Star Wars Episode VIII "The Last Jedi" Coming December 15, 2017 (1 Viewer)

[SamT]

I like the look of those background characters a lot. It feels like that Opera scene of Episode III.

 

[SamT]

http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/05/star-wars-the-last-jedi-secrets-revealed

 

[SamT]

Rian Johnson‏

I’m sure they talked about where it might go early on, but when they came to me there was no mapped story presented beyond TFA.

 

[Bryan^H]

Rian Johnson‏

I’m sure they talked about where it might go early on, but when they came to me there was no mapped story presented beyond TFA.

That is pretty much what I figured.
I hope for fans of the series the stories stay consistently decent, and not disjointed.

 

[SamT]

Even for TFA they had no plan which shocked me. They basically said we need these characters, a Luke like woman, an escaping trooper, a bad guy, now lets try to connect this people together and create a story around them.

 

[TravisR]

Plans are overrated.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

To a certain extent...

But as the counter-argument, I'd say that the prequel trilogy holds up well for me in large part because it's so brilliantly plotted. Lucas obviously made changes along the way and didn't have Revenge Of The Sith fully worked out when he was shooting Phantom Menace, but there's a continuity between those films and an intricacy in the storytelling that didn't seem present to the same degree in TFA. I'd agree that TFA really nailed its characters, but it didn't actually have very many interesting things to do with them.

I liked that the prequel trilogy felt like it was the work of one voice, and I'm concerned that this new trilogy won't have that feeling at all. Even the original trilogy, which was directed by three different people, still has a unified feel because Lucas was had written the stories for all of them and produced each. There's no equivalent here; J.J. Abrams did his one and jumped ship, as is his usual approach to pretty much every project he's ever been involved with on the big or small screen. I wish that they had gotten someone who could have carried the torch for three movies. I have very little faith that Colin Treverrow will give us anything other than the "Jurassic World" version of Return Of The Jedi.

 

[SamT]

I have very little faith that Colin Treverrow will give us anything other than the "Jurassic World" version of Return Of The Jedi.

 

[TravisR]

I have very little faith that Colin Treverrow will give us anything other than the "Jurassic World" version of Return Of The Jedi.

I don't think a plan would have an effect on your trepidation though because a rough plan (and it wouldn't be any more than that) wouldn't be enough to change your thoughts on the work of Trevorrow. If you didn't like Looper or Brick, you'd most likely be worried even if Rian Johnson had a detailed plan from others for Episode VIII.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

I don't think a plan would have an effect on your trepidation though because a rough plan (and it wouldn't be any more than that) wouldn't be enough to change your thoughts on the work of Abrams, Johnson or Treverrow.

That's a fair point, though... my issue with Abrams isn't really the work he does. It's more the work he doesn't do. It's disappointing to me to get something done so well and really brought to life, and then see how thoroughly disinterested he is in seeing it through to its conclusion. If Abrams had been announced as directing all three films, or if it had been announced that he'd serve as a "showrunner" type producer for the follow-up films, I would have felt a lot better.

I do love Rian Johnson's work - Looper is one of the very best things I've ever seen. I'm a little concerned that Mark Hamill and Daisy Ridley both hate his script, though. But that's a new concern. At the time of the announcement, I was all happy thoughts on that one.

But I'll definitely admit that Treverrow's selection always bugged me. I think the conclusion of a trilogy is the hardest thing to get right, and I can think of very few trilogies released in my lifetime where the third installment was the best (or heck, even examples where the third just isn't the worst.) So, you've got that challenge at the start, where it looks like they've given the hardest movie to the least talented filmmaker of the bunch. I did not like Jurassic World, though I love Spielberg's original Jurassic Park. Jurassic World to me felt like it took the flaws of the original film but not the stuff that made it great, but it was wildly popular and successful anyway. My concern is that just the way Return Of The Jedi dilutes what should be an emotionally intense, dark ride into something more kid friendly and less dangerous, Episode IX will also take a safer, cuddlier, more family friendly approach (just as Jurassic World did). When they originally announced this new trilogy, the idea was that Treverrow would direct Johnson's script for 9. I'd trust him more directing someone else's script than his own; my skepticism started to rise when it was announced that Treverrow was scripting with his Jurassic World co-writer.

 

[Dave Moritz]

Am very interested in seeing the new Star Wars: The Last Jedi in November.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

But as the counter-argument, I'd say that the prequel trilogy holds up well for me in large part because it's so brilliantly plotted. Lucas obviously made changes along the way and didn't have Revenge Of The Sith fully worked out when he was shooting Phantom Menace, but there's a continuity between those films and an intricacy in the storytelling that didn't seem present to the same degree in TFA.

Yes, the prequel trilogy was really strong on the macro level and TFA was really strong on the micro level. Obviously Lucas was open to improvisation and change along the way -- such as making Anakin younger than originally planned -- but the destination was always in sight.

The Force Awakens had much stronger dialogue, more engaging characters, and better performances. The stuff going on within each scene worked better. But there's an elegance to the design and flow of the The Phantom Menace through Empire Strikes Back that is not present in The Force Awakens.

