Paramount+ Star Trek: Discovery - Official Thread (1 Viewer)

[Nelson Au]

Your caution regarding how good this new season will be is reasonable given your reservations from the first year. I’m guarding my expectations but from what I’ve seen so far, looks like it’s promising.

 

[Carabimero]

I fixed my Roku. It was an enlightening experience. The first fix I tried was the right one, but I didn't leave the fix in long enough. I restarted my router and then my Roku, but apparently the fix was unplugging each for five minutes, then restarting the router, then Roku. But before I figured that out, however, I made everything harder on myself: I reverted to factory settings, changed the DNS, and so on, so that by the time I tried the five-minute thing, I had to reactivate all my accounts, etc. Normally that wouldn't be a big deal, but as it goes, my router is on one end of my house and my Roku on the other. Let's just say I got a workout. It took me about four hours last night, but I got everything back up and running, and am ready for what I anticipate to be a much improved season of DISCOVERY.

I do agree with Josh S that it will probably be next season until we see the unfortunate vestiges of season one diminish. But I am still anticipating an improved season two.

I am hoping my wife will be home by 5:30 so we can watch when it goes live on the West coast.

 

[Nelson Au]

Glad to hear you fixed your Roku Alan! Engage!

 

[Josh Steinberg]

I had tremendous technical difficulties with CBS All Access for season one. The biggest one was that I paid for the commercial free version, but that Discovery still played with commercials regardless. I did complain and they looked into it, determined that I wasn’t making that up, and refunded me.

So this time around, I decided to sign up yesterday so that I had time to troubleshoot any issues. It appears to be working as it should, which is great news.

I also had the chance last night to view the four Short Trek installments at last. I just want willing to pay $10 a month to view only 15 minutes of new content. I don’t regret being frugal about that, but I really enjoyed all four of them. The first two were probably my favorites but I liked them all. Good writing and performances. And it was just really cool to see smaller stories being told.

I’d love to see a full on episode of a Trek show that was told in a similar fashion, with only one or two cast members for the entire episode. Doctor Who did one like that a few years ago where the Doctor was the only character and it was pretty cool. I think this iteration of Trek could pull it off too.

 

[Carabimero]

I liked the first episode of season two. We're exploring, and IMO that's what Star Trek is about. Also, I appreciated what was finally revealed about Spock. That makes me think of TMP, when V'ger called to him. I did like that part a lot. And the implicit promise the writers made that Burnham and Spock are on paths to connect.

The action set piece was motivated more believably than season one ever did, and I appreciated that, though the same frenetic style of action (rocks swarming, and so on) makes it hard to swallow that ANYONE could survive some of these sequences. But that's the state of the art, so I am going with it.

Overall, I am much more excited after tonight's episode about the prospect of season two. I'm not going to say it feels like Star Trek, but I think it feels more like Star Trek than season one, and maybe as much as it can for this show supposedly set in Prime. My wife loves ST but doesn't read the trades or fan sites, and when I told her this was the allegedly set in the Prime Universe, she laughed. "Silly boy," she said. Despite what the show runners claim, I enjoy the show more when I picture it in the Kelvin universe. It's the only way I can reconcile it since not enough of an attempt was made visually to make me believe otherwise. That said, I appreciated some of the touches in Spock's quarters.

Tilly is as lovable as ever. Glad for that. And glad Star Trek is back on my TV every week for a while. That is something I probably took for granted during the 90s but never will take for granted again.

Here's to gaining strength from our diversity as we relentlessly explore the unknown in season two.

 

[Josh Dial]

I thought the season 2 premiere was excellent. Quick thoughts:

• The intro sequence was beautiful.
  
• Anson Mount exudes charisma with his take on Pike.
• The action set pieces were thrilling and cinematic.
• We got to see inside the turbolift shaft!
• Spock's quarters were very well done.
• The expanded (widened) bridge set looks great on screen.
• It was great to see more from the bridge crew. I think Detmer had more lines this episode than in all of season 1.
• Great introduction to Tig Notaro's Commander Reno.
• The transition from the Disco to the Enterprise at Spock's quarters had a strangely emotional punch for me.

The red bursts--Iconians?

 

[joshEH]

“...I’m drunk on power.”

 

[Nelson Au]

Lots of action, humor and poignant moments. Yes, exploration too. And a reasonable explanation why Pike takes the Discovery with the Enterprise sidelined. I like his take on Pike. He’s pre-burned out and definitely non-Lorca. I had read about the plan to include the bridge crew more and it was fun to see. I see that Saru has gotten over his embarrassment when his fear tendrils extend out, that was a funny line he had. But does it lessen the character? Kind of funny explanation that Bernham said that Starfleet was keeping the Enterprise out of the way to protect her as a last resort during the war. And I liked the way Detmer was so impressed with the Enterprise. Which seemed kind of incongruous, that the Enterprise should be seen with such high esteem at this stage in time. Not being critical. But just saying what I was thinking during those scenes. Obviously it’s a little fan service.

