c'mon TLC III

What's this about the Hitman?

mike.

 

[Terrell]

Funny, he didn't seem to have a problem being in an angle with Scott Steiner where he jack-hammered Midajah through a table and Steiner put his "wife" (I'm not sure if she was his wife or just an actress) in the Steiner recliner. I see, violence against women is okay but bra and panty matches aren't. Ok, I get it.

Again you're comparing this with Mark Henry having sex with 70+ year old woman. Receiving oral sex. Grown men kissing Vince's bare butt. Need I go on? And this statement purely goes to show that you obviously don't know much about Goldberg or ever watched WCW much. That was not his girlfriend. That was a stunt woman, otherwise an actress hired to play his girlfriend. He doesn't even have a wife. And you didn't know that. Why am I even arguing with you. You detest him, like I care. Go on detesting him. Boy, why do I even bother. I've only watched wrestling once in the last month, it's been so bad.

 

[Marvin Richardson]

Whatever Terrel.

Since we're talking about the WWF here and not WCW, does anyone even care right now about the NWO? I don't know, I guess the attack on the Rock should have ended before the truck ramming the ambulance thing. Their confrontation in the ring was awesome, and some of the best mic work I've seen from either of them. Now I'm having a hard time caring.

Austin/Hall looks a little more interesting, and Hall, who is the most innately talented of the three when he's not in self-destructive mode, has a better chance of putting together a good match with Austin than Hogan does with Rock. I wonder why Nash doesn't have a match yet. Are they worried they might have to get rid of Hall suddenly and want a backup plan?

Triple H/Chris Jericho should at least be an excellent wrestling match, even if they aren't doing that great of a job building Jericho up. He comes across as needing too much help, and I think a heel is more effective when the fans think there is a chance he can beat someone on his own.

I wonder what will happen to the tag titles. Thank God they ditched the Chuck/Billy vs APA thing. APA are entertaining enough in small doses, but tag title match? Against Chuck and Billy? I really wish they'd get rid of those two. Billy Gunn has done nothing but irritate me ever since the New Age Outlaws broke up the first time. At least when he shows up I know I can have a cigarette break.

Angle vs. Kane. Poor Angle, he's going to have a hard time pulling a good match out of Kane.

Flair vs. Undertaker. Undertaker has really stepped it up in interviews lately, building this feud well, but in the ring, I just don't see either of them being able to do much.

Hopefully Wrestlemania will be able to somewhat live up to last year's incredble show (one of the five best PPVs I've ever seen) but it won't be easy.

 

[Terrell]

I watched the NWO when they came back for one or two episodes. Then I left. It looked like a complete rehash of the WCW angle. What the WWF needs is some new blood and some creative writing. I mean, this is wrestling, and they rarely have any wrestling on the show. That night I think they had a total of 18 minutes of wrestling on a two hour show. Pitiful. The only thing the NWO adds is some variety. The problem is that variety comes in the flavor of a 50+ year old man who looks it. And Nash, a guy who wrestles like a 50 year old. Hall is the best of the three, but he's only compelling with Nash as a team.

The NWO angle has been blead to death. I'd have preferred to see them come back as a faction, but not the NWO. That angle has been beaten to death. Also Jericho, Angle, and some others deserve some main event time. Some new angles need to be created. Surprise us and quit grasping for ratings straws is my suggestion for McMahon. And whatever they do, get that terrible, irritating Stephanie off the TV.

 

[Marvin Richardson]

Well, the only thing I'll say in defense of the NWO angle right now, is I was really worried that they'd come in and do what they did in WCW...take over the whole show. At least they haven't done that. They are targeting 2 guys right now, and haven't started interfering in every match. I thought that was what would happen, because Vince said he was going to destroy the WWF. The only way the NWO can do that now is if they bore the audience to death.

Yeah, I think the electricity of Hogan vs. Rock is going to sputter once they both have to get in the ring and wrestle. Maybe Hogan will pull out some of those wrestling skills that I know he has, but never uses. Saw a tape of him from Japan years ago, I think it was between when he left WWF and went to WCW, and he can actually wrestle. He's no Kurt Angle, but he's also no Viscera, if you know what I mean.

I'm kind of interested to see where on the card they place Triple H vs. Y2J. You'd think it would be last match of the night since it is for the WWF Title, but they've been known to move the title match down for what they consider a bigger non-title match. I hope not, as Jericho deserves a little main event spotlight in a one-on-one match.