The Great HTF Music Challenge (1 Viewer)

[JohnRice]

Stan Getz - Oscar Peterson Trio - Original Jazz Sound

I was sound asleep at the 7 second mark. Seriously though, with rare exceptions, Jazz is just a form of music I can't really get into. This would have been fine as background music in a lounge setting but to actively listen to it seems odd to me.

LOL! You and I have a LOT of similar interests, but our taste in music is clearly NOT one of them. I think it's probably safe to expect many of my favorites will come across as boring. Not a problem, I hear that a lot, aboout music and movies.

You're sort of new here so we'll overlook it but that exactly what @BobO'Link is.

Cool. I actually come from an extensive music heritage, though for various reasons I didn't take that route myself. I still have a hearty interest in it and took every music history and appreciation course available at my alma-mater. Howie and I might have a lot to discuss and a lot to agree about. All the more reason I need to listen to that "Love Hurts" to try and extract the source, if I can.

 

[JohnRice]

Yep. She's the real deal. All I can say is, WOW!!!

Miss Li - Love Hurts (Live "Moraeus Med Mera")​

OK, no surprise, Howie is correct that this has the same changes as the familiar song. The lyrics are different, and the composer of the original is different from who is credited here. So, my question to Howie is... "When does it cease to be the same song?" This strikes me as being as different as possible, without going so far as being a different song.

 

[BobO'Link]

OK, no surprise, Howie is correct that this has the same changes as the familiar song. The lyrics are different, and the composer of the original is different from who is credited here. So, my question to Howie is... "When does it cease to be the same song?" This strikes me as being as different as possible, without going so far as being a different song.

That's a very good question that doesn't have a very good answer. Basically when the courts say it's not the same.

If I were the songwriter of the original "Love Hurts" I'd be looking at some type of royalty for that remake - starting with a nicely worded letter and following up with a nice lawyer if necessary. The thing is, you're on more shaky ground with just chord changes in play as lots and lots of songs share identical chord structures (listen to blues - you hear it all the time) - it greatly helps if there's some commonality with melody at some point. Fortunately, the Miss Li version of "Love Hurts" has a bit of that in the chorus making collecting royalties a possibility.

It's all quite complicated. Harrison lost his suit (this one's less clear as there are several distinctive areas that are almost identical). Led Zeppelin won theirs (though, IMHO, Zeppelin should have won as the similarity in "Stairway to Heaven" and "Taurus" by Spirit is tenuous at best involving mainly the 5 opening notes).

 

[JohnRice]

Led Zeppelin won theirs (though, IMHO, Zeppelin should have won as the similarity in "Stairway to Heaven" and "Taurus" by Spirit is tenuous at best involving mainly the 5 opening notes).

What about all the stuff Zeppelin ripped off from Robert Johnson, not crediting him until decades later?

Did you mean Zeppelin should NOT have won?

 

[JohnRice]

The thing is, you're on more shaky ground with just chord changes in play as lots and lots of songs share identical chord structures (listen to blues - you hear it all the time)

That's the truth. How many songs are virtually identical to this?

 

[BobO'Link]

What about all the stuff Zeppelin ripped off from Robert Johnson, not crediting him until decades later?

Did you mean Zeppelin should NOT have won?

No, Zeppelin *should* have and *did* win the "Taurus" suit. Outside the first 4 or 5 notes the two songs have nothing in common. And, yes, they ripped off lots of blues artists along the way. They were called out early and regularly but no one brought suit so they ignored it.

 

[BobO'Link]

That's the truth. How many songs are virtually identical to this?

That one is, essentially, a cover of Robert Johnson's "I Believe I'll Dust My Broom" with only minor lyrics changes, itself which is a variation on an earlier song called "I Believe I'll Make A Change" from Pinetop and Lindberg (twin brothers):



Elmore James covered it:



As did ZZ Top:



And the original version, "I Believe I'll Make A Change" from Pinetop and Lindberg:

 

[sleroi]

Ive mentioned Faces a few times but havent posted anything by them. So since the topic of similar songs has come up here's a song the avclub calls "one of the best Some Kind of Wonderdul ripoffs in existence." I dont know how there wasnt a lawsuit.





