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If you are a person who gets your TV source material from a cable system (which also includes FIOS, AT&T Uverse, et. al.) then you can do yourself a big favor by following this thread to see how you can greatly enhance your TV experience. Basically, if your provider offers a Cable Card as an option (which is just about every provider except for The Satellite Services - Dish and DirecTV) then you are a candidate for the CETON card and all that it offers in conjunction with a PC and Windows Media Center (built into Windows 7).
Originally I was going to create a long essay outlining my very favorable experience with a CETON Expansion Card, a PC, a Multituner Cable Card from FIOS (known as an "M-Card"), Windows 7 (for Windows Media Center) and multimedia extenders (the XBox 360 being the most cost-effective solution). Various health issues have continually pushed off the creation of such an essay on my part - during which time my use of and experience with my FIOS/CETON configuration has continued to blossom and become even better. There are already many sources of general information regarding the CETON card and how it works. An excellent starting point that will provide some insight about the entire process from hardware through software can be found HERE at the CETON site. Feel free to browse the various pages to get your feet wet and to bring newcomers up to speed. Then come back here and ask any questions that you have regarding the system, its set-up and a wide range of other questions that are bound to come up and whose answers will benefit a lot of members here.,
Basically let me start by stating that I have a fully functional system throughout my house using one of the first CETON cards released a couple of months ago. When someone asked me, "Does the system meet your expectations?" my answer was quickly, "It has exceeded my expectations in just about every area." Adam Gregorich, one of the owners of the HTF has been running a FIOS system much longer. He was involved in some of the early beta-testing of Windows 7, Windows Media Center and external cable cards prior to the release of the Ceton PC Card. It basically performs the same functions but with a bunch of external boxes hanging off of USB ports rather than an internal card. Adam has indicated that he will be monitoring the thread and will provide some valuable insights - probably even more extensive than my own - in an attempt to answer member questions as the thread progresses.
A little background about my own system. In 1999 I had had my fill of Cablevision and all that this involved, both good and bad (mostly bad) and I switched over to The Dish Network for my TV needs. My system eventually grew into a four box, eight tuner HD capable system in four locations in my home. Each box was a dual channel, HD capable DVR with external drives to supplement the storage available to me in each room. I was generally satisfied with the Dish DVRs (Model 722s and 622s) and they were essentially TiVo units (after all, TiVo successfully sued The Dish Network and won a $20 million judgment which Dish has been stalling on for several years so it's not a stretch to call the Dish boxes TiVo units.) As the price of Dish subscriptions increased and as Dish refused to offer several stations that I wanted (the YES network in any form and PBS, AMC, and several local channels here in the NYC area in HD) I began to look elsewhere for a better solution. By the spring of 2009 there were at least 15 channels of HD content that Dish did not carry and then along came FIOS. I immediately jumped on board and added a FIOS DVR to the Home Theater and a "regular" HD box in the bedroom to provide the extra programming at an extra cost, of course. The one thing that kept me with the Dish Network was the quality and the flexibility of the Dish DVRs. The FIOS DVRs were, to put it kindly, less than ideal (in other words - quite bad.) Very limited storage, poor menu navigation, etc. etc. In April of 2009 I was out in Washington visiting Adam Gregorich where I first saw his FIOS/Windows Media Center whole house beta testing (in conjunction with Microsoft) site and once I saw it I knew that this would be the direction of my next TV programming upgrade. I immediately put my name on a list to purchase a CETON card when they became available and after several false starts by the company I finally received one of the first quad-tuner cards in the late Spring of this year. I immediately ordered an M-card from FIOS and the technician came out to install his first such card in a PC card. Installation was actually quite painless (thank to advice from Adam to remove any firewalls and other protective software - I favor Norton - in its entirety, only leaving the protection offered by Windows 7, which seems to be more than adequate. And a tip of the hat to Kevin Collins who also suggested eliminating Norton and similar to allow programming to get through)
And here's Tip #1 (lots more as the thread progresses): [COLOR= #ff0000]Remove any protective software - other than Windows 7 itself. [/COLOR] Remove means fully uninstall it, not just turn it off. Apparently, Norton and similar consider any TV signals to be external threats and they won't let such signals through. As soon as the software was removed the program guide magically (o.k. No so magically) appeared.
