Success with the WAF! Suggestions Please!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by LowellG, Feb 25, 2002.

  1. LowellG

    LowellG Stunt Coordinator

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    Well I finally broke through the WAF barrier. My TV used to be located in the corner of the family room making true surround sound almost impossible and severely limited my choice of main speakers. However, the promise of some new furniture and a couple of built in corner bookshelves, and I am on my way to a better HT selection.

    Before, I couldn’t even look at towers, and now I can. Plus she wants the room to look nice since that is where we spend most of our time. The Def Tech Power Monitor 400’s with (BP1.2X or PM100) surrounds and a Pro Center C2 is what I am looking at. I did not list the BP2006 because I would need to buy a CLR 2300 to match and it won’t fit on my TV, plus double the CC cost. My local Def Tech dealer has a speaker promotion coming in a few months. I can get the setup I listed for $1387.50, maybe a little cheaper if I buy a receiver from them.

    My question is, are there any other speaker systems I am overlooking in the same price/performance/size range?

    Considerations:

    -CC must go on top of TV. Sony 32” Trinitron on factory base, not perfectly flat on top, but a C2 will fit.

    -Must have surrounds of similar size listed.

    -Listening area 13’x15’, but very open on two sides. Another 15’ behind and 20’ on 1/3 of the right side. (In other words, the back side opens up to the breakfast table and kitchen, and the right side opens into a 4”stairway and on the other side of the stairway is the living/dining area.)

    -I like the no separate sub option of the PT400’s.

    -I think my 8” 60W Aiwa sub rocks the room so I can’t imagine anything more than that. Although, I could be wrong.

    Thanks in advance for your suggestions.
     
  2. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    Lowell,

    Are you looking at the ProTower400 mains or PowerMonitor500 mains?

    If possible, I think you should consider (3) PowerMonitor500's across the front stage.

    I feel that Def Tech makes tremendous speakers. They look great, and they sound great IMHO. Just make sure to try out some different amplification and cables with them. I have found Yamaha to be a nice match.

    Good luck!
     
  3. LowellG

    LowellG Stunt Coordinator

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    I have also considered the PM500's across the front. The 12" deep for a CC across the top of my tv is what concerns me. I just listened to the PM500 this weekend, they do sound good. I listened to the PT 400 about a month ago but ruled them out back then because of my room setup. I don't know which ones would give me better base. I plan running the LFE with a splitter to both subs no matter what set of speakers I get.
     
  4. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    You should try to compare the ProTower400 to the PowerMonitor500 side by side (preferrably at home). So you will be using the PowerMonitor or ProTower main speakers to handle the LFE? This might be ok, but eventually you will probably want to use a quality external sub with movies.
     
  5. Thomas_Berg

    Thomas_Berg Screenwriter

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    i'd suggest at least trying out a different sub. i've personally never liked Aiwa, either. if you have the $$, i'd suggest an SVS, as they will let you return it within 45 days for a full refund if you are'nt happy with it. you never know how much a quality subwoofer adds until you've tried one. (then you can't ever live without it!!) if nothing else, at least see if you can get a weekend demo from your dealer. the results may very well surprise you!
     
  6. LowellG

    LowellG Stunt Coordinator

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    Since nobody has recommended anything else except a sub, I guess Def Tech has the best bang for the buck on the rest of the setup?
     
  7. Steve_Ma

    Steve_Ma Second Unit

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    Lowell. Just a suggestion regarding the placement of the CC. I recently bought a 32" wega/trinitron. My existing center (B&W CC6 S2) was to deep for the top, but there was a simple solution.

    I did place the CC on top of the TV. The front of the speaker is flush with the front of the TV. I have the little sticky feety things preventing the speaker from actually touching the TV, but that's not really important. Since the TV will only support about 1/2 the depth of the speaker and it was somewhat unstable, I put a dark pair of wool socks under the back half of the speaker and sitting on top of the back of the TV shroud to give it some stability. It's hidden pretty well. I even watched my cat jump on it (once...and only once), and it never budged.

    Just a thought in case it increases your options.

    --Steve
     
  8. LowellG

    LowellG Stunt Coordinator

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    That's great advice Steve. That seems to be one of my limiting factors in CC's. I really don't want to put a shelf on the wall. I don't know if my Triniton has the same top as your Wega. It has a slight downward slope for about 5 inches in the center, and then goes back about 2 inches from the peak. How deep is your CC and do you have an approximate weight? The Def Techs I am looking at are between 9"-12" and 20-40 pounds.

    Thanks, Lowell
     
  9. Steve_Ma

    Steve_Ma Second Unit

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    Here's my CC's vitals. Pic below.
    Height: 151mm (5.9in)
    Width: 450mm (17.7in)
    Depth: 275mm (10.8in)
    Weight: 6.3kg (14lbs)
    There is a slight downward angle after the top of the TV levels ends. It only meant I needed thicker socks than I thought. lol.
    Also, I'm sure it won't be an issue, but make sure whatever CC you end up with is shielded.
    Best of luck,
    --Steve[​IMG]
     
  10. Steve_Ma

    Steve_Ma Second Unit

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    sorry, double post by accident.

