Tempest to AV15

Discussion in 'Home Theater Projects' started by Matt Dolejsi, Oct 14, 2003.

  1. Matt Dolejsi

    Matt Dolejsi Agent

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    Ok, here's the deal.

    I currently have a tempest in a box that is 4 cubes sealed and I'm quite happy with it...but I'm thinking of swapping the driver for an AV15 for a tad more output...would this help me out any at all given that I'll still be feeding it about 380 watts.

    I'm just looking at the build of the sub and that 23 mm of travel its looking quite good to me...any ideas?
     
  2. Jeffrey Stanton

    Jeffrey Stanton Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes, it will help. The AV-15 will move more air than the Tempest. Movement of more air=more bass output.[​IMG]

    I was using an AV-15 in a 5 c.f. box, and with 380 watts like yourself (is this the trusty Rythmic Audio plate amp you're using?).

    I had it wired wrong in that I was feeding 380 watts to one voic coil (forgot the jumper). The Rythmic audio amp isn't designed for a 2 ohm load, but it performed for a month or so anyway before I smoked the driver. I may have been feeding the AV-15 a lot more than "380 watts at 4 ohms", since I had it wired to one VC. In any case, the AV-15 sounded pretty darn good with a 380 watt amp. but because of the way it was wired to a 2 ohm load (one VC), it might have been getting a lot more than 380 watts(double, possibly).

    The AV-15 is an upgrade compared to the Tempest. And the good thing about the AV-15 is that when you get tired of IT, a Tumult drops right in!! That's the way I went anyhow...[​IMG]
     
  3. David Giesbrecht

    David Giesbrecht Second Unit

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    I don't have much experience comparing different drivers but it seems to me that the extra 7mm of xmax won't really make awhole lot of difference in the long run, you might gain an extra 1.5 db of output if that. I think you would be better off getting a second Tempest witch would give you an extra 6 db of output.
     
  4. Matt Dolejsi

    Matt Dolejsi Agent

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    thats what i figured, that in real db's it wouldn't make much sense...If i had the room i'd consider a second tempest, but i don't

    The only reason i was considering it was because i'd sell my tempest and use the proceeds towards the AV15...I'm a poor college student what can i say...

    but it looks like it will hardly be worth the trouble, besides i'm not sure i'd like that flashy aluminum disk in my face all the time..

    I know all the power related db calculations, but i didn't know just how it applied with x-max.

    displacement is related to db's how exactly...
     
  5. Rob Formica

    Rob Formica Stunt Coordinator

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    Correct me if i'm wrong, but you would end up have LESS SPL if you switched the Tempest to a AV15 in the same enclosure and with the same power amp... given that the AV15 is a less efficient driver.

    It would be a different story if you change the enclosure (vented) or power amp (more power)... as the AV-15 a greater maximum capacity.

    As is, there is little for you to gain...
    Rob
     
  6. Jake K

    Jake K Stunt Coordinator

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    Rob is right, keep the tempest.
     
  7. Jeffrey Stanton

    Jeffrey Stanton Stunt Coordinator

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    The AV-15 is still a better driver than the Tempest. Acoustic Visions refers to it as a "step up" from the Tempest. If it were not a better driver, it could hardly be referred to as "step up". Correct me if I'm wrong, but that would be a "step down".


    But don't believe me. Check the specs and see for yourself at:

    http://www.acoustic-visions.com/~aco...tryke_av12-15/

    If I was going to run a 15-incher, I would not be happy with a Tempest. I say ditch the Tempest. [​IMG] Or just cut to the chase and get a Tumult and be done with it. [​IMG] Why mess around? [​IMG]

    Jeff S.
     
  8. RichardHOS

    RichardHOS Second Unit

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    Jeffrey, it is a step up provided that you can put it in the proper enclosure and supply the proper amount of power. In that case, the AV-15 has a higher potential output than the Tempest.

    As it is, enclosure and power are fixed quantities, so when modeling the drivers in that particular enclosure you don't just look at maximum possible output, but the actual output available with 380 watts input. The Tempest being a more efficient driver, it may well be the case that you would lose output given that enclosure and amplifier by switching to an AV-15.
     
  9. Jeffrey Stanton

    Jeffrey Stanton Stunt Coordinator

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    I've got a better idea. Although this isn't what you asked about, you can get a BFD instead of messing with a driver upgrade & EQ your room resonances. For $120 bucks you should get significantly better performance out of what you've already got...[​IMG]

    Jeff S.
     
  10. Jeffrey Stanton

    Jeffrey Stanton Stunt Coordinator

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    Hi Richard:

    Silly me, of course you would need more power to run the AV-15 than the Tempest. I wasn't considering the "fixed" values. What on earth was I thinking? The AV-15 would be a "step up" but you'd have to step up your power also. Power is cheap these days though. I still say get a BFD...

    Later,

    Jeff S.
     
  11. David Giesbrecht

    David Giesbrecht Second Unit

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    The only way the AV-15 is a step up is that it has a whopping 7mm's more Xmax. (whoopy ding[​IMG] ) I doubt you would even hear that 1.5 db difference. If I had to choose between the two drivers I would take the Tempest over the AV-15 anyday! That slight upgrade in Xmax isn't worth the extra $55.00
     
  12. Dan Hine

    Dan Hine Screenwriter

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  13. David Giesbrecht

    David Giesbrecht Second Unit

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  14. Brian Bunge

    Brian Bunge Producer

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    Oh, ye of little faith...

    If you're pushing the Tempest to the point of audible distortion, or even bottoming, I think you'd agree that the AV15 would be worth the upgrade.
     
  15. Vaughan Odendaal

    Vaughan Odendaal Second Unit

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    The AV15 should have a 1.5-2db increase across the board.But the great thing about the AV15 compared to the Tempest, is distortion levels.The whole magnet assembly and motor is more sophisticated than the Tempest.Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the AV15 have a 1/2" clearence between the voice coil and the back plate? Isn't that similar to the HE15?

    So its virtually impossible to bottom out the AV15 in the same size box as the Tempest.As far as I'm concerned, a 1.5-2 db increase is quite significant.It may seem small, but it will come in handy in those occasions when you really push the subwoofer.Remember that 1-2db is the difference between the voice coil hitting against the back plate, and playing a dynamic movie without stress.A tempest is still a great driver, and is something of a bargin.I'm still hoping for a revised XBL^2 Tempest in the near future(please Dan!)[​IMG]

    While the Tempest may be excursion limited, the AV15 is power limited.So it would take a couple hundred extra watts to reach this drivers clean linear limits.Still, given the proper size box, an AV15 is one heck of a driver.And yeah, two tempests will definitely outperform a single AV15, but it costs more too.[​IMG] If we talk about the Tumult, I would think that the actual DB increase is not that great compared to the AV15.Perhaps 1db if that.But potential increase in output is not what the Tumult is about.Its all about super high output together with super low distortion for a super great driver.[​IMG]

    Regards
     
  16. Jeffrey Stanton

    Jeffrey Stanton Stunt Coordinator

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    Yeah. What Vince said...
     
  17. Matt Dolejsi

    Matt Dolejsi Agent

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    thanks guys, you pretty much re-affirmed my thoughts...I'll keep my tempest untill one day when i'm not 19 and have a real job and can afford something spectacular so that i'll actually hear the fruits of my labor. Meanwhile the tempest is great in itself so i guess i can't complain. I'll focus on my "Lyra Like" fronts and my line array center experiment. cheers,

    being poor sucks...
     

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