Sony AVD-C70ES integrated A/V receiver-DVD/SACD changer on Crutchfield's web site.

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by KeithH, Sep 18, 2002.

  1. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Crutchfield has added the Sony AVD-C70ES integrated A/V receiver-DVD/SACD changer to its web site. The price is $1000, and the web site says the unit will be in stock on Friday (9/20). Here are pros and cons of the unit, in my opinion, after looking at it on Crutchfield's web site:
    Pros
    * Chassis is silver instead of the common black
    * Five-disc progressive-scan DVD/SACD changer
    * Plays stereo and multi-channel SACDs, plus CD-Rs, CD-RWs, and MP3-encoded CDs
    * Five-year ES warranty (US only)
    * Nice LCD remote
    * Binding posts for all speaker terminals
    Cons
    * Just 3 A/V inputs
    * No 5.1-channel input
    * Fixed power cord
    * Receiver section rated at 120W x 5 into 6 ohms at 0.7% THD
    * Remote is 1-way, not 2-way
    * No A and B speaker inputs for front channels
    * No phono input
    I am not surprised that the 'C70ES has no 5.1-channel inputs. As far as Sony is concerned, DVD-Audio doesn't exist, so with an SACD player built-in, Sony probably figured there is no need for 5.1-channel inputs. Plus, in an integrated unit like this one, the inside of the box is probably pretty well crammed, so Sony probably decided to cut out a lot of extras. The unit is pretty well streamlined. Still, 5.1-channel inputs would have been very nice on this unit, as switching between SACD and an outboard DVD-Audio player would have been very facile.
    Aside from the lack of 5.1-channel inputs, the other issue that really chaps my behind with this unit is the specs. for the amp section. First of all, there are only five channels, not six or seven. Again, the 'C70ES is streamlined. Furthermore, note that the power specs. are rated into 6 ohms, not the standard 8 ohms. Also, the THD spec. is very high for an ES product at 0.7%.
    I tend to expect compromises in an integrated component. On paper, or at least, on my computer screen ([​IMG]), the 'C70ES looks like a compromised product. In that vein, it does not appear to be a true ES product. Perhaps Sony only threw the ES badge on it since it is the first integrated A/V receiver-SACD player.
    Here is the link to the 'C70ES on Crutchfield's web site:
    http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/S...VC70ES&o=m&a=0
     
  2. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    I also noticed that the 'C70ES has no 5.1-channel outputs for use with an external surround-sound processor. It does have a pair of stereo analog outputs, so I suppose you could use the 'C70ES with an external component for playback of CDs and/or stereo SACDs. The unit also has an optical digital output (no coaxial) for playback of CDs via an external processor.
     
  3. Justin Lane

    Justin Lane Cinematographer

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    The receiver looks like a nice choice for those looking to add DVD, SACD and a 5.1 in one package to a second room, but other then that I would pass. The specs make this receiver look very un-ES like. Of course since doing away with the DB line, the lower models in the ES line look very un ES like now. A better component in my mind would have been a 5 disc progressive DVD/SACD ES player only.

    J
     
  4. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Justin said:

     
  5. AustinKW

    AustinKW Stunt Coordinator

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    Let's hope this monstrosity dies quickly and quietly. It's way past time the manufacturers got off their asses and implemented a universal 1394 digital link on all players and receivers (and high-end pre/pros). This nonsense of players with crippled BM requiring outboard ICBM and 20 interconnects has simply got to stop! The whole hirez deal should be plug and play without compromising HT and music quality.

    And cramming video in with the hirez music isn't helping IMO. I expect we're going to end up with universal hirez players in a multi- (even mega-) changer configuration connected via iLink. For DVD-Video, simple single-disk bug-free players with both component and DVI video connections along with optical and digital coax audio connections would be the berries. Come on, guys - let's get these boxes in the stores!

