Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan - Mistake?

Discussion in 'Movies' started by Jim Williams, Mar 9, 2004.

  1. Jim Williams

    Jim Williams Second Unit

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    I was re-watching this movie tonight when I noticed a line that Khan speaks. He quotes an ancient Klingon saying that goes something like this: "revenge is a dish that is best served cold". How could he even know about the Klingons? He is from the late 20th century and was in stasis for 200 years. Could this be a movie mistake or did I just hear it wrong?
     
  2. Ken Chan

    Ken Chan Producer

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    You heard it right. He did a fair amount of reading while recuperating in sickbay during the TOS episode. And who knows what reading material he brought with him to Ceti Alpha 5. But most likely it was the writers having fun with a fairly well-known proverb.
     
  3. Rollie

    Rollie Stunt Coordinator

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    First off, Nick Meyer loves to quote this kind of stuff. (Old Vulcan proverb: Only Nixon could go to China, anyone?)

    Secondly, I have a book about Wrath of Khan (Biographies I think) and it explains several discontinuities in the same fashion as stated above. Khan did extensive reading when he was on Enterprise. This would seem to explain his knowledge of Klingon culture.

    The book also speculates that Khan memorized the Enterprise's crew logs. This explains how he recognizes Chekov in TWOK despite having never met him in Space Seed. (Apparently Chekov was on the Enterprise at the time, but not a bridge officer.)

    So, in answering the question the long way around, we've proven two things.

    1) Nick Meyer is a Trek god, and can quote whatever he wants.
    2) There's always a Trekker explanation for an onscreen screw up. [​IMG]
     
  4. Brent Bridgeman

    Brent Bridgeman Second Unit

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    Would that be a.....treksplanation?:b
     
  5. Mark Turetsky

    Mark Turetsky Supporting Actor

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    Not to mention that it's not a Klingon saying at all: it's been around on Earth for hundreds of years. He might be making a joke, along the lines of the Old Vulcan Proverb in ST6. Not to mention that "The Unidiscovered Country" in Hamlet is Death, not the Future.
     
  6. Tony Whalen

    Tony Whalen Producer

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    Well yeah. That would be why, when Gorkon offers his toast to "the Undiscovered Country", everyone pauses and stares at him, until he clarifies that he means "to the future". [​IMG]

    I'm such a geek. [​IMG]
     
  7. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    You want to know if there are "mistakes" in this film?

    Well, even in the best of Star Trek, there are technical and scientific errors. For example, playing hide-and-seek in a gaseous interstellar nebula. Not possible. You could be smack in the middle of, say, the Orion Nebula and not be able to tell it with your eyes. A nebula is almost as thin in matter as space itself. They simply look "thicker" from several light years out in a time-exposed photographic plate taken by a telescope.

    I could go on, but why? The movie's fun to watch and now that there most likely won't be any further Trek features, we can safely say that this one's the best of the lot.
     
  8. Hartwig Hanser

    Hartwig Hanser Second Unit

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    Well, I like Wrath of Khan, but in my opinion First Contact is the better film. So I suggest that we safely say, it is one of the best of the lot. [​IMG]
     
  9. JonZ

    JonZ Lead Actor

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    I always assumed one of the books in Khans collection was Klingon.
     
  10. Adam_ME

    Adam_ME Supporting Actor

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    I was actually wondering about this recently. The most plausible explainations are:

    1) As mentioned by others, Khan might've come across this when doing his catch-up learning on the Enterprise in "Space Seed".

    2) Perhaps the databanks on the Botany Bay were updated before Khan and his followers were left on Ceti Alpha V, and this bit of information was included.

    What I'd like to know is how Khan was able to keep his people(most of them anyway) alive for 14 1/2 years after the planet was left in that barren state. I know he has his
    "genetically superior intellect", but c'mon! There's no food!
     
  11. StevenA

    StevenA Second Unit

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    What about Khan recognizing Chekov ("I never forget a face") despite the fact that Chekov didn't join TOS until Season 2, after Khan's visit!! Love that one. [​IMG]

    (Maybe Chekov was an ensign during Season 1, and Khan passed him in the corridor? [​IMG] )
     
  12. Tony Whalen

    Tony Whalen Producer

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    Walter Koenig reportedly says that Chekov was in the bathroom, and kept Khan waiting in a near-bladder-bursting state. As such, Khan was SURE to remember his face. [​IMG]

    *picturing Ricardo doing the "pee-dance" in an Enterprise hallway* [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  13. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    Well, how about Starfleet even noticing the fact that one of the planets in the Ceti Alpha system had "exploded"? That they were on the wrong planet to begin with?

    And in the 23rd century will we still need eyeglasses?

    And what about that screen behind Spock on the bridge, the one that displays a swirly "op art"-type of pattern. Just what the hell does it do?

    (A fanboy response to the Chekov thing could be: "Uh, well, maybe Pavel just wasn't on the bridge crew in Season One.")
     
  14. Rob Gardiner

    Rob Gardiner Cinematographer

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    Only for patients who are allergic to Retinax V. [​IMG] Besides, it's been established that Kirk appreciates antiques. The computer in his apartment is a Commodore 64. [​IMG]

    Other big mistakes:

    1. Kirk should have listened to Saavik and raised the shields

    2. Sicbay was probably a better place for Scotty to bring his dying nephew, rather than the bridge
     
  15. Ben Cloud

    Ben Cloud Extra

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    It was actually a Commodore PET
     
  16. Gary->dee

    Gary->dee Screenwriter

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    I saw the Wrath of Khan director's cut screening at Paramount with Meyer and Montalban in attendance back in 2002(I think it was 2002). Beer, food, great Trek, great moment. I sat there with a stupid grin on my face through out the entire movie.
     
  17. Robert Todd

    Robert Todd Agent

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    ...with my last breath, I spit at thee... now that's classic cinema! As far as a SCIENCE fiction space film, Clarke and Kubrick proved it COULD be done. Why can't someone else develop some of the other amazing properties into equally compelling films? Philip K. Dick has had a good run lately, but there are so many other stories that would lend themselves to visionary, yet realistic interpretations. Clarke's own "Rendezvous with Rama" comes to mind. Yeah, I know it's a corny title, but the story could be adapted to an incredible screenplay given todays' technology.
     
  18. Chris Harvey

    Chris Harvey Second Unit

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    RWR is actually in development by David Fincher's company, with Morgan Freeman loosely attached as star. I remember a script review from awhile back that was quite positive, saying that while they adjusted the story for a more action/adventure focus, it was very faithful to most of Clarke's concepts and his vision of Rama.
     
  19. Kenny Goldin

    Kenny Goldin Second Unit

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    I thought their reason for going in the nebula was because it would mess up their sensors and that would "even the odds" (a damaged enterprise vs. a relatively intact Reliant) as I believe Kirk says. If the Enterprise and Reliant had windshields instead of viewscreens maybe the nebula would not have been helpful (A Ten Forward type area on the Ent. A would have been helpful if you are right about the Nebulas [​IMG] ). I dunno, never thought about it before though. I'm probably wrong.[​IMG]
     
  20. Kenny Goldin

    Kenny Goldin Second Unit

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    I always noticed an image on a monitor around where Uhura sits that I always thought looked like the Burger King logo.[​IMG]
     

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