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TCFHE Press Release: The Great Escape (Blu-ray) (1 Viewer)

Professor Echo

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Can anyone tell me if they have the original 1963 theatrical trailer on there or is it the same re-release version we've gotten on all but the very first standard DVD release?
 

Doctorossi

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Magnús Þorsteinn Magnússon said:
I'm beginning to think that they have really mismanage the OCN.....BIG TIME.

Well, if DP 70's description of a recent 4K screening (post #72) is to be believed, there are still quality materials available. Why they (apparently) weren't utilized for this Blu-ray release is another question.
 

Robert Crawford

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Professor Echo said:
Can anyone tell me if they have the original 1963 theatrical trailer on there or is it the same re-release version we've gotten on all but the very first standard DVD release?
It says it's the original trailer with a narrator.

Edit: Just checked the first DVD released in 1998 and that trailer is not the same as the one on the BD.
 

David Weicker

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I got my copy today. I've watched the first twenty or so minutes.
First of all, this is not a BAD presentation. The scenes under the credits are not that crisp, but are an improvement over past presentations. And that is usually normal for credit sequences. Once the credits end, the picture improves a lot.

Is it knock a home-run out of the park, no. But I'm not sure it could be (since I have zero knowledge on film stocks, or what sources exist). Is it good looking, yes.


I would like to know if someone can confirm if this is the same version that debuted at the TCM Film Festival a short time ago? (and for this question, can we please get specific answers, not just speculation from the normal group of doom-and-gloomers).

David
 

David_B_K

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Wow. Sounds like the same care and attention that MGM lavished on THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD.
 

JoHud

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David_B_K said:
Wow. Sounds like the same care and attention that MGM lavished on THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD.
Also a bit like MGM's release of West Side Story.
 

lark144

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I'm certain Mr. Harris & Mr. Kimmel will be able to present definitive reviews of the state of this Blu-Ray, as they have probably seen dye-transfers prints of THE GREAT ESCAPE more recently than I have. My last viewing of this film in a theatre was roughly fory years ago. Anyway, in the meantime, I thought I would share my experinces of watching this Blu-ray. Having the extremely negative Bluray.com review in my mind, I think my expectations were lowered. Anyway, I didn't see any signs of compression, such as a continually wavering image, or the breaking up of visual information that the Blu-ray.com review referred to. I also saw very little digital noise, although in a few very important shots this is apparent,
specifically in the scene after the Fourth of July celebration where Ives is hanging dead on the barbed wire fence.
A wide reaction shot of all of the prisioners looking up is very soft and covered with a weird orange-like pattern. But this is fairly rare. Compared to the last DVD release of the Special Edition, this Blu-ray looks positively sublime. The cololrs are very nice, the detail on faces is excellent in close and mid-range shots, and for the first time one can actually discern Daniel Fapp's lighting design. However, and this is a big BUT, there is no grain at all, and also many of the long shots of the camp look very soft, as if someone smeared vasoline on the lens. I'm assuming this is due to DNR. On the other hand, I didn't notice haloing, waxy faces, or other issues found on the first Blu ray of PATTON usually associated with degraining. To compare this to other MGM/UA Blu-rays, it's much better than THE GREATEST STORY EVER TOLD and there are no weird shimmering and shaking of details in the frame as in WEST SIDE STORY. On the other hand, it's not half as lovely as the school dance in WEST SIDE STORY either. I guess I'd compare it to THE GOOD, THE BAD AND THE UGLY. I'd say if you don't like DNR, don't buy this disc. On the other hand, this is the best looking THE GREAT ESCAPE has ever been, and for long stretches this actually manages to bring me back to the look of the film the first time I saw it in a theater, but I'm afraid that this is intermittent at best, and there is still the isuue of no grain, which ordinarily would be a dealbreaker for me, but this was already pre-ordered, and shipped before I had read any reviews. Anyway, I enjoyed watching this, but I purposely ignored the intermintent issues of softness, digital noise, and lack of film grain. Does this Blu ray capture the look of an original dye transfer print? NO. It's watchable for long stretches, but very digital looking.
 

lark144

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Sorry! After posting the above I realized I included a spoiler, but I couldn't figure out how to edit my post.
 