I then continued to follow the prompts until everything was set up and I was ready to connect my first TV to the system. For this to work you need a PC (I recommend a dedicated one for the TV server and storage) - price depends on what processor, memory and storage you want aboard - A CETON card ($400) which you will plug the M-Card into, and one multimedia extender for each TV in your system. As I mentioned before, the easiest multimedia extension to obtain (and one of the least expensive) is an XBox360 which has the ability to run Windows Media Center right from its menus. And you don't need anything other than the least expensive Xbox 360 - currently the 4Gigabyte "Arcade" Model at $199. There are other multimedia extenders out there from vendors such as HP (Adam probably can fill in some more - I went exclusively with XBoxes) but I think that the Xbox is comparably priced and you get an upscaling DVD player for each TV in the bargain.
As you begin to add everything up it might seem at first that you will have an initial hardware outlay of some significance. You need the PC with at least Windows 7 Home Premium (you may upgrade further at any time) and the PC should be one of the faster ones (at least an i3 although Adam is using a dual core unit from about 2 years ago. I opted for 8 gigs of RAM because Windows 7 seems to work more efficiently with a bit of RAM elbow room and a D drive to store recorded programs of 1.5 Terabytes (you can fin d these for under $100 without looking too hard). Incidentally, 1.5 terabytes of disk space stores about 170 hours of HD programming and about 1200 hours of SD programming - each worst case scenarios. Add in $199 for each Xbox360 as a minimum to connect each TV into the system and you begin to see what the hardware is going to cost.
But after that it's clear sailing. While FIOS charges $20/month to "rent" their "multi-room DVR" and $6/month for each HD box at any other TVs in the house, there are no such fees with your own PC and Xboxes. The only charge is $3.99/month for the M-card which will allow you to simultaneously record 4 different events. I understand that similar pricing is in effect for cable systems. Remember - what I'm saying about setting up FIOS also applies to Comcast, Cable Vision and and other "cable" based system that uses cable cards. Satellite systems are supposed to be offering their own special boxes to interface with Windows Media Center but they appear to have stalled at the moment. I predict that they will eventually offer hardware - but then they have more control over the recurring monthly hardware costs. When I switched over from FIOS with their DVR and Boxes I went from a monthly hardware charge of about $40 to a monthly charge of $4 (for the M-Card). That's a savings of $432/year so you would eventually recoup your initial HW cost for the PC, the CETON Card and the XBoxes.
But this isn't just about saving money - it's about what you get with a PC/CETON/XBox approach to TV in your home. The program guide comes from the meta data made available for every show and movie out there. Windows 7 and the Windows Media Center takes care of all that and the options available to each viewer are far better than anything else I've seen. Even the Dish Network boxes pale in comparison. But let's stop at this point and take stock. There are many directions that this thread can go at this time and what might interest one person might not interest another. Rather than trying to cover everything and possibly leave something important out let's turn it over to you - the membership. Read over the CETON material as well as other sources. Speaking of which, here's another valuable source, The Green Button, which is known as The Official Windows Media Center Community. While not confined to TV systems in the home it does provide a place where the "elite meet to greet" (to paraphrase Duffy's Tavern for those of you old enough to remember this radio show). In other words, the Windows Media Gurus hang out there. Valuable stuff.
Which brings up one last point. As of this writing there doesn't seem to be any one manual or source that covers Windows Media Center and/or setting up a TV system using Windows 7 as described in this thread. Perhaps someone from our ranks will see fit to come up with such a tome. Until then, let's use this thread to start exchanging ideas, questions, answers, hints, etc. I would hope that several of our members have started using CETON cards and have something to share. There are hints galore waiting to be listed. For example, you can purchase a Windows Media Center Remote on Amazon for under $11. This essentially replaces the game controller with something much more familiar for TV watching. But how many people know that the TITLE control also acts as a MUTE button or that the OK button acts as a LAST CHANNEL toggle? And I'm sure that there are many, many other such hints just waiting to be discovered and shared.
