Sorry, but I'm getting fed up with the fanboy crap in here (1 Viewer)

[Morgan Jolley]

First of all, you assume too much.

The first thing I heard about Halo was about how great the graphics were, how tight the control was, and how fun the gameplay was. Probably the last people I talked to about the game were my friends who didn't like it. Also, the one reviewer who said they thought the game was repetitive, I read that on his site around a week after the X-Box launched.

So after hearing how great the game was, I heard how bad some people thought it was. The main reason I said anything negative about this game was to show that is was not perfect. I thought Metal Gear Solid 2 was the greatest game ever made, but looking back on it, I can say that it was the best PS2 game of the year, but not the best game ever made (I don't know what is, though). Given time, I know that people will say Halo was good, if not great, but probably a little overrated.

 

[Dave Falasco]

Okay, so you "know" that people are going to say Halo was overrated...presumably by asking your magic eight ball? I have never read one single negative review of the game, and as has been pointed out many times over, even steadfast anti-Xbox sites are reluctantly conceding that it's a great game (I'm looking your way, Gamespot...), but somehow you KNOW that after a while we will all come to our senses and realize that it wasn't that great after all. How wonderful to be so prescient! Even more miraculous considering you haven't logged a minute of playing time on it! Man, I wish everyone had your gifts. We'd all go out and get fitted for our plumber's hat and overalls right now and forget this disastrous Microsoft experiment.

Ah, forget it, sarcasm, like youth, is wasted on the young. Keep clinging to that one mythical review if it helps you sleep at night.

Anyone else...would unabashed fanboyist comments like that popping up in an anti-fanboy thread constitute irony?

Morgan, if nothing else let it not be said that you lacked the courage of your convictions, tiresome as they may be to the rest of us.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

First of all, websites that have Halo reviews are not run by Nintendo fanboys. The people who review the games are the ones who will probably enjoy them the most, so if every website gives a PaRappa game a 10 but everyone in the world hates it, it would make sense since the reviewers probably already liked PaRappa. Halo getting good scores is not a surprise to me.

If you dig enough, some people on GameSpot have said that while Halo is good, its not the best. One person even said Perfect Dark was better.

Ok, so maybe not everybody will say Halo was overrated, but after the new game feel wears off, many people, if not all, will say that it is. Overrated could mean the same as overhyped, so its not so much that people will say its a bad game, but not as good as they initially thought (it could go from a 10 to a 9.9, it would still apply to what I said).

GameSpot is not anti-X-Box. If thats what you were saying by "even steadfast anti-Xbox sites are reluctantly conceding that it's a great game (I'm looking your way, Gamespot...)" then you're dead wrong.

Look, I'm not saying Halo sucked, I'm not saying the X-Box sucked. If I was a fanboy, I would say "X-Box sucks, GameCube rocks" because thats a fanboy statement. Even if I just said "X-Box sucks" that wouldn't be a fanboy statement.

I haven't said much about GameCube games. While I'm at it, I think Rogue Leader was a little overrated. I love it, and still play it a lot, but its not as great as I thought it would be. It had some tough parts, but it was shorter than I thought and the secrets are too tough to get and offer little rewards.

As I said before, MGS2 wasn't 100% of what I thought it was, either.

 

[Dan B]

If you dig enough, some people on GameSpot have said that while Halo is good, its not the best. One person even said Perfect Dark was better.

Well, there you go. Return your Xbox! One person at Gamespot likes Perfect Dark better than Halo & some people don't think it's the greatest game ever made! :rolleyes
-Dan B.
likes forcing the Warthog into unusual places & melee attacking Hunters

 

[JoelH]

Morgan,

If you are basing your opinion of Halo on people's reviews or impressions from other websites, when do you take into account those of the people on this board? If I saw a review of Starfighter:SE (I am purposely avoiding the Halo reviews) on another board that indicated it was sub-par, and then saw on this board that most people liked it, I wouldn't go around saying that it was boring. And I wouldn't defend that by saying I heard elsewhere (without naming the board, or the poster, etc.) that it was bad. Additionally, if most people are sharing positive responses regarding a game, or a system, and then you pop in and say that the game, or system, was bad according to your other sources, you are just asking for trouble.

This in no way is intended to dissuade constructive dialog, I just think that you can't pop into every thread with potentially inflammatory messages and expect people to respond well. As has been said before, you may not expect them to be inflammatory, but the way they are written (and I have seen many of them) are such.

By the way, in how many other places have you dropped a message saying that Rogue Leader is a little overrated, and not as great as you thought? I checked the official Rogue Leader thread and I don't see any of that there. I am sure that if you heard something additional about Halo that indicated a problem, you would point it out very quickly.