    --S
     
  11. John_Bonner

    John_Bonner Supporting Actor

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  12. EricHaas

    EricHaas Supporting Actor

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    OK, I will be the first to break the trend and recommend a different brand. If WAF is a major issue, go check out Divas by Swans. www.av123.com. They are running a couple of very good specials right now until the middle of March. I do not own these but recently I got to hear them in someone else's HT. I *definitely* recommend them for sound quality. I rate them about on par with my Paradigm Reference setup sonically, which is a *very* high recommdation. And visually, well I guess it is a matter of opinion, but I have never seen anything that looks that nice in that price range. Have your wife take a look at the webpage. After I bought my Paradigms, the wife said she now finds them "acceptable" but when I made the mistake of showing her the Diva website, she said I should have gotten those.
    Pitch that Aiwa sub. Take a look at the Adire Rava or Hsu VTF-2, both at around $400. I doubt SVS will satisfy WAF, but you can have her look at those too here:
    www.svsubwoofers.com
    Edit: I am not familiar with the Def Tech line.
     
  13. Alex Prosak

    Alex Prosak Supporting Actor

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    The Diva's would definitely pass the WAF, they are gorgeous speakers, I'd love to give them a listen. Another line you might want to check out is Axiom Audio (www.axiomaudio.com). I've read some very positive comments on them, they should pass the WAF pretty easily, and they're very reasonably priced. You could get a SVS with what you save over the Definitive's.[​IMG]
    That said, I have heard the Definitive's and they are good speakers. I don't care for their subs though. I had a PF15 and it was okay for movies but terrible for music. Too boomy and unrefined.
     
  14. Tom Grooms

    Tom Grooms Second Unit

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    The Definitive Technologies you mentioned have built in powered woofers. I have never understood the logic behind this for home theater reproduction. Sub-bass has a lot to do with room acoustics and proper placement is as critical as selection. I would spend your money on a quality set of monitor's and get a dedicated subwoofer to handle the lower octaves. It just doesn't make sense to plug in your mains (PUN), run them at full range and only send what little LFE information is encoded on you source material to your dedicated sub. It even makes less sense to buy powered speakers only to cross them over. Let your pre/pro or receiver send the low stuff where it belongs, to a dedicated, well placed subwoofer. There are lots of entry level mid-fi speakers available in your price range. Go out and have a listen or better yet, bring some home for a trial with your gear.

    $0.02
     
  15. Russell _T

    Russell _T Supporting Actor

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    It was only a matter of time before someone mentioned the Divas. If you have a WAF problem they are guaranteed to solve it. The look of the Divas is only exceeded by their sound. See them at www.AV123.com.
    Russ
     
  16. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    "I have never understood the logic behind this for home theater reproduction."
    I feel that there are certainly potential benefits to using a speaker with a powered woofer and a quality external sub.
    Take a look at this thread:
    http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...threadid=49377
    "It even makes less sense to buy powered speakers only to cross them over."
    That is like saying that it doesn't make sense to add a quality external sub to any other nonpowered near full range speaker. Crossing over virtually any speaker makes sense because it takes the load off the loudspeaker to reproduce the lowest of lows.
     
  17. Tom Grooms

    Tom Grooms Second Unit

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    Logic

    Pronunciation: 'lä-jik

    Function: noun

    1 : a science that deals with the principles and criteria of validity of inference and demonstration : the science of the formal principles of reasoning

    2 : something that forces a decision apart from or in opposition to reason
     
  18. Tom Grooms

    Tom Grooms Second Unit

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    If you look at Def Tech's website, it states the PM 500's Frequency
    Response in 22 Hz-30 kHz.
    Why would you buy these for a home theater set-up only to hand off 80Hz and below to a subwoofer?
    For the $850 retail, I would look in a different direction for home theater use.
     
  19. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    And logically, how does your last post invalidate the notion that any speaker which has "formidable" response below 80Hz is not a waste, even when used with an external subwoofer?
     
  20. Bob_A

    Bob_A Supporting Actor

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    "If you look at Def Tech's website, it states the PM 500's Frequency

    Response in 22 Hz-30 kHz.

    Why would you buy these for a home theater set-up only to hand off 80Hz and below to a subwoofer?

    For the $850 retail, I would look in a different direction for home theater use. "

    You are ruling out a speaker based on specs??? Have you ever compared a powered speaker + external sub to its nonpowered equivalent + external sub? I know someone who has actually compared the former setup to the latter setup (using the matching nonpowered speaker)...and guess which setup he much preferred? The former.
     

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