surround difference

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by DerekCV, Aug 11, 2005.

  1. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    I have my figner on the trigger to get some JBL speakers... for a while now... still waiting... I keep inching to the bigger and more expensive speakers... looking at the E80's inching towards the E90's... but really i'm not a crazy audiophile.. I just buy decent stuff, and want decent performance.

    I was first looking at the E10's for surrounds.. then E20's, then E50's now E30's... see what I do. So I'm really thinking... money is super tight... is there really a diffence from the E10 to E30 for surrounds, I know that they are all voice matched and that... but the E10 are wall mountable, so that would elimate needing brackets and extra cost...

    Unless someone can really tell me a good reason against them, I think i'm going to fall into the E80, E35, E10 combination...

    Thanks.
     
  2. John S

    John S Producer

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    Big difference... I'd want that 6" low end driver myself.
     
  3. Dan J

    Dan J Agent

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    The E-50's are a 3-way speaker. The lower models are 2-way. If you can listen to them at a store you should so you can see if the difference is worth it for you.

    Dan
     
  4. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    E-50s are way out of my price range, I'm struggling with the $50 difference between the E10 and E30 let alone the $100 difference between E30 and E50.
     
  5. Dan J

    Dan J Agent

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    You brought up the E-50's not me [​IMG] I just said listen to them and see if they're worth it.

    I like the E-50's too, but I'm also budget limited and couldn't see spending that much for surrounds. I haven't heard the E-30's, but I plan on buying E-20's in the future to replace my current surrounds.

    Dan
     
  6. Phil Iturralde

    Phil Iturralde Screenwriter

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    NOTE: If the surrounds are wall-mounted, then the E20's are not what you want since the bass port is on the back!

    Phil
     
  7. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes I was looking at them at one time... Now I'm only looking at the 10's or 30's, The 50's are too expensive and the 20's becuase of the port, as phil mentioned.

    Any more reasons to not go with the 10's? I'm only really hearing 1, for low end... how much low end is there in a surround, couldn't a good sub negate that?
     
  8. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    It depends on your receiver. If you don't have the ability to set a different x-over for your surrounds from your other speakers, then smaller ones that do not cover as low means you will be stuck with either setting one that is too high for your mains or too low for your surrounds. I'd opt for one too low for your surrounds, though you will end up with a small gap below where the speaker starts to roll off naturally (75Hz in this case). So you will be looking at playing with a 100Hz or 80Hz x-over, unless your receiver allows varied ones.

    Surrounds carry quite a bit of bass these days. Gone are the days of bandwidth limited surrounds.
     
  9. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    I'll have to look into that... I have the Poineer 1015... I thought the E10 ranged to 75Hz, and the E30's to 50Hz.
     
  10. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    You can go with the E10s now and always upgrade them later if they aren't cutting it.
     
  11. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    yeah... although being that I will have the best HT setup over everyone that I know... I'll never know if it sucks... which i guess is a good thing
     
  12. John_RO

    John_RO Stunt Coordinator

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    As usual Phil is right. And so is John. It's either the E10's or the E30's for wall mounting. The Pioneer 1015 has variable crossover settings so it's safe to say it has an 80hz crossover which would work fine for either.

    Personally, i'd go for the E30's. I used to have small surrounds with 4" bass drivers and even though they were rated to handle 80hz, they just didnt sound as full as my current surrounds which use a 5 1/4" driver and are rated down to 65hz. My reciever has a fixed 90hz crossover point.

    Good luck with whatever you choose.
     
  13. Phil Iturralde

    Phil Iturralde Screenwriter

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    Phil
     
  14. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks for the review link Phil...

    That reviewer didn't say a whole lot about the surrounds... but more importantly he didn't say anything bad about them.

    Still a bit torn...

    And i'm not really sure what the comment "with double weight given to the widest off-axis angles. " means. Can you explain?
     
  15. MikeLi

    MikeLi Supporting Actor

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    Always better to go with the better of the bunch or you will forever be wondering what if? If money is very tight you should hold off on the surrounds and just wait and pick them up say 6 months down the road. You can and will enjoy movies with just the front 3 and a sub.
     
  16. Phil Iturralde

    Phil Iturralde Screenwriter

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    Guessin here, but from what I know playing around with the calibrated microphone & my brother's Spectrum Analyzer, Tom Nousaine probably moves the mic ...

    1) On-Axis (0-degree)
    2) 15-degrees off axis
    3) 30-degrees off axis
    3) 60-degrees off axis

    ... and the SPL readings are recorded.

    On-Axis SPL readings will be the speakers best SPL 20Hz - 20kHz frequency response, whereas, the worst SPL frequency response would be @ the 60-degree off axis angle.

    So when Tom writes that "with double weight given to the widest off-axis angles. ", ... he is taking the combined SPL surround SPL results and publishes the surround speakers ± frequency response using the 60-degree (widest angle) readings to influence 2/3 of the published surround speaker response.

    For comparison, ... look at a few SPKR MFG's surround results vs. front L&R by S&V Tom Nousaine (easily comparable since he established and uses the same SPRK Benchmark Testing Standards for S&V) ...


    Energy Take 5.2 HomeTheater Spkr System
    Frequency Response
    Take 2.2 front left/right... 110 Hz to 16.3 kHz ±4.5 dB
    Take 1.2 center............. 110 Hz to 17.4 kHz ±4.5 dB
    Take 2.2 surround........... 110 Hz to 13.2 kHz ±3.2 dB

    Klipsch Synergy System 6 HT Speakers PKG
    Frequency Response
    KSB 1.1 front left/right.... 91 Hz to 14.2 kHz ±3.5 dB
    KSC-C1 center............... 99 Hz to 15.3 kHz ±4.4 dB
    KSB 1.1 surround............ 91 Hz to 12.5 kHz ±5.5 dB

    Polk Audio RTi Series Home Theater Speakers PKG
    Frequency Response
    RT25i front left/right.... 88 Hz to 15.2 kHz ±3.0 dB
    CS245i center............. 87 Hz to 16.2 kHz ±2.6 dB
    RT15i surround............ 94 Hz to 11.4 kHz ±5.6 dB


    B&W 303 Home Theater Speakers PKG
    Frequency Response
    DM 303 front left/right..... 85 Hz to 15.0 kHz ±3.9 dB
    LCR 3 center................ 80 Hz to 14.8 kHz ±2.9 dB
    DM 303 surround............. 85 Hz to 14.2 kHz ±3.5 dB

    As you can see above, reaching 18Khz to 20kHz within ±3.9 dB is pretty ellusive for many SPRK MFG's! Quite a few don't reach it @ their Center - on-Axis position!!!

    Credit JBL's EOS** waveguide & titanium designed tweeter for the wide and flat extended high's (**directly copied from JBL's TEC Award PRO Studio Monitor's!)

    Phil
     
  17. John S

    John S Producer

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    E30's are impressive speakers. I am expecting 6 in today for an install this weekend, where all 6 speakers of the 6.1 will be those. I challenge anybody to find a better speaker at $70 each / $139 a pair.

    Coupled with enough sub, will give any system a good run for it's money.
     
  18. DerekCV

    DerekCV Stunt Coordinator

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    SO what is a good cheap wall mount for the E30's then?

    I was toying around with the idea of letting the bottom of the speaker touch the wall and connect the top to the wall with some eyelets and fishing line... I think I could do that and make it not look ghetto. And I could adjust the location of the attachment point on the wall to help angle the speakers.
     
  19. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    Athena AS-B2s for $149/pr from www.audioadvisor.com [​IMG] The highs aren't perfect, but they're surprisingly decent speakers overall.
     

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