I want you to post, Morgan, because I think you can have constructive things to say. You just have to step back at some point and realize that the people here may have a few valid points about the messages you are posting.

----

Joel

 

[Morgan Jolley]

Dan-

I never said Halo sucked. I just said that some people I have talked to said it wasn't as good as people said and someone at GameSpot said Perfect Dark was better. I never said you should return your X-Box and game. Its comments like yours that ruin threads and drag them on longer than they should be.

Joel-

Thank you for being polite.

I take into account people's opinions on this forum more than other peoples, which is why I present other peoples opinions to the people on this board and ask them to verify things. I asked if Halo really was repetitive (like someone told me) to see if it was true. I didn't run around saying "Halo sucks" but rather asked about things I heard were bad about it. There is a difference, but people can't seem to see it.

When people are sharing positive things about games, I either will ask about the game (either how it is or if rumors about it are true) or I will ignore the thread altogether. I don't go into threads about sports games because I don't like sports games. I stay out of many threads because I don't have any interest in the subject. If you look around, most of the threads I go into are about things I own, am interested in, or have no direct "audience."

I haven't dropped messages about Rogue Leader being lacking for several reasons. First, I don't write reviews of games. I give first impressions and then maybe ask for help or share my progress. Sometimes I will ask about a game I have interest in (believe it or not, I share interest in Halo) or will ask for confirmation of rumors, such as bad points of the games or secrets or whatever. Second, I haven't really posted much in the Rogue Leader thread about the game other than asking a question or participating in the conversation as it is going. And third, I never saw a reason to. Maybe I should start a list of games I liked and disliked so people can understand me...

What I think it comes down to is people just calming down. I might seem like I'm getting frustrated, but I understand that this is just an internet forum where we converse and share opinions, thoughts, ideas, etc. We aren't here to fight and we aren't here to hurt others. Which is why I'm confused by people getting pissed off by my opinions. If anything, I'm much more less of a fanboy than anyone who hates me for not liking the DC library and say I think it sucked for me or for saying that I don't want an X-Box because I don't have an over $300 interest in it and its games. If I say one negative thing about something, even something I like, then I get flamed.

I say we just end this thread. Nothing positive has come of it and up until this was started, less flaming had been going on in the forum. Why don't we stop complaining and just get on with our chatting?

 

[Ryan Peter]

If anything, I'm much more less of a fanboy than anyone who hates me for not liking the DC library and say I think it sucked for me or for saying that I don't want an X-Box because I don't have an over $300 interest in it and its games. If I say one negative thing about something, even something I like, then I get flamed.

Here's the problem. Lots of people do have XBoxes and you don't. Lots of people love Halo, and you've never played it. So you go around crapping all over the XBox and Halo to make yourself feel better for not being able to own or play either. That's too bad, and pretty sad actually. I wish you could play Halo, because it's the best game I've ever played. But you can't, so get over it and quite trashing the XBox and Halo! You troll this forum and then you are flamed. You came up with this lame excuse for trashing Halo, by saying you were soliciting advise. Yah right! So everyone here says it's great, do you believe that now? People will be a lot calmer when you quit pissing them off. Stop pissing people off. Talk about games you only have played and people will like you a lot more and be more considerate of your thoughts and opinions. Seriously.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

I don't think the X-Box sucks and I don't think Halo sucks. I don't have an X-Box and I don't have Halo. How could I have a definitive opinion about either?

I have not heard all positive things about either, and as of right now, the only game for X-Box that would interest me is actually Halo, but I seriously doubt that Halo is worth $350. If I was offerred an X-Box for free, I would gladly accept, and the first game I would get is Halo. I actually want the game.

That said, I'm not crapping on the X-Box or Halo. I am saying that I have heard things other than "Halo is perfect" and should take those opinions into consideration, some more than others since I heard that from some friends of mine who agree with me on 99% of the games we play and like.

So it all goes back to me wondering why people are yelling at me so much for expressing my opinion or asking questions about others'.

 

[Romier S]

Ok, Lets try this one more time.

Morgan. Let me give an example. I personally do not like the game Super Smash Bros Melee. I just couldn't get into it at all.

Lets say hypothetically I have never played the game. Now lets say someone starts a review thread for Super Smash Bros Melee and discusses how they like the game and find it to be wonderful. Now some other people join in the discussion and say "Hey, The game wasn't for me. I didn't find it to be very fun. It wasn't my stle of game." They go on to give specific examples of why they did not like the game. Those that like the game chime in and give further thoughts about what they thought was good and respect each others opinions on the matter. Mind you at this time I still have yet to even play the game. Now this is my hypothetical post in the SSBM review thread:

"I heard from my friend Ricky that the graphics werent really all that great in the game. I was also over at the letters page on IGN and one of the editors said that the game was extremely repetitive. I dont see why everyone is making such a big deal about it. Most of the people I talked too said it sucked.