So there you are. The opening salvo in the CETON/PC/WINDOW MEDIA CENTER thread has been fired.
Let the discourse begin!
Originally I was going to create a long essay outlining my very favorable experience with a CETON Expansion Card, a PC, a Multituner Cable Card from FIOS (known as an "M-Card"), Windows 7 (for Windows Media Center) and multimedia extenders (the XBox 360 being the most cost-effective solution). Various health issues have continually pushed off the creation of such an essay on my part - during which time my use of and experience with my FIOS/CETON configuration has continued to blossom and become even better. There are already many sources of general information regarding the CETON card and how it works. An excellent starting point that will provide some insight about the entire process from hardware through software can be found HERE at the CETON site. Feel free to browse the various pages to get your feet wet and to bring newcomers up to speed. Then come back here and ask any questions that you have regarding the system, its set-up and a wide range of other questions that are bound to come up and whose answers will benefit a lot of members here.,
Basically let me start by stating that I have a fully functional system throughout my house using one of the first CETON cards released a couple of months ago. When someone asked me, "Does the system meet your expectations?" my answer was quickly, "It has exceeded my expectations in just about every area." Adam Gregorich, one of the owners of the HTF has been running a FIOS system much longer. He was involved in some of the early beta-testing of Windows 7, Windows Media Center and external cable cards prior to the release of the Ceton PC Card. It basically performs the same functions but with a bunch of external boxes hanging off of USB ports rather than an internal card. Adam has indicated that he will be monitoring the thread and will provide some valuable insights - probably even more extensive than my own - in an attempt to answer member questions as the thread progresses.
A little background about my own system. In 1999 I had had my fill of Cablevision and all that this involved, both good and bad (mostly bad) and I switched over to The Dish Network for my TV needs. My system eventually grew into a four box, eight tuner HD capable system in four locations in my home. Each box was a dual channel, HD capable DVR with external drives to supplement the storage available to me in each room. I was generally satisfied with the Dish DVRs (Model 722s and 622s) and they were essentially TiVo units (after all, TiVo successfully sued The Dish Network and won a $20 million judgment which Dish has been stalling on for several years so it's not a stretch to call the Dish boxes TiVo units.) As the price of Dish subscriptions increased and as Dish refused to offer several stations that I wanted (the YES network in any form and PBS, AMC, and several local channels here in the NYC area in HD) I began to look elsewhere for a better solution. By the spring of 2009 there were at least 15 channels of HD content that Dish did not carry and then along came FIOS. I immediately jumped on board and added a FIOS DVR to the Home Theater and a "regular" HD box in the bedroom to provide the extra programming at an extra cost, of course. The one thing that kept me with the Dish Network was the quality and the flexibility of the Dish DVRs. The FIOS DVRs were, to put it kindly, less than ideal (in other words - quite bad.) Very limited storage, poor menu navigation, etc. etc. In April of 2009 I was out in Washington visiting Adam Gregorich where I first saw his FIOS/Windows Media Center whole house beta testing (in conjunction with Microsoft) site and once I saw it I knew that this would be the direction of my next TV programming upgrade. I immediately put my name on a list to purchase a CETON card when they became available and after several false starts by the company I finally received one of the first quad-tuner cards in the late Spring of this year. I immediately ordered an M-card from FIOS and the technician came out to install his first such card in a PC card. Installation was actually quite painless (thank to advice from Adam to remove any firewalls and other protective software - I favor Norton - in its entirety, only leaving the protection offered by Windows 7, which seems to be more than adequate. And a tip of the hat to Kevin Collins who also suggested eliminating Norton and similar to allow programming to get through)
And here's Tip #1 (lots more as the thread progresses): [COLOR= #ff0000]Remove any protective software - other than Windows 7 itself. [/COLOR] Remove means fully uninstall it, not just turn it off. Apparently, Norton and similar consider any TV signals to be external threats and they won't let such signals through. As soon as the software was removed the program guide magically (o.k. No so magically) appeared.
