The Grinch P&S kicks widescreens butt. (1 Viewer)

[Scott Weinberg]

Did I hear someone say that "Moron Movies" will be released in Fullscreen? I used to love those shorts on The Tonight Show!

 

[Marc Colella]

I only think pan and scan outsold widescreen as pan and scan was offered everywhere compared to the widescreen which wasn't...

Regardless of why it's outselling widescreen... the fact is the P&S version sold well.

If people didn't want P&S, they wouldn't have bought it (or would have returned if bought in error).

Studios are looking at this and thinking that the average consumer doesn't care that it's P&S.

 

[Aubrey]

Honestly, do we really need to raise our kids in a strict code of OAR?

Yup. Imagine, raising a whole generation of youth free of the oppressive shackles of P&S. "Won't somebody please think of the children!!!"
PS Tom, please scoop your poop. We don't like messes around here

 

[Keith_R]

So Kids are morons? Were you just speaking of yours or everybody's kids in general?

Actually I don't have kids but if I did I probably would have been offended by your comments.I don't think kids are morons, I was just saying that kids do not care as much about OAR, therefore I don't understand why we are so critical if a movie like the Grinch outsells WS with P&S. My point is OAR is important, yes, but I think we are all becoming a bit to critical. I'm not criticizing anyones taste in film. frankly I think we should be a little more laxed in all this stuff. I'd just like to clear this up and apologize to anyone that may have taken my comments out of context.

 

[PatrickL]

Well, being that of the 45+ P&S vs. 4 WS that were on the self at Wal-Mart when I got mine, it may be a matter of supply, not demand.

The supply issue was even worse in my neck of the woods. In my area, the 4 nearest stores stocked ONLY p&s, both for rental AND for sale. I asked at one for the WS version for sale, and was told that it "wasn't made that way." When I insisted that there was a WS version, I was told it could be had, at full list price (not the sale price of the in-stock p&s), as a "special order." Disgusted, I tried my luck at the local Sam Goody's (which sells, but doesn't rent, dvds) and encountered the same situation. A full wall of p&s Grinch, and - get this!- the outright lie again that no WS version had been released. This is a store that STILL only stocks the non-WS Willy Wonka, by the way.

I don't care a bit what someone else wants to watch on their HT but I find the numbers depressing because I don't think this was a fair match, and I'm wary of how the industry will interpret the numbers. I do wonder how many of these p&s Grinch discs are Christmas presents, bought by less-than-careful consumers who are in for a Grinchly surprise on the 25th.

 

[Mike Mallory]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We're never going to be out of the woods until we convince the studios to include both versions on every disc. Nobody complains about "Shrek". Why? Because it contains both versions, as every movie should.

- Mike

 

[Brian Lawrence]

but PLEASE COME ON!

Oh my God!!! Pearl Harbor and 2001: A Space Odyssey in the same sentence

 

[Charles J P]

Edited to reflect my agreement with David Lambert a few posts down the line.

 

[Patrick McCart]

The REAL Grinch is OAR-only on DVD. (The 1966 Chuck Jones masterpiece.)
"What is wrong with these people
I must - must see, for that he
who buys the pan & scan version
just bought a bunch of poopie!"
The reason for the 2:1 ratio is because Santa is going to use the P&S version of Grinch in place of coal.

 

[Ed St. Clair]

I believe most on this forum view the OAR vs. P&S [as well as the mono vs.'remastered surround'] issue to that of Democracy vs. Communism. If you allow one country or film to fall, it's too many!

If your out to protect film, you have to take that stance. If your out to be entertained the line is blurred.

 

[David Lambert]

C'mon guys...let's leave Tom alone at this point. Dan Brecher has handled it, as we can all tell by his "you've got mail" post. I believe his intent was to let us know that he was handling it, and that we should leave off.
I know I've posted some things that didn't fit in when I was a newbie (not that long ago!), and my behind was smarting after the spankin'. We don't need to pile on, okay?
Back to the topic: On the one hand, the PS version beat the WS version. Fuck. On the other hand, the title that DIDN'T split their sales between two AR formats kicked the ass off The Grinch. Good for them; maybe next time Universal won't split into two SKUs. Shit; if they do that, then maybe they'll ONLY offer the PS version...
Universal: do you want me to come over there and kick your ass? NO OAR = NO SALE!

 

[Seth Paxton]

Yeah, while I agree with the points, Dan was all over this one right away so no need for further "help". In fact, his "you've got mail" made me feel pretty happy.
ANYWAY, somewhere in this thread was going to be a real point I would guess. So how about this one...
GRINCH PLAY SETS = Pan and Scan only. Think about it. If you are buying your kids the playset, you've just voted for P&S whether you wanted to or not. That HAS to skew the numbers.
Now my only question is, is that intentional on Universal's part or did they just want to keep their playset inventory under control (2 versions mean more unused product in the market because you will always run out of one before the other).
Maybe both. Maybe the studios would LOVE to get to a 1 version inventory with DVD to allow them to make even MORE money. So they start pushing the market around to justify having only the P&S versions.
Could be, it's not THAT insidious a plan to be ridiculous.

 

[Jeff]

Probably because the P&S version is in an attractive green case where as the widescreen is not.

 

[Sean Conklin]

Probably because the P&S version is in an attractive green case where as the widescreen is not.

Jeff, I think it's the other way around, My widescreen copy is in the green keepcase, I think the P&S is in the black case.

Another point is that I don't think Universal made it clear enough as to which one was WS and which one was P&S, I know, for my Birthday my brother got me the P&S version, and after a few minutes of looking over my new collectors edition Grinch, I was horrified when I noticed it was fullframe.

