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gadgtfreek

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He is a little late on that one...

This was posted at AVS and makes the most sense:

"Dynamic metadata streams independently along with the data stream from internal apps. Sony then maps this metadata to the display. But, HDMI < 2.1 cannot pass dynamic metadata. Dolby has gotten around that limitation by embedding the dynamic metadata into the video signal when passed via HDMI. In this case, the display must extract the metadata from the video signal before it can process it. Either Sony TVs cannot perform this process or Dolby has introduced a new method for Sony to be the first to use."

I could go with Sony tv's cannot perform the process currently, because MediaTek just launched their DV Android TV chips, and Sony uses off the shelf solutions AFAIK. LG has been using a custom SoC designed with Dolby since 2016.

My guess is, when DV and Sony decided at CES 2017 they would install DV on the 2017 sets, Dolby, Sony and MT had to get together and figure it out, which is where the UBP-X700 comes in. Now, companies being companies, none of them shared this little tidbit with Oppo, and the other MediaTek customers until the bomb was dropped, now Oppo has to go out and figure it out, and then get recertified.

Makes me wonder if the UBP-X700 won't be the first DV player to work with Sony tv's, and that was by design...
 
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Mark Booth

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What a freakin circle jerk.

I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER SONY PRODUCT! It is now my mission in life to convince friends and family to avoid Sony products at all costs.

Mark
 

Sam Posten

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Gadgt blames Dolby in the new consolidated thread at AVS. I don't and I will tell you why:

gadgtfreek;55546802 said:
The biggest joke to me, after watching that, is Dolby. Idiots.

OK but let's look at it from Dolby's PoV. There are two ticks against DV when compared to HDR or HDR10:
- Licensing Fees
- Requiring dedicated hardware.

So let's assume Dolby WANTS to keep the license fees moving. They have to fix #2 to remain competitive in the face of HDR10+. How do you do that? Either on the device or on the panel. Assume Dolby isn't just interested in Oppon and Apple. With this change they have short term pain but long term they can add:

Every cheap UHD deck
Playstation 4
Xbox
Kindles
Rokus

Hell anything that connects to HDMI with a half decent processor can do DV as long as that sweet sweet licensing lucre keeps rolling in.

And right now? It looks like Sony are the dopes.

And partly, Sony is. Not because they made a bad technical decision, BUT BECAUSE THEY FAILED TO SET CONSUMER EXPECTATIONS ACCORDINGLY.

I don't blame Dolby in this situation. They have the potential to rapidly expand their user base.

I TOTALLY BLAME SONY. Sony advertised a set in January and Delivered it to me in March with a CORE FEATURE I counted on being there. By the time I can actually use that feaure the same panel will have a street cost of HALF of what I paid for it. To the tune of THOUSANDS of dollars.

That's my PoV as a pioneer who has arrows in his back.
 

gadgtfreek

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LOL, you have hated Sony most of 2017 all year, it ain't gonna change now...

I just don't see how anyone can't blame Dolby, unless their judgment is skewed


  1. It is Dolby's format
  2. It took them 6 months to admit to the raised black level issue that has been there from the start, and the fix still is not implemented AFAIK
  3. Sony agreed to go ahead with 2017 models and in the process, Sony knew the tv's couldn't process internally. DV knew this too, and allowed it to continue with a new version.
  4. Sony, Dolby and MediaTek find a way to get it to work internally on the Sony displays and with the MediaTek chip in the X700, yet Dolby couldn't bother to share this with Oppo, another MediaTek user and DV partner?
  5. