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"The Alamo"s Status?

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Allansfirebird, Oct 10, 2013.

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  1. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    Those are both fair. This example is perhaps not as bad as the toxic Starwars / Ghostbusters fans who feel entitled to have things done in ways they approve of. But it rhymes with it.
     
  2. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    If you are telling a world class expert in film restoration and preservation that this is entirely preventable you may want to check yourself. I have no idea who you are IRL, if you have credentials to back any of that up, feel free to share.

    Otherwise yes, multiple backseat peanut gallerists in this thread (not directed at YOU specifically!!!!) are coming across as both entitled and as escapees from www.reddit.com/r/iamverysmart
     
  3. Johnny Angell

    Johnny Angell Played With Dinosaurs Member

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    Well hot damn, Sam. Was it something we said? ;)
     
  4. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    Yes. You have to understand we get a ton of feedback over stuff like this. HTF has been a bastion of friendly discussion. Folks can have their arguments anywhere else. Once posters start beating each other up and not letting go of things they feel personally involved in tho, you can bet the mods will step in.

    My posts above and in your other thread are me posting my own thoughts tho. You'll KNOW when moderator action has taken place. Or maybe stuff will just quietly disappear =)

    The rules appear in every Mod's signature too. I read em every few months to remind my own self what we stand for.
     
  5. Robert Harris

    Robert Harris Archivist
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    Actually, I've discussed this with PMF, and he fully gets it.
     
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  6. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    Right, as I said it wasn't directed at them.
     
  7. Message #2387 of 2398 Jun 14, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
    PMF

    PMF Producer

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    Now I finally understand. No, I would never dream of challenging Robert Harris; nor do I come from a place where I ever could. I have everything to learn from Mr. Harris. My respects for both he and all that he has done for film preservation and his tireless contribution in educating us remains to be something that I could never catch up to nor ever repay. I am indebted to both he and the Home Theater Forum, as well as this amazing membership for enriching my life. The aim of my post was strictly towards a bit of ironic lightness; as I was celebrating our fan base of film-buffs who, despite our passions for cinematic history, are not able to turn the clocks back on vinegar syndrome and the likes; no matter how strong our collective numbers may be. One of my greatest life regrets was not being able to raise the monies to get myself into a film school that specialized in Film Restoration. The work being done is so very important to me and only a year ago, I had to resign myself to the fact that it will never be. I am exclusive to HTF and post no where else. From this forum, I seek insights, discussions and; here and there; an occasional bit of laughter, as shared by those who also couldn't live a day without film. Blessings.
     
  8. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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  9. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson Screenwriter

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    I'd think they could use that HD master and insert missing scenes from the whatever master they used to make the old longform two-tape set they put out back in the VHS days. I'd buy that in a heartbeat. It wouldn't be perfect, but the days for that are long gone. Again, this would all be from already-created masters. Seems like low-hanging fruit to me.
     
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  10. Joseph Goodman

    Joseph Goodman Stunt Coordinator

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't that print used on the laser (and subsequently ruined) not actually the proper roadshow cut, but more like a preview version?
     
  11. OliverK

    OliverK Producer

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    I seem to remember that it was a 70mm roadshow print but MGM did mix things up to a degree so the laserdisc could probably best be called an extended version. RAH went into a lot more detail on this earlier in this thread but this is what I remember regarding the print.
     
  12. OliverK

    OliverK Producer

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    I am sure that even an 8k master could be created from the now deteriorated 70mm print but this is all a question of (in this case huuuuge) resources.

    So yes, what you propose would be the cheapest way to get a good quality short version and a semblance of the roadshow version, too, and at least MGM could fall back on a master that was good enough for an LD. Add seamless branching and people could decide if they can put up with good Blu-ray quality intertwined with LD quality or if they want to forego the Duke's vision for a more consistent viewing experience.

    I think one reason that this is not being done is the ridicule that would be heaped upon MGM (deservedly so) because there was a much better deal on the table that MGM refused and that would have led to a much more seamless integration of the roadshow elements.
     
  13. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson Screenwriter

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    They could always say they did it for the money, which would have the virtue of honesty.
     
  14. DVBRD

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    I could see a similar release to what Twilight Time did with Hawaii: both the shorter cut in HD and the longer cut in 4:3 SD on the same set. Unless there's a miracle and a second 70mm print of the longer cut exists in much better condition, I think it might be all we're gonna get.
     
  15. rsmithjr

    rsmithjr Screenwriter

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    I have the long Laserdisc version and it is far superior cinematically to any other version of the film: it actually makes sense. I remember seeing the 35mm (magnetic) version in original release and not appreciating the film at all, thinking that I liked the version in Disney's Davey Crockett better.

    If the goal is to understand the plot, just intercutting the LD version into good elements (which supposedly exist) for the short version might help a lot of viewers. I can understand why no one might try to give us this, other than some hobbyist (in the manner that someone did to restore the original version of Star Wars).
     
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  16. JoeDoakes

    JoeDoakes Cinematographer

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    According to my recollection of what Mr Harris has said, this is doable for a blu-ray release. The greatest challenge is preserving The Alamo as a large format film for theatrical display.
     
  17. OliverK

    OliverK Producer

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    The original intent was to make the long version available as a 1080p Blu-ray and the short cut for theatrical exhibition and a 4k DCP.

    Judging by the colors that I have seen extracted from faded red prints the results for the 1080p version could have been very nice:

    Alamo2.

    Color adjusted frame courtesy of Schauburg cinema in Karlsruhe, I watched The Alamo there about 10 years ago.

    And to bring late comers up to speed here is a link to the original article about The Alamo by RAH and The Digital Bits with a few more color adjusted frames and posted on in70mm.com:

    https://www.in70mm.com/news/2009/the_alamo/index.htm
     
  18. Message #2398 of 2398 Jun 17, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
    Tom St Jones

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    I seem to recall RAH some time ago saying that ALL prints of all formats (incl. 8mm condensed versions), existing + no longer existing, of THE ALAMO have been accounted for/ cataloged, etc, and therefore it is at-best highly unlikely another large-format print is out there someplace. (Sure, there's always the slim chance someone -say, Mr. Wayne or a studio department head - could have had an "off-the-books" printing or two done, but again, not likely). I'll grant you my memory is imperfect but I believe that's what RAH said.

    (re-edit)
     

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