I then continued to follow the prompts until everything was set up and I was ready to connect my first TV to the system. For this to work you need a PC (I recommend a dedicated one for the TV server and storage) - price depends on what processor, memory and storage you want aboard - A CETON card ($400) which you will plug the M-Card into, and one multimedia extender for each TV in your system. As I mentioned before, the easiest multimedia extension to obtain (and one of the least expensive) is an XBox360 which has the ability to run Windows Media Center right from its menus. And you don't need anything other than the least expensive Xbox 360 - currently the 4Gigabyte "Arcade" Model at $199. There are other multimedia extenders out there from vendors such as HP (Adam probably can fill in some more - I went exclusively with XBoxes) but I think that the Xbox is comparably priced and you get an upscaling DVD player for each TV in the bargain.
As you begin to add everything up it might seem at first that you will have an initial hardware outlay of some significance. You need the PC with at least Windows 7 Home Premium (you may upgrade further at any time) and the PC should be one of the faster ones (at least an i3 although Adam is using a dual core unit from about 2 years ago. I opted for 8 gigs of RAM because Windows 7 seems to work more efficiently with a bit of RAM elbow room and a D drive to store recorded programs of 1.5 Terabytes (you can fin d these for under $100 without looking too hard). Incidentally, 1.5 terabytes of disk space stores about 170 hours of HD programming and about 1200 hours of SD programming - each worst case scenarios. Add in $199 for each Xbox360 as a minimum to connect each TV into the system and you begin to see what the hardware is going to cost.
But after that it's clear sailing. While FIOS charges $20/month to "rent" their "multi-room DVR" and $6/month for each HD box at any other TVs in the house, there are no such fees with your own PC and Xboxes. The only charge is $3.99/month for the M-card which will allow you to simultaneously record 4 different events. I understand that similar pricing is in effect for cable systems. Remember - what I'm saying about setting up FIOS also applies to Comcast, Cable Vision and and other "cable" based system that uses cable cards. Satellite systems are supposed to be offering their own special boxes to interface with Windows Media Center but they appear to have stalled at the moment. I predict that they will eventually offer hardware - but then they have more control over the recurring monthly hardware costs. When I switched over from FIOS with their DVR and Boxes I went from a monthly hardware charge of about $40 to a monthly charge of $4 (for the M-Card). That's a savings of $432/year so you would eventually recoup your initial HW cost for the PC, the CETON Card and the XBoxes.
But this isn't just about saving money - it's about what you get with a PC/CETON/XBox approach to TV in your home. The program guide comes from the meta data made available for every show and movie out there. Windows 7 and the Windows Media Center takes care of all that and the options available to each viewer are far better than anything else I've seen. Even the Dish Network boxes pale in comparison. But let's stop at this point and take stock. There are many directions that this thread can go at this time and what might interest one person might not interest another. Rather than trying to cover everything and possibly leave something important out let's turn it over to you - the membership. Read over the CETON material as well as other sources. Speaking of which, here's another valuable source, The Green Button, which is known as The Official Windows Media Center Community. While not confined to TV systems in the home it does provide a place where the "elite meet to greet" (to paraphrase Duffy's Tavern for those of you old enough to remember this radio show). In other words, the Windows Media Gurus hang out there. Valuable stuff.
Which brings up one last point. As of this writing there doesn't seem to be any one manual or source that covers Windows Media Center and/or setting up a TV system using Windows 7 as described in this thread. Perhaps someone from our ranks will see fit to come up with such a tome. Until then, let's use this thread to start exchanging ideas, questions, answers, hints, etc. I would hope that several of our members have started using CETON cards and have something to share. There are hints galore waiting to be listed. For example, you can purchase a Windows Media Center Remote on Amazon for under $11. This essentially replaces the game controller with something much more familiar for TV watching. But how many people know that the TITLE control also acts as a MUTE button or that the OK button acts as a LAST CHANNEL toggle? And I'm sure that there are many, many other such hints just waiting to be discovered and shared.
So there you are. The opening salvo in the CETON/PC/WINDOW MEDIA CENTER thread has been fired.
Let the discourse begin!