I did enjoy the Stan Getz track, but I had to look at the spoiler to get the answer, wich surprises me because I was a huge Harlem Globetrotters fan as a kid. Listening again I can hear it a little in the beginning.

 

[JohnRice]

Ive mentioned Faces a few times but havent posted anything by them. So since the topic of similar songs has come up here's a song the avclub calls "one of the best Some Kind of Wonderdul ripoffs in existence." I dont know how there wasnt a lawsuit.





I did enjoy the Stan Getz track, but I had to look at the spoiler to get the answer, wich surprises me because I was a huge Harlem Globetrotters fan as a kid. Listening again I can hear it a little in the beginning.

I’ve never heard of Small Faces before. I’m guessing that’s Rod prior to joining The Jeff Beck Group.

Pretty blatant copy. Fun all the same.

 

[sleroi]

I’ve never heard of Small Faces before. I’m guessing that’s Rod prior to joining The Jeff Beck Group.

Pretty blatant copy. Fun all the same.

After the Jeff Beck group. Thats also a pre rolling stones Ron Wood on guitar. He also played with Beck.

 

[JohnRice]

After the Jeff Beck group. Thats also a pre rolling stones Ron Wood on guitar. He also played with Beck.

Yeah! That’s Ronnie in the middle. I knew I recognized him, but couldn’t place him.

 

[BobO'Link]

I’ve never heard of Small Faces before. I’m guessing that’s Rod prior to joining The Jeff Beck Group.

Pretty blatant copy. Fun all the same.

The group was called by the new name, Faces, in the UK at that time but were called Small Faces on the US release due to record executives wanting to cash in on the earlier name. This was their first album after forming out of Small Faces and the Jeff Beck Group. After this release they went by Faces. Rod Stewart had also signed a separate solo contract but still sang for Faces with some of their singles being credited as "Rod Stewart and Faces."

 

[JohnRice]

The group was called by the new name, Faces, in the UK at that time but were called Small Faces on the US release due to record executives wanting to cash in on the earlier name. This was their first album after forming out of Small Faces and the Jeff Beck Group. After this release they went by Faces. Rod Stewart had also signed a separate solo contract but still sang for Faces with some of their singles being credited as "Rod Stewart and Faces."

Clearly that’s a sliver of music history I completely missed, even though I’ve long been very aware of The JBG.

 

[BobO'Link]

Here are a couple of tracks from Small Faces with Itchykoo Park being the one that got the most airplay in the US:

"Small Faces - "Itchykoo Park":



"Here Come the Nice":

 

[BobO'Link]

Ive mentioned Faces a few times but havent posted anything by them. So since the topic of similar songs has come up here's a song the avclub calls "one of the best Some Kind of Wonderdul ripoffs in existence." I dont know how there wasnt a lawsuit.





I did enjoy the Stan Getz track, but I had to look at the spoiler to get the answer, wich surprises me because I was a huge Harlem Globetrotters fan as a kid. Listening again I can hear it a little in the beginning.

It's absolutely amazing there wasn't a lawsuit over that one. It's almost a direct rip with little but the lyrics changed to protect the innocent... I was never much a fan of the Faces and had not heard that one before.

 

[JohnRice]

Here are a couple of tracks from Small Faces with Itchykoo Park being the one that got the most airplay in the US:

"Small Faces - "Itchykoo Park":



"Here Come the Nice":

I definitely know Itchykoo Park. That stuff dates back to when I was in single digits age and just played Top 40 radio, rarely ever knowing who it was. Unless I reconnected with it later in life, like The Jeff Beck Group, I never knew who it was. Plus, there were SOO many one hit wonders back then.