Robert Crawford

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lark144 said:
Sorry! After posting the above I realized I included a spoiler, but I couldn't figure out how to edit my post.
Use
test[/spoiler ] on opposite sides of the hidden word(s). Don't forget to take out the space before the last bracket.
 

Professor Echo

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Robert Crawford said:
It says it's the original trailer with a narrator.

Edit: Just checked the first DVD released in 1998 and that trailer is not the same as the one on the BD.

Thanks for the info, Robert. Wow, I wonder what they have against the original trailer, it's great and far better than the re-release. Looks like I'll be hanging onto my old old old DVD copy just to have that single extra.

Ridiculous that at least some of these classic films can't get the support of a true enthusiast at the studio and do the majority of things right.
 

haineshisway

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I'm an hour in. I have yet to see one instance of the disastrous transfer I was led to believe I'd be watching. Re the post above regarding DNR - I don't see it - at all - anywhere. On the one hand, you correctly state that there is excellent detail in mid to close shots - had this transfer been DNR'd to death you would see it in those shots as well - in other words, they don't just use DNR on wide shots. I'm not going to pretend I know if this is a perfect transfer or not - but I do know enough to know that it's certainly miles and miles ahead of the DVD (it is unfathomable to me on those other boards where they say the DVD and Blu-ray are basically the same - one just shakes one's head - of course, they haven't actually seen the Blu-ray, they're just looking at the awful screen caps).

Re the titles - obviously the footage backplates are dupes, sometimes dupes of dupes - multiple-pass optical. That said, the lettering itself isn't as sharp as it should be to my eyes. I'm sure Mr. Harris would know the reason for this better than I would. But so far, I am not really upset about anything. I see grain (light), and I see detail - no, it is not the sharpest transfer I've ever seen, but you cannot compare a frame of this film to West Side Story - that is a 65mm production, this is not. And correct color - that is a MAJOR plus for me. So, thus far I'm really enjoying the film and the presentation. I don't know about "perfect" but I do know this is not the four-star disaster I'd read about.
 

Dr Griffin

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haineshisway said:
I'm an hour in. I have yet to see one instance of the disastrous transfer I was led to believe I'd be watching. Re the post above regarding DNR - I don't see it - at all - anywhere. On the one hand, you correctly state that there is excellent detail in mid to close shots - had this transfer been DNR'd to death you would see it in those shots as well - in other words, they don't just use DNR on wide shots. I'm not going to pretend I know if this is a perfect transfer or not - but I do know enough to know that it's certainly miles and miles ahead of the DVD (it is unfathomable to me on those other boards where they say the DVD and Blu-ray are basically the same - one just shakes one's head - of course, they haven't actually seen the Blu-ray, they're just looking at the awful screen caps).

Re the titles - obviously the footage backplates are dupes, sometimes dupes of dupes - multiple-pass optical. That said, the lettering itself isn't as sharp as it should be to my eyes. I'm sure Mr. Harris would know the reason for this better than I would. But so far, I am not really upset about anything. I see grain (light), and I see detail - no, it is not the sharpest transfer I've ever seen, but you cannot compare a frame of this film to West Side Story - that is a 65mm production, this is not. And correct color - that is a MAJOR plus for me. So, thus far I'm really enjoying the film and the presentation. I don't know about "perfect" but I do know this is not the four-star disaster I'd read about.

Yes, pretty much my thoughts also. It's not what one would expect after hearing 4K transfer but a decent one still. I wouldn't let some of the bad user opinions keep me from getting this release, especially at the price you can now get it. The transfer is fairly good and the film is of course very enjoyable.
 