But I'll definitely admit that Treverrow's selection always bugged me. I think the conclusion of a trilogy is the hardest thing to get right, and I can think of very few trilogies released in my lifetime where the third installment was the best (or heck, even examples where the third just isn't the worst.) So, you've got that challenge at the start, where it looks like they've given the hardest movie to the least talented filmmaker of the bunch. I did not like Jurassic World, though I love Spielberg's original Jurassic Park. Jurassic World to me felt like it took the flaws of the original film but not the stuff that made it great, but it was wildly popular and successful anyway. My concern is that just the way Return Of The Jedi dilutes what should be an emotionally intense, dark ride into something more kid friendly and less dangerous, Episode IX will also take a safer, cuddlier, more family friendly approach (just as Jurassic World did). When they originally announced this new trilogy, the idea was that Treverrow would direct Johnson's script for 9. I'd trust him more directing someone else's script than his own; my skepticism started to rise when it was announced that Treverrow was scripting with his Jurassic World co-writer.

Did you see Safety Not Guaranteed? It was also written by Trevorrow and Connolly, and it's a far more sophisticated, strange and ambitious movie than Jurassic World would hint at. It still had some of the problems that Jurassic World had, but it definitely wasn't that kind of mass-produced empty calorie junk food. I get the impression that the Jurassic Park franchise is much more of a committee-driven affair than Lucasfilm under Kathleen Kennedy, where there's a lot of group discussion up front and then the filmmakers are allowed to make their films.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

I did see Safety Not Guaranteed. I knew soon after it started that I was either going to love it or hate it, with no middle ground, and that it was all going to come down to whether or not the guy was making the whole thing up or telling the truth. Fortunately, the movie ended with the audience given the right answer.

 

[TravisR]

I do love Rian Johnson's work - Looper is one of the very best things I've ever seen. I'm a little concerned that Mark Hamill and Daisy Ridley both hate his script, though. But that's a new concern.

I wouldn't really worry about that because Mark Hamill said on Twitter that he was wrong. I think some actors can understandably get fixated on their ideas for the characters (like anyone who has an emotional investment in them or their story) and when something different from that idea comes along, their initial reaction is "What the hell is?". And for what it's worth, Adam Driver said the script is great.

 

[SamT]

When did Mark Hamill and Daisy Ridley say they hate his script?

 

[TravisR]

When did Mark Hamill and Daisy Ridley say they hate his script?

I didn't see Mark Hamill say that he hated the script (not to say that he didn't say that) but in that recent Vanity Fair article, he said that he fundamentally disagreed with the choices that Johnson made for the character of Luke. A couple of days later, Hamill said on Twitter that he was wrong. https://twitter.com/HamillHimself/status/868175070903943168

The writer from Vanity Fair also pointed out that Hamill also said that he was pleased with the movie in the article.
https://twitter.com/MrKamp/status/868204050491334656

 

[WillG]

I didn't see Mark Hamill say that he hated the script (not to say that he didn't say that) but in that recent Vanity Fair article, he said that he fundamentally disagreed with the choices that Johnson made for the character of Luke. A couple of days later, Hamill said on Twitter that he was wrong. https://twitter.com/HamillHimself/status/868175070903943168

The writer from Vanity Fair also pointed out that Hamill also said that he was pleased with the movie in the article.
https://twitter.com/MrKamp/status/868204050491334656

I think it must be said though that Hamill's 180 may not mean a whole lot. I'm sure that all the actors have non disparity clauses in their contracts and I'd say there's a decent chance that Hamill caught hell for what he initially said. Now he may be being sincere, but in a case like this it's hard to take purely at face value.

 

[Bryan^H]

I just think it is reckless making a trilogy without an outline. It is the building block for really good storytelling. Without a strong outline, and time restraints it could force the writer of a particular episode to become frustrated, and make something less than what it should be.

If I really thought TFA was a great movie, the news of no mapped story would have made me sad. But as it is, I think it's about par for the course of the direction of the new Star Wars.

 

[TravisR]

I think it must be said though that Hamill's 180 may not mean a whole lot. I'm sure that all the actors have non disparity clauses in their contracts and I'd say there's a decent chance that Hamill caught hell for what he initially said. Now he may be being sincere, but in a case like this it's hard to take purely at face value.

I agree that even if he thinks that it's the worst movie of all time, he's still going to act like it's awesome but it's much more likely that if he really does hate what they did with Luke, he wouldn't have brought that topic up at all.

I just think it is reckless making a trilogy without an outline.

George Lucas did it with the OT. Any plan he had was used in the first movie.

Is there any movie trilogy or series- outside of an adaptation of books- where there was a real plan for multiple movies? Not just the Marvel move of putting one thing in that will end up in a future movie but a real outline for a series of movies. That's why I think plans are overrated.

 

[Bryan^H]

George Lucas did it with the OT. Any plan he had was used in the first movie.

Is there any movie trilogy or series- outside of an adaptation of books- where there was a real plan for multiple movies? Not just the Marvel move of putting one thing in that will end up in a future movie but a real outline for a series of movies. That's why I think plans are overrated.

George Lucas made changes, and additions to his original SW overall story, but the outline of the entire trilogy was set mainly before he filmed Star Wars, or at least that is what he says.


Even so, it was still all his vision. He had the concept, story and the specifics all in his brain. He knew where it was going, and how it would end.

A different writer/director with each episode, and no set ending/resolution seems crazy to me.