 

[JohnRice]

Ive mentioned Faces a few times but havent posted anything by them. So since the topic of similar songs has come up here's a song the avclub calls "one of the best Some Kind of Wonderdul ripoffs in existence." I dont know how there wasnt a lawsuit.





I did enjoy the Stan Getz track, but I had to look at the spoiler to get the answer, wich surprises me because I was a huge Harlem Globetrotters fan as a kid. Listening again I can hear it a little in the beginning.

OK, wanting to avoid TheWrathOfJohn, I'll contribute some impressions. Unfortunately, that's just a weak imitation of an awesome song. Again, growing up in the '70s, my first exposure to Some Kind of Wonderful was the '70 Pop/Rock band who did (as I now know) a rather unimaginative imitation of it. Without looking it up, I want to say Grand Funk Railroad? I'm not saying it wasn't good, but that they didn't do anything with it that hadn't already been done. I love imaginitive covers. Not just copying. For example, the most criminal, gutless, highway robbery rip-off of all time is probably David Lee Roth burglarizing Louis Prima with Just a Gigolo/Ain't Got Nobody back in the '80s . Every nuance is a total imitation. The guy should give every cent he made of that abomination to Prima's and Smith's descendants.





At the same time, there are plenty of awesome, imaginative covers. I think I'll get to some of my faves.

 

[JohnRice]

So...

Here's one I stumbled across a couple days ago. A Metal version (anyone surprised?) of Seal's Kiss From a Rose.

 

[BobO'Link]

OK, wanting to avoid TheWrathOfJohn, I'll contribute some impressions. Unfortunately, that's just a weak imitation of an awesome song. Again, growing up in the '70s, my first exposure to Some Kind of Wonderful was the '70 Pop/Rock band who did (as I now know) a rather unimaginative imitation of it. Without looking it up, I want to say Grand Funk Railroad? I'm not saying it wasn't good, but that they didn't do anything with it that hadn't already been done. I love imaginitive covers. Not just copying. For example, the most criminal, gutless, highway robbery rip-off of all time is probably David Lee Roth burglarizing Louis Prima with Just a Gigolo/Ain't Got Nobody back in the '80s . Every nuance is a total imitation. The guy should give every cent he made of that abomination to Prima's and Smith's descendants.





At the same time, there are plenty of awesome, imaginative covers. I think I'll get to some of my faves.

Yes, it was Grand Funk who covered "Some Kind of Wonderful." It's nothing special but is at least listenable.

Roth "Burglarizing" Prima didn't bother me - he did OK on it but it also brought Prima into focus and people rediscovered his music.

It's not unlike the Swing Revival of the late 90s...

Brian Setzer Orchestra - "Stray Cat Strut":



Brian Setzer Orchestra - "Jump Jive and Wail" (another Prima cover):



Louis Prima - "Jump Jive An' Wail":



The Cherry Poppin' Daddies - "Zoot Suit Riot":

 

[JohnRice]

Yes, it was Grand Funk who covered "Some Kind of Wonderful." It's nothing special but is at least listenable.

Roth "Burglarizing" Prima didn't bother me - he did OK on it but it also brought Prima into focus and people rediscovered his music.

It's not unlike the Swing Revival of the late 90s...

Brian Setzer Orchestra - "Stray Cat Strut":



Brian Setzer Orchestra - "Jump Jive and Wail" (another Prima cover):



Louis Prima - "Jump Jive An' Wail":



The Cherry Poppin' Daddies - "Zoot Suit Riot":

I love all of those. The "California Swing" era in the '90s was a lot of fun. Brian Setzer in particular really did something with it. I also like his cover of himself with "Rock This Town".

I guess David Lee Roth's imitation of Gigolo annoys me because it was a total imitation. Every nuance was Prima. Roth brought absolutely nothing to it. But, you're right that it did bring awareness to Prima.