Steve Tannehill

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I'm also an hour into the disc and it looks fine to my eyes, especially compared to my 1998 DVD and Criterion laserdisc.
 

ahollis

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Thanks for both of your thoughts on this. I have re-ordered and its still under $10 at amazon.
 

haineshisway

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Just finished the 4th of July sequence - it looks like diffusion filters were used on a lot of it, at least it looks like that to my eyes. It made me laugh to read the Beaver's "review" complaining of "teal." When did this become the catchphrase to complain about Blu-ray color. It is, of course, nonsense. The color is wonderful and hardly too blue. These people just assume from having seen way too many awful brown and yellow transfers that that look is correct - not for that time period it isn't. That's what's so funny - they say blue is what current films do - but every time I see a current film it's yellow and brown, not overtly blue with the exception of some purposely-timed films - those are the exceptions, not the rule these days, and those are a very specific kind of film that literally wash everything in blue. You can't compare that wash to a correctly-timed Blu-ray of The Great Escape - it's utter nonsense.
 

Peter Apruzzese

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It looks very similar to the brand new 35mm print I ran back in 2006 or so. The film is full of long opticals (the entire "tailor" sequence, for one) and, as Bruce notes, diffusion filtered shots. Not the best combination to deliver razor-sharp images. It actually ticks up a bit in sharpness after the 4th of July scene.I'm pleased with it, especially for 10 bucks.
 

haineshisway

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Peter Apruzzese said:
It looks very similar to the brand new 35mm print I ran back in 2006 or so. The film is full of long opticals (the entire "tailor" sequence, for one) and, as Bruce notes, diffusion filtered shots. Not the best combination to deliver razor-sharp images. It actually ticks up a bit in sharpness after the 4th of July scene.I'm pleased with it, especially for 10 bucks.
I've now finished and I have to say I found the transfer overall excellent. As Pete says, and as others I've spoken to who've seen it projected recently, this is what the film looks like. But we're dealing with a reviewer on Blu-ray.com who has no clue about this film and so his pronouncements are meaningless, especially when he invokes an interview and pulls comments out of context and that have nothing to do with this transfer, to make his points. And then the usual suspects on that board all chime in and call the transfer a disgrace and a disaster and people cancel their orders - and the people calling the transfer a disgrace haven't seen it, of course - they're looking at the awful screencaps and making their judgments. What else is new?

Here's the thing: This film has so many opitcals, several of them multiple-pass opticals, it isn't funny. Some of the opticals last for entire scenes, sometimes as long as five minutes. The minute you cut out of the optical - voila - everything is fine. But this is beyond the people on that board - they simply don't get it. The most vociferous of them actually said that one shot looks great while the next shot doesn't - duh - optical. And yes, several of the outdoor sequences are shot with diffusion filters and they look like they look. It's clearly a brand new transfer - it clearly has perfect color. It is miles ahead of the previous DVDs in every way possible. These people say "can't possibly be from a 4K scan" like they would know what was from a 4K scan, a 2K scan, or a 1080 scan. In a blind test, they'd fail every time.

So, for me at least, I was very pleased - I have no idea if it could be better or if the authoring could be better - but what I viewed was pleasing and resembled my memory of what The Great Escape looks like. Is it a great transfer? It may well be. Is it a disaster? Absolutely not. It's worth every penny that anyone is paying for it, whether 19.98, 9.98, or 4.98. But that's become the game, as always - the bragging "I got this for two dollars because I used this coupon and that code and waited till it was this price" - and they then wonder why studios are licensing their titles to others. Duh.
 

Mark-P

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Thanks for your comments, Bruce. My copy arrived today and I'm going to check it out tomorrow.
I'm wondering if this is similar to the situation with The Guns of Navarone, which looks exactly how it's supposed to look?
 

JoHud

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Thanks for the in-depth rundown on the transfer, Bruce. There's certainly an ongoing trend in doom-and-gloom hysteria in early blu-ray reviews and usually it end up not to be the case. I had already bought it but haven't gotten around to viewing it.
 

lukejosephchung

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I have this disc and watched my friend's copy of it at his house tonight...I'm seeing nothing untoward about the transfer that has led to so many negative reviews on this thread and other websites that I've read...I'll be giving my copy a more thorough viewing later this week, but given that this has only cost between $10-15 for most customers, I'd say this disc and its new transfer is a bargain!!! :thumbsup:
 

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