Superman 4 - What's so bad? (1 Viewer)

[Radioman970]

 

[Larry Sutliff]

That crosswalk scene is one of the low points of the entire series, but I'll take it any day over Luthor cutting Superman's indestructible hair strand with a pair of pliers, the same out of focus shot of Superman flying into the camera used over and over again, that ludicrious shot of Supes floating away in an ice cube in space, Mariel Hemingway breathing in space, that idiotic fight on the moon, wires wires everywhere, etc. IV is a mess.

Maybe a bunch of restoration experts, f/x artists and editors could turn IV into something better. But, as it stands, I'll take the well made SUPERMAN III with the junkyard scene and perhaps Reeve's best performance as Superman/Clark over IV any day of the week.

 

[ThomasC]

Are you talking about Superman III? I have no idea what you're talking about, but I haven't seen it for a while.

 

[Mathew_M]

It's a nonsensical scene that happens when Pryor is hacking into a computer mainframe creating all sorts of chaos. It's actually an amusing scene taken in the context of when the film was made. Back then your average person only had a rudimentary knowledge of computers so as a farce it works. You have to remember that Richard Lester, the director of Supes 3 was a bit of a nutter. Check out Petulia, a rather dated 60's movie that features a plot that makes Memento seem coherent. Still it's interesting if only because that goofy, modern, art sculpture thing that Pryor is so fascinated by in Supes 3 makes an appearance in Petulia as well.

 

[ThomasC]

Oh, that. I know what you're talking about now. I was picturing human guys and a static crosswalk sign like the one below, not animated guys in a electronic crosswalk sign.

 

[kraZi]

ya good move.

 

[Joe*A]

SPOILER ALERT

I received the Ultimate Superman Collection for Christmas and spent Christmas Day watching all 4 Superman films including the Donner edition. I was just about to watch Superman Returns but thought I'd comment on the Superman films before hitting play on my DVD player.

Superman 4 was a bad bad film. Forget the poor special effects (I could live with bad special effects if things make sense). And there were many things that made me shake my head and wonder if anyone thought of viewing this thing before releasing it. There are certain laws of physics that should never ever be broken (notwithstanding that a man could fly - it's explained and believable that Kryptonians get power from a yellow sun - ok, sure, I'll buy that:

1 - humans cannot survive in space without a space suit (something to do with cold and lack of oxygen)
2 - Superman should never ever move the moon out of Earth's orbit to block out the sun (something to do with screwing up the Earth's gravitational pull and wiping everything out on the planet)
3 - One cannot splice clothes into DNA to create a being fully clothed from 'birth' - Lex did this with his nephew to create Nuclear Man.
4 - Superman cannot repair the Wall of China with his eyes????
5 - What's going on with Superman's kiss? Why does Lois keep losing her short term memory everytime Superman kisses her?

Superman 3 - too too silly and why was Richard Pryor riding a donkey in this one? How did Superman fight with himself? Was that green Kryptonite or red? The color schematics on my t.v. showed the rock to be green which according to Superman lore kills Superman not makes him into a meanie (red Kryptonite does that).

Superman 2 - Very good film (wish we could splice the Jor-El scenes in the better Lester version of the film). Donner's version cut out Lex walking into the Daily Planet saying "Wonder when these dummies will learn to use a door". Great line.

Superman 1 - Great first hour. The movie had depth, warmth, empathy, etc. I loved the scene where young Clark and his mother have their backs to the camera and the camera is low to the field signifying that when Clark is with his mother, he's grounded and more human (those are scenes that make a film from good to great). Then the not too serious Lex appears (I prefer the Lex version that stays two steps ahead of the law rather than an insane real estate loving thug). Though he is funny (especially in Superman 2).

To conclude - Superman 4 IS A BAD FILM - watch it but be warned. It starts off o.k. but then gets stupider and stupider (if there's such a word).

 

[WillG]

Yup. And really, the effects were the only thing where not much could be done due to the budget cuts.