Luckily my bro gave me the receipt to exchange it for the proper copy! He knows I am very pro OAR, and he would only buy me OAR, but he didn't realize it was P&S because the packaging is not clearly marked, sounds like it might be a dirty trick, I dunno.

But that's what I'm saying, to the average consumer WS might be okay, but with the discreet packaging "average consumer" gets it home and finds it full frame, and thinks "oh ok, I guess it doesn't matter".

I think Universal should have made it more clear as to which copy was which!

Keep up the OAR fight guys!!

 

[Charles J P]

Actually, I dont know if there is any rhyme or reason to the packaging at all. I originally bought the P&S version in my excitement to find it on sale cheap, and then realized it was the wrong version before I opened it. It had black plastic and the fullscreen banner on the top of the cover art. I traded it for the WS version, which was green plastic and had the WS banner. Then I was in K-mart, and noticed that they had all WS grinches, like 40 of them.... nope, look closer, and about 90% of them were P&S, but ALL of them had the green plastic. The only differenc was the P&S or WS banner on the cover.

 

[AaronMK]

The P&S outsold the WS. Granted it is sad that most people have a complete lack of respect for the movies they watch, but there was an identical (extra features and qualtiy wise) OAR release available.

True, it would be great if P&S was scrapped and this was a nonissue. It would be great if directors finally took a stand and insisted in only OAR presantations (why certian directors with more leverage have not done so is beyonfd me). Unfortunetly, I don't see these things happening anytime soon.

As great as America is, this is the country that completely resisted the switch to the much superior metric system that the rest of the world uses, so why would we expect anything different with a switch to OAR?

I think the battle for OAR should be directed at studios who would try releasing releasing P&S only for any film. It looks like Fox is joining this crowd. They are the last studio I expected to see to make this move.

The battle should also be aimed at making it so stores and rental outlets carry both versions in ample quantities. There is no reason this can't happen. Don't give me this multiple SKU crap. People should not have to go to greater lengths to buy or rent a movie in an non-butchered form.

If availabilty and access to comperable OAR releases were not an issue, then I wouldn't care if P&S outsold OAR.

 

[Sean Conklin]

If availabilty and access to comperable OAR releases were not an issue, then I wouldn't care if P&S outsold OAR.

Yes, this would be ideal for movies that are released or being considered for release in P&S ONLY!
But the only correct solution(however impossible to see at this point) is to not release P&S at all! My elitist view is: All DVD's should be released in OAR, and the consumer should have the option of buying the movie or NOT buying the movie!
Just to show I am not sitting on my high horse (yet ), in my HT room I have a 31" 4:3 direct view TV! Of course a 16:9 is in my future. Until then, my WS mattes are awesome!!

 

[Seth Paxton]

And again, there are THREE versions...WS, P&S, and Limited Edition (Interactive Playset).
http://www.lasersedge.com/title/20093
Now if you were buying, say, 2001 which would you get, the WS or the Limited Edition.
The fact that the Limited Edition is P&S ONLY is a problem and I would say it's a bit misleading that the "ultimate" version is a non-collectors version of the film.
I would like to see the numbers with the Limited Edition removed from the numbers and see how they match up.
Not to mention the shipping and stocking practices by some of these studios/stores.
BEST BUY - Cats and Dogs. Here they now have both, great. But on the new release rack the people go to first it's ALL P&S, then back in the children's section they have put all the WS.
There is such a thing as pushing product to affect sales. I think there is some feeling that at a time when OAR could be gaining respect and support from the studios (w/ the DVD transition) that SOME of them might actually be PUSHING P&S. To me that is a big problem.

 

[Sean Conklin]

that SOME of them might actually be PUSHING P&S. To me that is a big problem.

That is a big problem! Isn't it more work for a studio to butcher and bastardize a film than it is to make an OAR copy? I don't understand their reasoning!

The OAR versions SHOULD be the first ones a consumer comes across at a B&M!!

 

[Martin Fontaine]

What I still don't understand is WHY do they want to make people believe that watching movies in P&S is better? Here in Quebec they do the same issue with languages. They try to make people believe that watching movies in french is better than than the OSL English. Translations are just another form of movie butchery that they should stop making people believe that it's better and/or good enough as opposed to the proper OAR/OSL version.
The theater down the street from here had 6 Screens of Harry Potter in French and 1 Screen of Harry Potter in English. I wonder how many people, preferring original version went to see it in french because the one and only screen with the proper version was sold out. I went to see it at a much better theater anyway (which had an IMAX Screen!) which carries only OSL film despite all the presure. According to the manager, whenever someone from the Office De La Langue Francaise comes to try to convince them to play movies in french - he gives them the finger! Good for them, they are the best movie theater in town mainly because they play proper versions.
2 Years ago, when I went to that same theater (The one that had 6 French Potters that is) to see Phantom Menace, they had the same problem, 6 French Screens vs 1 English Screen, and I had to try 3 times to get tickets because the OSL Screen was sold out. I will not tolerate translations the same as with P&S. No OAR = No Sale and No OSL = No Sale. Of course the girl behind the counter went on about french being my first language, that I should have no problem with seeing it in french and stuff...
She didn't get the point, just like clerks at stores trying to sell you the P&S version will try to convince you that the Full Screen version is good enough anyway, the whole argument about being open matte, Super 35 or that the lost info on the side isn't all that important and stuff and blah blah blah and... "No OAR = No Sale and No OSL = No Sale I hate it when people don't listen to me!!!" Like I tell them after they try convince me that a movie in P&S and/or in french is good enough anyway.
Ah it's good to vent sometimes!