Yes, I had similar thoughts about Spock’s quarters, the Vulcan harp and also the large instrument with the bells we see from Amok Time was a nice touch. The 3D chess set would have been cooler had they found and used the exact same chess pieces that Charlie melted. I thought though that Spock’s quarters was pretty big! However, I still believe that this is the Prime Universe and any differences are due to this silly rule that any resemblance to TOS has to not be more then a certain percentage.

Oh yeah, I forgot to add, I agree that Spock taking leave to search for this thing out in space is very much a call back to The Motion Picture. So it seems odd to throw this kind of event in his earlier life when Spock is shown in The Cage and early TOS as still very much a young and inexperienced officer, still learning to live with humans. On the other hand, it sort of shows that Spock will leave at the drop of a hat for any powerful force he senses from out in space.

This red angel thing I see will be more fully explored as the season goes on.

 

[Carabimero]

However, I still believe that this is the Prime Universe and any differences are due to this silly rule that any resemblance to TOS has to not be more then a certain percentage.

It's not a percentage for me. Evoking the Supreme Court's definition of pornography is the best way I can define what qualifies for the Prime TOS universe: I know it when I see it.

I see fragments of it in DISCOVERY (more in S2E1 than in all of last season) but overall only enough, at least for my tastes, to conclude it's Kelvin or Mirror (which of course they tell me outside of the show that it isn't).

When I was a student at The American Film Institute, Tony Velanti interrupted me as I tried to correct a misconception after screening my film. Valenti put his finger to his lips and pointed to the screen. "You had your chance to speak up there."

Every week, the creators of DISCOVERY speak to me by what they put on the screen. And it just doesn't say "TOS Prime" to me.

That said, I'm going with it because finally DISCOVERY feels , if only a little bit, like Star Trek to me. And after season one, I'll take it.

On the other hand, it sort of shows that Spock will leave at the drop of a hat for any powerful force he senses from out in space.

The thing I liked about Spock pursuing V'ger in TMP was that he believed V'ger held the answer to his problem of whether logic was enough. Let's see if there's a bigger point in DISCOVERY, as well.

One of the things I didn't like about tonight's episode, if I heard correctly, is before serving with Kirk it is said by Sarek that Spock had a way of showing us that logic wasn't the answer but the beginning of the answer. If this is nine years before TOS Prime, this simply isn't true. Certainly not in TOS. It isn't until the late date of the motion pictures when Spock becomes enlightened on this point. Yet in Discovery's timeline and universe, Spock has already inspiring this in his own father years before serving with Kirk!

As a filmmaker, if you're not going to seal the deal visually with it being TOS Prime, then you have to take script opportunities to show you are educated and understand important character development that came after your show in TOS Prime. If you don't do it visually, and you contradict it in the narrative, I have only the word of someone at CBS telling me this is TOS Prime. And that ain't enough for me in the face of the preponderance of screen evidence telling me it's not.

The 3D chess set would have been cooler had they found and used the exact same chess pieces that Charlie melted.

If we're to believe CBS, it's nine years BEFORE Charlie X, so the chess pieces wouldn't have melted yet. Same with the Vulcan Bells. Amok Time hasn't happened yet. But I can see why someone might not believe that just looking at the show. The visuals, narrative and dialogue say one thing. A claim by CBS says something else.

Edit: I watched the episode again. I like it even more. But you know what would help this show feel like Star Trek to me? The little things, like the writers understanding how major characters in this universe at this time really talk. When Burrnham asks Sarek how long it's been since he saw Spock, he replies, "Years." If this was really Prime-TOS Sarek, he would answer something like, "Seven point three-eight years." Or when he and Burnham said farewell at the end of the scene, he would give her the Vulcan salute. Sarek simply would. The writers want the gravity of playing in a very specific sandbox but they don't truly understand the depth of the sand they're playing with. And IMO it simply doesn't feel like the sand they claim it is, either visually, in narrative, or in how the characters talk.

The show got better, but the writers' lack of understanding (or lack of simply caring) of the time, place and characters they are writing about still persists.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

To quote New York Times critic Janet Maslin from her review of Star Trek II, “Now this is more like it”!

 

[Bryan^H]

To quote New York Times critic Janet Maslin from her review of Star Trek II, “Now this is more like it”!

I'm speechless.

 

[joshEH]

It's not a percentage for me. Evoking the Supreme Court's definition of pornography is the best way I can define what qualifies for the Prime TOS universe: I know it when I see it.

