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The Flash - season 5 (The CW) (1 Viewer)

Adam Lenhardt

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Sherloque's kind of a dick; he could see that Nora was about to fess up, so he swoops in for the grand reveal and poisons the well for her.

The only way I see Thawne telling Nora to tell Barry everything is if he thinks Barry will help him once he knows the whole story.

The Grace iteration of Cicada is just kind of evil for evil's sake, which is boring.
 

TonyD

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So, the pronunciation of his name.
Is this some inside joke or something that’s going over my head because every time he corrects someone, he says it and it sounds like it’s exqctly the same.
 

Gary Seven

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My reference was simply he sounded like a detective iterating his theory, after piecing it altogether. I liked it and Nora needed to be put in her place.
 

TonyD

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I wasn’t talking about what you posted I was talking about within the show itself.
 

NeilO

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Sherloque's kind of a dick; he could see that Nora was about to fess up, so he swoops in for the grand reveal and poisons the well for her.

The only way I see Thawne telling Nora to tell Barry everything is if he thinks Barry will help him once he knows the whole story.

The Grace iteration of Cicada is just kind of evil for evil's sake, which is boring.
Nora was really having trouble getting it out. I'm not convinced she was going to tell the truth.

I can't believe that Barry says they need "Grace's consent" on the cure. They definitely won't get the grown up version - she's psychotic. The child one isn't much better and they already had parental [or guardian] consent. I think they did say there may be some medical reason for not going ahead right away, but that is clearly what they need to do.

Meanwhile, there was the Lost reference at the top of the show.
 
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Garysb

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When the show returns on April 16th it will be preempted in the New York City area for baseball. It's a shame they can't arrange to show baseball on over the air TV on weeks when a show it is replacing is a rerun. Especially this early in the season. Still its the Yankees vs the Red Soxs. The Flash will probably air on Saturday depending on weekend baseball and will be available for streaming on the CW app on Wednesday, the day after it airs. Just have to avoid websites that give spoilers. Its annoying for a show o be off for a month and the night it is scheduled to return it is preempted.
 

Adam Lenhardt

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This week was the first time in a long time where "Arrow" and "The Flash" were both better than "Legends of Tomorrow".

I give the show credit for leaning into Nora as a villain, even if she's sure to be redeemed sooner or later.

And as evil as Eobard Thawne is, I always suspected that he secretly liked being "the guy in the chair" (to quote Ned from Spider-Man: Homecoming) for Team Flash.

Cicada (I & II) are the least interesting things about the show, which is a problem.
 

Thomas Newton

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Cicada (I & II) are the least interesting things about the show, which is a problem.

The Cicadas have had an huge amount of exposure, for obscure villains.

It would be nice if they would now disappear for 13 or 17 years, like real cicadas, by which time this TV show will have ended…
 

Sam Favate

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Okay, this season has come off the rails. As we head into the season finale, we find that everything that has happened all along this season is part of Thawne's plan? How can all the random events have been coordinated? That kind of plot device destroys credibility. Also, why is Thawne wearing Harrison Wells' face? Because he likes it? WTF? We saw Thawne using his own face in Legends and the last time we saw him on Flash, so this is another point that makes no sense. (Obviously, it's to avoid paying another actor, since the actor who plays Wells is a regular.)

Can we talk about Chris Klein this season? Wow. Nothing against him as an actor (he's been just fine in the past), but this is a terrible part. His voice is nothing but grumbles, growls and whispers. No one in the world talks that way. It's awful. And its laughable. (I have the same complaint, BTW, about Kirk Acevedo on Arrow this and last season.)

The CW shows have been really suffering this year (although Black Lightning turned in a good season, and Legends is still entertaining if silly). I think Team Berlanti has over-extended itself. They're not only doing all these CW shows (5 DC shows and Riverdale) but also Titans and Doom Patrol over on the DC streaming service. Say what you will about that service, but those shows do not follow the formula the CW shows do at all. (Titans was okay, but too violent and profane, BUT Doom Patrol is a real gem.)

I'm at the point where I just don't want to give them 100+ hours of my time again next year.
 

NeilO

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Okay, this season has come off the rails. As we head into the season finale, we find that everything that has happened all along this season is part of Thawne's plan? How can all the random events have been coordinated? That kind of plot device destroys credibility.

I am hoping there is a logical explanation to what has happened this season. It all seems a bit much including Cicada 2 time traveling. Did Thawne arrange that as well?
 

Garysb

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Glad Nora is gone. A version of her will probably be in the Crisis. No hint about next year's villain which is unusual for the Flash. Confused about Cisco. It seemed like he was leaving the show during the scene where he took the cure but I can't see him leaving without a big farewell from everyone else. Just odd. Hope Ralph meets Sue as hinted at with the name on the folder in his office. No new info on the Crisis, just the date change to 2019 which we already knew.
 