But really, the story alone is beyond ridiculous. Yes, at one point there might have been an interesting idea, but what the final product became is laughable. Like the entire would would be so enthusiastic, let alone willing to let their weapons be taken and destroyed and then rebuying them right away from Luthor.

Other than that concept, there are so many things wrong with the film, almost too many to count. How in the world was the script approved and filmed. Surely, someone must have pointed out that humans can't survive in space without a suit. Surely someone must have pointed out that Lois cannot fly on her own just because Superman is near her. Surely someone must have pointed out that the green crystal had already been found and used by Clark in the 1st and 2nd movies. The sad thing is that in most cases the deleted scenes that are now available on the DVD that many hoped would make the movie make more sense are even worse that what was left in (in most cases) I would say that the scene where Superman explains to the kid that he must not interfere with world affairs should have stayed in. Also the "Red Alert" scene should have stayed simply because it was the only scene in the film that lent a shred of creedence to the whole "Nukes are bad" statment that this film was trying to make. Everything else was either inconsequential at best to complete rubbish at it's worse such as the scene where Superman takes the kid up to space, (and again is perfectly fine without the aid of a space suit) and talks about how he doesn't know where one country ends and another begins. I don't know what's worse, that or the "Look at everyone's face....everyone's the same" scene from "Volcano"

Personally, I think that Superman IV makes Superman III look like Superman: The Movie by comparison. At least Superman III had decent production values and a story that while fairly ridiculous I think can work if you're willing to power down your brain far enough (a couple of completely impossible little things aside). Actually, with some better editing Superman III might have potential to be something halfway acceptable. I'm surprised that there does not seem to be fan edits floating around out there somewhere. I would lose any Pryor scenes that are not essential to the story (no offense, Richard, but your abundance of screen time hurts the film) Lose the opening sequence (use the opening credits against space that has appeared in TV versions of the film for the opening) and then just cut to the Planet and then move the Gus Gorman at the unemployment office scene somewhere after that. If possible, augment the Lana, Clark relationship with extra footage from the TV versions (if extra footage exists) Certainly cut the "WalkDon't walk signal scene), and Gus Gorman falling from the roof of a 50 story building and landing completely unscathed. And if possible, I would cut the whole weather satellite subplot. That's a lot to cut out so I might try to add in any of the Television footage that doesn't hurt the film to restore some of the running time.

There is nothing that can be done to make any significant improvements to Superman IV. Can't think of one scene it the film that isn't problematic.

 

[Mathew_M]

I agree that there's a good comic book movie buried in Superman 3. People laud Superman Returns as a "return" to what made the originals film so good and some of it works but as a whole Superman Returns just isn't very fun to watch. I also hate that there's now a kid attached to the whole Superman mythos. You can say all you want about Superman 3/4 but at least Jon Peters wasn't attached--that kid had his fingerprints all over it kind of like the gay robot side kick that was originally proposed during the Kevin Smith era. Now if they could make a Superman film without Golan-Globas or Jon Peters involved they might be onto something.

 

[Norm]

Even if the kid doesn't have stable powers he's going to be extra baggage. Plus it will age Superman & Lois because they will need to show the kid getting older. The Comic Book companies are to blame for not laying an outline of things these directors can & cannot do. I predict they do a complete reboot after Singer leaves. Other directors are not going to want to be tied down by what Donner & Singer did.

 

[Mathew_M]

Or the kid will just fade into the background, perpetually playing upstairs in their room--or better yet send him off to boarding school.

In a way the kid has de-sexualized Superman. There's just no chemistry anymore between Lois and Superman--not that the two actors who are now portraying them have any chemistry together.

 

[Kirk Tsai]

I do not follow comics, so I don't know much about the baddies of the Superman universe. What Paul wrote above, regarding Superman's place in the world problems, always seemed like the most interesting aspect of this character to me. Perhaps Reeve and the writers were trying to go in the right direction for 4. Ross's Peace on Earth is another that tried that. I don't think any of the upcoming movies would have that kind of ambition, and moviegoers probably don't yearn for such a movie.