I see fragments of it in DISCOVERY (more in S2E1 than in all of last season) but overall only enough, at least for my tastes, to conclude it's Kelvin or Mirror (which of course they tell me outside of the show that it isn't).

When I was a student at The American Film Institute, Tony Velanti interrupted me as I tried to correct a misconception after screening my film. Valenti put his finger to his lips and pointed to the screen. "You had your chance to speak up there."

Every week, the creators of DISCOVERY speak to me by what they put on the screen. And it just doesn't say "TOS Prime" to me.

That said, I'm going with it because finally DISCOVERY feels , if only a little bit, like Star Trek to me. And after season one, I'll take it.


The thing I liked about Spock pursuing V'ger in TMP was that he believed V'ger held the answer to his problem of whether logic was enough. Let's see if there's a bigger point in DISCOVERY, as well.

One of the things I didn't like about tonight's episode, if I heard correctly, is before serving with Kirk it is said by sarek that Spock had a way of showing us that logic wasn't the answer but the beginning of the answer. If this is nine years before TOS Prime, this simply isn't true. Certainly not in TOS. It isn't until the late date of the motion pictures when Spock becomes enlightened on this point. Yet in Discovery's timeline and universe, Spock has already inspiring this in his own father years before serving with Kirk!

As a filmmaker, if you're not going to seal the deal visually with it being TOS Prime, then you have to take script opportunities to show you are educated and understand important character development that came after your show in TOS Prime. If you don't do it visually, and you contradict it in the narrative, I have only the word of someone at CBS telling me this is TOS Prime. And that ain't enough for me in the face of the preponderance of screen evidence telling me it's not.


If we're to believe CBS, it's nine years BEFORE Charlie X, so the chess pieces wouldn't have melted yet. Same with the Vulcan Bells. Amok Time hasn't happened yet. But I can see why someone might not believe that just looking at the show. The visuals, narrative and dialogue say one thing. A claim by CBS says something else.

Edit: I watched the episode again. I like it even more. But you know what would help this show feel like Star Trek to me? The little things, like the writers understanding how major characters in this universe at this time really talk. When Burrnham asks Sarek how long it's been since he saw Spock, he replies, "Years." If this was really Prime-TOS Sarek, he would answer something like, "Seven point three-eight years." Or when he and Burnham said farewell at the end of the scene, he would give her the Vulcan salute. Sarek simply would. The writers want the gravity of playing in a very specific sandbox but they don't truly understand the depth of the sand they're playing with. And IMO it simply doesn't feel like the sand they claim it is, either visually, in narrative, or in how the characters talk.

The show got better, but the writers' lack of understanding of the time, place and characters they are writing about still persists.

I’m simply not seeing most of the same issues you’re seeing, here. Bottom line, the creators of DSC are making it with the assumption that it’s in the same reality as Prime TOS. So wondering whether the show’s events can possibly lead to the events of Prime TOS is an intellectual dead end, like wondering whether we landed on the Moon or whether Elvis is really dead. It’s designed to lead into the events of TOS.

It can perhaps be argued that it doesn’t do so very convincingly, that it takes things further than it should given that intention, but the creators’ intention is still a given nonetheless (to say nothing of all the massive timeline-incompatibilities now present between the two universes by the era of DSC). Ever since TMP, other than the Abramsverse films themselves (where it is explicitly stated onscreen), there have been fans determined to treat the newest Prime Universe incarnation as a separate, incompatible reality, and this never has actually been the case.

 

[Sam Favate]

I liked the premiere. It had good characterization, good action, a concentration on exploration and a very welcome addition of Capt. Pike. A couple of things I didn't like: the camera angles don't feel like Star Trek, they feel more like Ron Moore's Battlestar Galactica; the sound fluctuated a bit (as it did in season 1) to the point where in one scene where the camera zooms out, the sound drops even though two characters were having a conversation (maybe it's my set up, but this is why I prefer blu-rays); the spinny things they were flying in the asteroid field didn't feel like TOS-era Trek, and lastly, how did Burnham jump-start that downed starship in minutes when the chief engineer living on it for 10 months couldn't do it?

Still, an improvement over season 1 and a promising start to season 2.

 

[Josh Dial]

Or when he and Burnham said farewell at the end of the scene, he would give her the Vulcan salute. Sarek simply would.

I bumped up against that as well. Actually, I wonder if there is a deleted scene with Sarek's actual departure from the ship. The cut between Michael's quarters and her entering the bridge is slick (and has become sort of a signature for the show): the doors close on her quarters and open on the bridge. It moves us right from a scene of quiet discussion to action. However, Sarek said he was departing as soon as the Disco dropped out of warp. How? Shuttle? Rendezvous with another ship? Neither happen in the next scene. Perhaps there was a sequence at the transporter pad or shuttle bay that got cut, and the salute was a casualty.