    Austin
     
  6. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Austin, I don't like what Sony is doing with SACD hardware these days. The 'C70ES integrated component does not impress me in any way whatsoever. Although it is too early to tell for sure, the forthcoming DVP-NS999ES, which will replace the 'S9000ES, looks disappointing as well. The build quality of the 'NS999ES is not in the same league as the 'S9000ES. Sony seems hard-pressed to dumb down its SACD hardware. I am just waiting for a PlayStation 3 that will play SACDs. Maybe they can incorporate a receiver into the box as well. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  7. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    For those interested, Crutchfield now has the Sony AVD-S50ES integrated A/V receiver*single-disc DVD/SACD player on its web site. It is $800, and Crutchfield's web site states it will be available on October 5th. When compared to the 'C70ES, the 'S50ES looks to be similarly compromised. The power rating of the 'S50ES is a bit lower at 100W x 5 into 6 ohms at 0.7% THD. Basically, the 'S50ES looks like a single-disc version of the 'C70ES, possibly with a less powerful amp section. Here is the link for the 'S50ES:
    http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/S...VS50ES&o=m&a=0
    Oh, one other difference between the two units is that the remote supplied with the 'S50ES does not have an LCD display.
     
  8. JackS

    JackS Supporting Actor

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    Do you guys suppose that this may be an effort by Sony to cash in on some of the marketing efforts by Bose? These types of products do appeal to many who do not wish to own or even know the difference in this and a true home a/v setup. Success in this niche will only affect simular, upscale mini systems . The only advantage that Sony may have here is the 5 rear warranty which may be enough to push this product to the head of the line.
     
  9. Greg Schwabacher

    Greg Schwabacher Stunt Coordinator

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    How those two abominations got the ES designation is beyond me. I can almost understand why the former DB-level receivers got ES designations, but these receiver/DVD/SACD combo units appear to be bargain-basement, mass market crap.
    I'm waiting for a replacement for the 'C555ES before I jump into the multichannel SACD fray, but I'm not sure it's going to happen. I'm just not interested in another combo SACD/DVD unit (I already have the '9000ES) -- ideally I'd like to see an audio-only SACD megachanger...a "real" ES megachanger. I'll have to see what comes out at CEDIA; if there's no audio-only units announced there, I'll have to find a 'C555ES while they're still available.
    Sony's going a long way toward alienating their core mid- to hi-fi market when they water down their "ES" badge. The only reason I can see for this is that Sony is trying to make Joe Six Pack think he's getting more for his money by selling these el-cheapo ES components. Maybe "ES" should stand for "Elevated Sales," not "Elevated Standard." [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  10. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Jack, I'm not sure if Sony has been influenced by Bose specifically, but integrated components are nothing new. Integrated A/V receiver-DVD players have been around for awhile. Many consumers love convenience, of course. Home-theaters-in-a box are very popular since you get everything in one box, usually, at a low price. However, I question the appeal that the new Sony ES integrated components will have. It seems paradoxical to slap an ES badge and ES-level price on what clearly appears to be a highly compromised product. Of course, some home-theaters-in-a-box are pricey too, but at least you get speakers and a subwoofer.
    I question the level of consumer appeal that the new Sony ES integrated components will meet. To my mind, $300-400 home-theaters-in-a-box have an obvious appeal. Again, you get everything in one box. However, when you are talking about Sony ES and $800 and $1000 components, you are often dealing with the consumer who understands the concept of a separate amp, a separate player, and speakers from a specialized speaker manufacturer. The new Sony ES components do not fall into the home-theater-in-a-box category, of course, since speakers and a subwoofer are not included. So, I don't see them appealing to the consumer with a little extra cash who wants convenience. These ES integrated components look like 'tweeners. They don't fall in the budget home-theater-in-a-box category, and they obviously don't fall in the higher-end separates category either. I don't see the appeal or the "marketing hook". Just my $0.37. [​IMG]
     
  11. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    Greg, excellent post. I definitely share your concerns. From what I have read, the forthcoming 'NS999ES weighs around 14 lbs., or half the weight of the 'S9000ES. Also, the 'NS999ES supposedly does not have a copper chassis. [​IMG]
    For what it's worth, Pioneer has done the same thing to an extent with its Elite line over the years. Most Elite components are outstanding, but a few here and there basically resemble a mass-market Pioneer counterpart with rosewood sidepanels and the black Urushi front panel installed. The Elite '47A universal player doesn't have the look and feel of an Elite component in my opinion. It's certainly nothing like my PD-65 CD player. I am afraid that the '45A is lacking as well in terms of build quality. It's a shame.
     

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