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Star Wars: Episode I in P&S (1 Viewer)

Inspector Hammer!

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Dave,
your position on DD is so off base from reality that it's not even feasable. The DD EX track on the 'SW EP 1' dvd is among the finest mixes DD has to offer! If you still doubt that DD can rock as hard as DTS can, try Toy Story 2, if that opening sequence doesn't change your stance, nothing ever will.
Ya know, just once I would love to get a look at a couple of these do-or-die DTS fanatics bedrooms! They've probably got DTS curtains, DTS bedsheets, DTS throw pillows, DTS carpeting, DTS wallpaper (on the actual walls, not on a computer), DTS posters all over the place!
I'm kidding of course. ;)
 

Dave Moritz

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Hey John

Have you been peeking in my window again, lmao. No DTS carpeting, bedsheets, wallpaper here, lol.

I have both TPM and Toystory 2 on dvd and I can not say I was blown away by ether DD track. Not sure how you figure that my position is so off base with reality? I have Tomorrow Never Dies that is in DD only and the bass and highs sound unnaturall and boosted. In Phantom Menace the center channel sounds subdued. As do most DD tracks, in The Haunting DD compaired to DTS is no contest. Saving Private Ryan, Airforce One, Men In Black and even Dances with Wolves sounds better in DTS. Just because the advertisement said that TPM was the best DD track ever. Does not make it so, I would prefere movies played back on a solid audiophile piece in Dolby Prologic over DD. I have heard DTS and DD on Denon, Pioneer Elite, Sony ES, Yamaha and even Theata Digital recievers / prepros. If DD will up the data rate to incoperate more data to reproduce the sound and redo Dolby Digital. Then it may just outmatch DTS but I do not think they will. Like Terrell stated a few post ago:

"Nobody is ramming Dolby Digital down your throat. It was adopted as the official surround track for the DVD format, and is pretty much standard on all DVDs nowadays."

Dolby Digital is the adopted standard but that does not meen it is better. DD has a higher compression rate and lower data transfer rate p/sec. That is one of the reasons it was chosen for pay channels like HBO and Showtime. Its all about bandwith on cable and satalites. As far as DVD goes well not idea who sold the industry on DD? There are more and more movies coming out with both DD and DTS on the same disc. I walked out of the theater when it was played in DD! It is hard to like DD when it is so commpressed and lacking. Even DD DVD-A's are not all that great. All though since there is no video on the dvd they can run a lower compression rate for the audio. I have not even played TPM for almost 4 months now. I do listen to DD movies but even though they might be good movies the audio never seems to grab me. So in the audio area I really do not enjoy the movie fully. Part of my HT upgrade will include a DD plaque and a THX poster in my HT. That does not meen I care for DD.

And since DD is the default format that the majority of the dvd content is in. They technically it is being rammed down our troat because we as consumers have no choice most of the time. Whe we go to the theater we can choose between Dolby Digital, DTS and even SDDS. Why cant we choose what format we use at home? When SW2 is released I will watch it a few times then it will sit and collect dust dust like TPM is doing now. And yes I will buy SW2 in widescreen even though it will be in DD only but it does not mean I will like it. Will have to wait and see if there is any improvement in the DD-EX when SW2 is released? You have a nice day John and maybe we will chat again soon?
 

Sean Moon

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Here we go again. The big fight between DD and DTS. Can we please get this topic back on track? I am just happy that we even get 5.1 or 6.1 digital sound at all on our DVDs. We should be thankful for that I think. If a DVD doesnt have DTS, there are probably reasons. As long as there is another 5.1 track, that should be good enough. If you prefer one over the other then so be it...just please do the arguing somewhere else.
 

Dave Scarpa

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I Just wish the disnomer FULL SCREEN would go away. It allocates a value that just isn't there. I Recently joined a Mom & Pop video store that had a decent DVD Section, and I decided that I'd rather not give my rental Buisness to BB. But this guy won't get much either as any DVD that could be gotten in P&S was. I Informed him I would'nt be renting much. He asked me if I Like WS releasesI toldhim I do and if I did'nt I'd rent VHS. He then went on to Lie to me saying it's what theysend him. He does the ordering the idiot. Bottom line does'nt want a confrontation with a customer. I Have no problemwitha 50-50 ratio, but not being given a choice?
 

Jeff Kleist

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Dave, actually it probably IS waht they send him. Unless he SPECIFICALLY asks for widescreen the distributor will default him P&S every time. That's how video stores work

What's better is that the Star Wars films are 2.35:1 anamorphic (no soft-mattes). This means that Star Wars will make the perfect widescreen to pan-and-scan comparison.
Except Episode 2, where they shot 1.78:1 (intending for a 2.40:1 image) and then matted the already low resolution image and blew it up. I can't wait to see these new cameras for Episode 3. I hope they got rid of the CCD noise and video artifacting that's all over Episode 2.
 

Dave Moritz

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Hey Sean
The point I was trying to make that and maybe I did a poor job at it was. That DD should not be the only choice, and just like P&S and widescreen we should have a choice. Yes I agree that having 5.1 or 6.1 is great. But if the quality of the 5.1 or 6.1 is medioaker whats the point? But at least give us the choice. For a short time we had the choice of VHS, laserdisc or dvd. DD is like VHS and DTS is the dvd. And I guess another alanogy is p&s vs widescreen.
I agree Dave I wish full screen would go away as well it sucks. But I have the answer for alot of the gripes to go away on the DD vs DTS debate. All dvd's that have a DD track should have a DTS track as well. So we the consumer can choose what we want to listen to. I prefere one format and do no care for other people telling me what I am stuck with. I also do not think they should have DTS only for a movie. Because there are some people that have DD only receivers or they prefere DD. So they should have the choice as well as anyone else. IMHO I would love it if DD disapeared but then others would not have a choice and that would be hipacriticall of me. So all i am saying is give us a CHOICE
;)
 

Brenton

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Hey, Dave, is that the real cover art? The blue stripes at the top and bottom are much bigger than the ones on full screen Episode II and the tan ones on widescreen I and II.