Adam Lenhardt

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This was right up there with the first season finale of "Legends" for the most nonsensical version of time travel-related causality. We've seen before that timeline changes ripple out from the point of the change, so Nora should have been erased from existence before the ripples ever reached Thawne in the future.

Glad Nora is gone. A version of her will probably be in the Crisis.
I liked Nora a lot, and I liked what she did for the show, but her story felt complete so it made sense that she's gone. I wish the Arrowverse shows in general were better at letting characters go once they've run out of story.

No hint about next year's villain which is unusual for the Flash.
Both this finale and the "Arrow" finale foreshadowed Crisis on Infinite Earths. I wonder of the "Supergirl" and "Legends" finales will as well. If so, it's quite possible that all four shows will spend their first chunk of episodes building toward the crossover event, and then the shows (other than "Arrow") will spend the remainder of their seasons dealing with the fallout.

Confused about Cisco. It seemed like he was leaving the show during the scene where he took the cure but I can't see him leaving without a big farewell from everyone else. Just odd.
It was definitely weird. I'm wondering if the finale was shot with the understanding that Carlos Valdes was going to leave after this season, and then at the last minute an agreement was reached to keep him around at least through the crossover events. And then they had to edit around his big good bye, and what was left felt awkward.
 

NeilO

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This was right up there with the first season finale of "Legends" for the most nonsensical version of time travel-related causality. We've seen before that timeline changes ripple out from the point of the change, so Nora should have been erased from existence before the ripples ever reached Thawne in the future.
The time travel changes were quite confusing. If everything was consistent in the episode, I'd be very much surprised. The whole Thawne plot seemed extremely confusing. He was imprisoned and powers dampened by the dagger which he helped create by sending Nora back.

I liked Nora a lot, and I liked what she did for the show, but her story felt complete so it made sense that she's gone.
Yes, at least this version of Nora seemed quite complete.

Both this finale and the "Arrow" finale foreshadowed Crisis on Infinite Earths. I wonder of the "Supergirl" and "Legends" finales will as well. If so, it's quite possible that all four shows will spend their first chunk of episodes building toward the crossover event, and then the shows (other than "Arrow") will spend the remainder of their seasons dealing with the fallout.
That seems reasonable. Would the Arrow finale make any sense if you haven't seen any episodes this season? I had no problems with the crossover episode. The end of the last season of Arrow was just too painful to watch.

It was definitely weird. I'm wondering if the finale was shot with the understanding that Carlos Valdes was going to leave after this season
There are definitely a lot of rumors since the beginning of the year of him leaving the show. Given how useful his powers were in the finale, it really seemed like a bad decision by the character to get rid of his powers.
 

Garysb

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Per youtube posters I have heard that the Supergirl finale will feature a big tease about Crisis.

My problem with the season as a whole is that it was too Nora focused. She was the star not Barry. I don't think Cicada and Cicada II were big enough to be a season long villain. I think Ralph has become a great character and they didn't give him enough to do to help the main story or his own story . The finale was one of the few times he used his power this season and it was pretty brief.

Time travel in the finale is a mess because they only changed a select few things. The dagger is destroyed in the present. It disappears in the future and in Grace's head, Cicada II disappears because young Grace took the cure, and Nora disappears, maybe never born maybe just never traveled to the past. What about everything else? If they change an event everything changes and then it is like "Flashpoint" where everything is different and nobody except Barry remembers what use to be. No one except maybe Barry should remember Nora if she was never born or never came back in time. Her diary and message to her parents shouldn't exist etc. In fact wouldn't it have been better if after Nora disappears and Iris and Barry are crying if Iris stops and doesn't know why she was crying because she forgot about Nora? Barry still knows because he is The Flash but decides not to tell her.
 
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Sean Bryan

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I think Banner might have a thing or two to say about the time travel “logic” used in the Arrowverse.

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Thomas Newton

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Given how useful his powers were in the finale, it really seemed like a bad decision by the character to get rid of his powers.

He would have been better advised to "not use his powers" than to erase them. How does he know that he will never need them?

Suppose, for instance, that muggers set upon him and tried to beat him to death. This would be a nice time to use powers, if he still had them. Oops!
 

Garysb

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Legends did the time travel paradox better with all the Legends forgetting about Zari and that her brother took her place with the Legends after her history was changed. Everyone on Team Flash should have forgotten about Nora when she disappeared. Team Flash was not in some safe zone where they could retain their memory of other time lines. Shame that different programs with in the Arrowverse can't be consistent. I blame the Crisis.
 

Adam Lenhardt

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Can we have a rule going forward to use spoiler tags when discussing recent major events from the other shows? I happened to read Gary's post before I had a chance to watch the "Legends" finale, and had the fate of a main character spoiled.
 

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