Something I noticed on a re-watch: Stamets mentions he knows an ethno-botanist serving aboard the Enterprise. Sulu?

 

[Jason_V]

There was a lot for me to like in "Brother" and I was fairly pleasantly surprised. This felt like a soft reboot of the series from Season 1 to me with a lot of references to what happened and a basic reintroduction to all the main characters. The main relationships got at least a moment of screen time (Burnham and Saru, Tilly and Stamets, Sarek and Burnham) while the show felt "brighter and lighter" overall. And we're back to exploring new stuff instead of being in a war story week after week. I even chuckled once or twice.

There's still too much of the "whiz bang" for me, like the turbolift shaft or the journey to the asteroid, but I suspect that's a "me" problem and not a "show" problem.

I'm game for next week now. I likely need to rewatch "Brother" this weekend to really commit it to memory.

 

[Neil Middlemiss]

All this optimism and positivity, I had to double check I was actually on the internet today

 

[Jason_V]

All this optimism and positivity, I had to double check I was actually on the internet today

Lolz. I'm not sure if the positivity is praise for this season or a welcome breath from Season 1. I'll take the former. I'm pretty much over the countless articles and videos telling us how Discovery is an abomination and an attack on X, Y or Z thing.

 

[Bryan^H]

The first episode of season two "Brother" was pretty phenomenal, and I loved every second of it.
Captain Pike is quite the presence, and I'm so glad for that. A likable, no nonsense captain. Fair, and kind. The actor playing him nails it.
His interaction with Tilly made me laugh. I'm starting to warm up to Tilly a little.

Stilll the most beautiful show in existence. I feel like I should be watching every episode at my local theater with some popcorn. Such a cinematic series.

Spock has always been my favorite character, and Burnam being connected to him at first felt cheap to me, but now I am intrigued. I want to find out more about him (and Burnham) in this time frame. Very cool.

With the preview of the future episodes, I understand that this isn't going to be TOS, and never expected it to be. I just wanted it to resemble what I love about Star Trek. Well written episodes, with a good sense of wonderment about the universe. Through "Discovery" I think I will get that more through the characters than from "away missions". "Discovery" is different from the Trek shows that have come before it, but that difference is finally feeling justified to me. I'm ready to enjoy Star Trek Discovery.

 

[Nelson Au]

Hey guys, now that I’ve slept on it after viewing Brother last night, I am still very much liking the premiere.

Upon reading Alan’s comments to my comments, they brought me back to 1978-79. Specifically, is it Prime Universe or not and you know it when you see it. At that time, with only 10 years since TOS left NBC and was being syndicated, the new film was about to premiere.

We only had 9 years or so of syndication. Hard to believe it. I spent my youth hoping and writing for Star Trek to return and writing on the school chalk board, Star Trek Lives. Didn’t make me popular then.

So when Star Trek The Motion Picture is in Starlog magazine articles, we see photos of the cast in new costumes, the Enterprise is new and different. I remember seeing it at the time and feeling like it’s new it’s great, it’s coming back. All the while Gene Roddenberry is promoting that the film and its budget allows for better sets and effects and models and so on. So the Enterprise has to reflect modern technology and the improvements of modern effects. We didn’t question it because it’s a refit Enterprise.

But we now have 50 years of time and Star Trek TOS has become so sacrosanct that any deviation to the designs of the era Are uncomfortable to some in the audience. I keep thinking in my head of Gene Roddenberry saying in an interview that he hopes the future makers of Star Trek do it better then his era ever could. I’m paraphrasing a little. I think Discovery is doing that. It’s doing it in a new way and I totally get that it will cause some discomfort. The times change. ( don’t get me wrong, I really wished they could have had the Enterprise look the way it did in The Cage) The new cinematic way it’s filmed also made this new episode really feel bigger.

By the way, that science officer that Pike brings over from the Enterprise was so cocky I could see his comeuppance coming! His end did feel a little like the security guy who was killed in Star Trek 2009 during the drop sequence to Vulcan. And there was an S bomb from him and it didn’t seem that shocking to me. Not because we had Tilly last year using the F word, but it felt organic to the scene as they were dodging all the rocks floating around.

 

[Carabimero]

All this optimism and positivity, I had to double check I was actually on the internet today

That's because when it's actually good, we like it. Good writing trumps everything.

By the way, that science officer that Pike brings over from the Enterprise was so cocky I could see his comeuppance coming!

It occurred to me, as cocky as this guy is, as arrogant and quick to disobey orders, it's hard to believe he could have risen to the rank of science officer. But the show has turned over a new leaf, it's trying to be rational, so I am officially out of pile-on mode.