Anyways, where is this coming from?? Starwars.com hasn't mentioned it, where are you guys getting this from?

And who here thinks that Lucas will be reissuing Episode I in widescreen with the word "WIDESCREEN" across the top in place of the tagline "Every saga has a beginning". Well, looks like all of us mindless, soulless, fans will be adding another copy of Episode I to our collection just so that ALL of our Star Wars DVDs will say the same thing across the top.
 

David Lambert

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It comes from Fox, using the same resources I get to grab a box cover from, say, X-Files Season 6 for the site I assist, TVShowsOnDVD.com. I don't think they'll mind me sharing it. :)
It's authentic. Perhaps it's preliminary, though. But it definately comes from Fox.
 

Josh Lowe

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Where is THX in all this? They should put out specifications for video as well as audio, specifying the OAR for media and the capability to show OAR for display devices - in other words no 4:3 TVs or PJs would be THX certified.

Seeing the THX logo on a DVD in P&S is absurd when you think about what the goal of THX was in the first place.
 

Adam Lenhardt

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Where is THX in all this? They should put out specifications for video as well as audio, specifying the OAR for media and the capability to show OAR for display devices - in other words no 4:3 TVs or PJs would be THX certified.
While 4x3 teles are perfectly capable of reproducing the original aspect ratio, I agree that P&S tapes and DVDs shouldn't be certified. Academy ratio films like Citizen Kane and the Wizard of Oz are of course the exceptions. If THX made it's qualifications stricter they might actually mean something.
 

Patrick McCart

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The P&S edition will have MORE ringing.

I saw a little bit of the 4:3 version on TV and it's loaded with artifacts..

This will be a poor seller, however...the people who want Episode 1 on DVD already have the LBX version. In fact, this new version isn't even going to be carried at most stores because of the long delay.

It's nice, at least, to have dual versions. Those who want widescreen get all the image, those who don't get all their TV. I don't think we should stop any fullscreen releases as long as there's a widescreen counterpart. The numbers show more people want widescreen, anyways.
 

Inspector Hammer!

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ThX certifying a P&S release completly nulifies the whole ideal behind THX. It's contradictory in the most extreme sense of the word! :rolleyes
I hope this falls flat on it's face!
And I completly disagree Patrick, P&S and fullscreen SHOULD be stopped. The filmmakers have already made the choice as to what ratio to compose their films, Joe and Jane do not have the right to see it any other way. I'm with Ron (Epstein) on this issue, OAR should be forced upon the masses, only then will they throw up their hands and give up. Look at it this way, what other choice would they have in that situation? Either watch films in their proper OAR's, OR stop watching films forever. They certaintly will not do the latter, they will have no choice but to adapt to wide-screen.
What I just said may sound extreme, but playtime with Joe and Jane is over, it's time to get serious with them. I'm so fricken sick of the whole war, I WISH PAN & SCAN AND FULL FRAME WOULD JUST DIE ALREADY!!! :angry:
 

Jeremy Allin

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John,

Just to suggest this situation, could you answer me this question?

If a widscreen (or OAR) release was always available, would it make one iota of a difference if a MAR version was released along side?

It sure as hell wouldn't to me. Let them have their crap MAR version that 'fills the screen'. As long as I get my OAR version, I'm as happy as a clam.
 

AndyDL

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I agree with John on this one.
If we're gonna go, we're gonna go all the way.
Dual releases, widescreen & PS, in my opinion is just going to create more confusion in our OAR "education efforts."
It's OAR or nothin'.
 

Inspector Hammer!

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I guess I wouldn't have a choice but to accept it would I? It's out of my hands, I can't stop it.
I couldn't care less what they watch, but if I had it within my power, I would kill P&S and full frame forever.
You give them an inch, they want a mile. You give them a glass of milk, they want a cookie. See what i'm getting at here? I've said this before in the past, I don't care what Joe and Jane do, or how they watch their films, HOWEVER, when they start trying to take MY shit away, I have a problem with that. If they had it their way, they would take widescreen away from us, and believe me as long as they have a choice in the matter, they will continue to try to do just that. That, plus the artistic integriy issue I mentioned above, are the reasons why they shouldn't have a choice in the matter. As was said so elegantly above, OAR or nothing.
It almost happened with Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, The Goonies, and Cats & Dogs until we stepped in and made a fuss to Warner about it. The masses cried WE HATE THE BLACK BARS!! GIVE US ONLY FULLSCREEN!! and Warner listened and was fully prepared to cater to them... and forget us.
If only OAR exsisted, that would never have happened.
But we forgive you Warner! :D
 

Jeremy Allin

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The masses cried WE HATE THE BLACK BARS!! GIVE US ONLY FULLSCREEN!! and Warner listened and was fully prepared to cater to them... and forget us.
Excellent point. The day that this becomes a problem, my above statement becomes useless - we need to do something. Until then...let the good times roll. :D
BTW, I love your Army of Darkness parody below your name!
 

Terrell

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John makes some good points, but was there even remotely this much disgust when FOTR released a P&S along with the OAR.
 

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