I also heard that the sales of the Gamecube werent announced so that probably means the launch went lackluster.

In the end I just dont see the Gamecube being worth it. I honestly just dont think that this game and Rogue Leader is worth the 250 to buy a Gamecube for."

Look Familiar? It should cause its you. Your stance here is that you are just asking questions. I'm sorry but I just dont see a question being asked above. What I see are inflammatory comments that have no basis in fact and dont even comprise an opinion cause I if I were you in that post I wouldn't have even played the game yet! (as noted above)

Just because you throw "Is that true?" in one post out of 500 doesn't make a hell of a difference to any one here. You can also refute and say "Thats not me!". I can guarentee after reading my examples allot fo the members on this forum will get a very strange sense of deja vu.

Here are some other examples of your wonderful posting:

The DC isn't my favorite console, but if I liked sports and racing games at all, it probably would be.

If you look at it based on its variety of games, then its good. But if you look at their caliber, not so much. The Nintendo 64 had games that were genre defining, revolutionary, or just plain perfect, but it gets less recognition than the DC. While it had a great library of games (not including ports, spinoffs, or sequels) it still lacked something. The PlayStation had Final Fantasy, the Nintendo 64 had Mario/Zelda, but what did the Dreamcast have at its launch? It had Sonic, but it wasn't exactly a groundbreaking title like everyone hoped it to be and the sequel didn't fix it much, either.

My point is that the DC was a great console, but not the best. It had many flaws (as did other consoles).

This is from the "Still the Best" thread where you were taken to task rather harshly for this statement. More blanket generalized comments that have no semblance of you stating your opinion in the post. You make these bold comments as if they were fact. That is what sets people off. You dont ask questions or state your opinion you just throw comments out without thought.

If you would have simply worded that post for example like this:

"The Dreamcast is not my favorite console and to be honest I just couldn't like the system that much. It had several good games but all in all I feel that the selection of titles just didn't appeal to me.

Not to throw this off-topic but the Nintendo 64 I think is in the same boat the Dreamcast is. Although I didn't like the Dreamcast personally I know there are countless other who do feel it is under appreciated. That is exactly how I feel about the N64. Revolutionary games like Mario and Zelda kept me busy for hours and I think the system should have gotten more notoriety along with the Sega's offering. For my personal taste I enjoyed the N64 more so I cant quite consider Sega the best.

Just wanted to offer a different opinion on the subject."

The post above would have garnered questions as to why you felt the Dreamcast games did not appeal to you and would have also started a discussion on the N64 without ruffling anyones feathers. AND OH MY!! Will you look at that, I stated the exact same thing you did.

Morgan, you are also at this point suffering from what I like to call the "Boy who cried wolf" syndrome. You have crapped on so many threads and derailed so many discussions anymore that people honestly just dont care about your opinions anymore. They dont care about what you have to say. Given the things you have posted if you state something good about Sega or Microsoft you just come off looking like a hypocrite. Your in a lose, lose situation my friend and you got yourself there. If this isn't enough to help you understand I just have to give up because I nor anyone else on this forum can state it anymore clearly. THINK BEFORE YOU POST!

 

[Joseph S]

Ok, Lets try this one more time.

No, let's not.

This is sickening. Do you guys get some sort of pleasure in this??? Almost every thread here degenerates into a bunch of folks doing nothing but picking on Morgan. Give it a rest.

 

[Steve Clark]

No, let's not. This is sickening. Do you guys get some sort of pleasure in this???

Huh? You have several members pounding their head against the wall over one person and they are all the problem? I think an incredible amount of patience has been shown to this one person as many inconsistencies have now been exposed in this one person's current and prior posts.

This one person, who seems to be starved for attention, is basically throwing a bunch of stuff against the wall and seeing what sticks. This one person has been WARNED by the administration of this forum to modify their posting style as it comes across at times as flaming and/or trolling (I have seen little improvement). I do agree this one person knows alot about gaming, the problem is that for every two good posts there is one very bad post (in terms of accuracy, use of "heresay", unsubstantiated claims, inconsistency, inflammatory/trolling attitude, etc.), which is simply not acceptable at this excellent forum. I am trying my best to simply ignore and not engage this one person, but at some point it becomes irresistible.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

The analogy given about Sony buying Psygnosis was very relevant but no no. The big evil Microsoft cant do the same. And I still cant recall anyone in the thread saying Microsoft was going to have ALL the exclusive titles?

It was wrong for Sony to buy out a third party developer, but it was not as big of a deal as MS buying out Take-Two and Bungie. That would be like Nintendo buying Sega.

And for the record, I was against Sony buying stock in Square, but if it keeps them alive, then I guess its a good thing for now. I hope to god that it doesn't keep them developing just for the PS2, though. I would like to see Square stretch out to other consoles for games other than just FFXI.

In the "Still the Best" thread, I went on to explain myself and my post. You might not like my explanation, but it is there.

Everyone is annoyed with me, I know. I make statements that sound fanboyish because they aren't. Saying "the DC was the best console ever" is more of a fanboy statement than "I heard Halo sucked." I don't see why people don't like my opinions, no matter how they are stated. If I say "the DC had games that didn't appeal to me, and thus, is my least favorite console" people will still yell at me for being a Nintendo fanboy, which I'm not.

People also miss out on a lot of things I say. For instance, I have expressed that I want an X-Box and Halo because they both impress me, but if it weren't for the fact that I'm not going to spend $350 for just one game, I would have one by now. I've said before that Sega makes great games. I've said before about the faults of Sony and Nintendo and how MS has created the most powerful console, hands down, and how the DC had the library of games that appealed to everyone the most.

If anything, I think the way we can settle this is for me to take into consideration everything I have read so far in this thread and others, and from now on we set a rule where we ban threads complaining about anything other than games, aka, no "fanboys are annoying" threads. Without threads like these, things will only get better since there will be less bickering.

 

[Romier S]

No, let's not.

This is sickening. Do you guys get some sort of pleasure in this??? Almost every thread here degenerates into a bunch of folks doing nothing but picking on Morgan. Give it a rest.

Excuse me? I dont believe I have picked on Morgan at all. I have said in my previous threads that I respect his opinions and I feel that he has a passion for gaming. I also said none of this is meant as a personal attack. In the end all we are trying to do is demonstrate why people get offended by some of the things he posts and why he gets "yelled" at. A few posts bak we wanted to people to give specific reasons why some posts "bug" them. That is what we have done.

So if you feel that is sickening that is too bad. I think the this thread has been very civil so far and I think Morgan has taken our criticisms like a champ.

Morgan:

I agree like I called for in my earlier thread...Lets call it a truce and please try to take into consideration what we have said. I very much respect that you said that you would do that.

 

[Dan Brecher]

Do Mike and I really have to go through all this again? Everyone, COOL OFF. I seriously do not want a repeat of a few months ago where everyone got bogged down fighting over differences of opinion.
What is it about videogames that makes so many people argue like this? Honestly folks, c'mon, I don't want to start closing threads and I most certainly do not want to start suspending members!
Dan (UK)

 

[Morgan Jolley]

What is it about videogames that makes so many people argue like this?

Thats the thing, this thread isn't about videogames, and never was.

 

[Ryan Peter]

I have no problem calling a truce, but I'd like to see Morgan change his posting patterns at least somewhat. This is a great forum, and what's going on is a cancer that's eating this place alive. Dan, I'd love it if you scrutinized posts here for a while, kinda like put this place on probation.

 

[Dan Brecher]

Dan, I'd love it if you scrutinized posts here for a while, kinda like put this place on probation.

I am happy to say I have enough respect and trust for those who post here so as that I should never have to do such a thing, Ryan. As said earlier in this thread, such "fanboy crap" doesn't circulate here much at all and I'd hope Mike or myself never have to be in the position where we have to scrutinize every post.

Dan (UK)

 

[Steve Clark]

I absolutely applaud the administrators for keeping this thread open. It is a good holding area to contain most of the rants and is a good place to let off some steam. Now if we could just figure out the underlying cause of all this passion and emotion that is called fanboyism in the video game industry. I think part of it is the following:

1) addictive and escapism nature of video games

2) the nostalgia of game playing (return to youth) as many of us older members grew up playing video games

3) the huge investment in hardware, software and accessories now required

4) the existence of only a few companies (similar to when the auto industry was dominated by the "Big 3") leading to brand loyalty

5) and of course with the addition of Microsoft, an anti-Microsoft position that is prevalent among many

 

[Romier S]

Dan,

As stated earlier I think this thread has been very civil so far and I do also applaud the you and the other moderators for keeping it open.

It allows us all to address some of these issues in a contained thread. I will admit to at times becoming a bit angered and it may have come out like that in my posts and for that I do apologize to Morgan and to the other members who have posted in this thread as it was not meant to be so, but as you said there are problems that need to be addressed.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

Other than this thread and another thread or two, I have tried to keep my comments that would be interpreted wrongly or would start a flame war to a minimum. I will try to do so more in the future and will take what people have said into consideration, but I really don't think that we need a thread devoted to fanboyism. If its a problem, it really shouldn't be expressed in an entire thread, especially when it could easily turn into what it has become. I say we just close this thread, think about what happened inside of it, and proceed like normal.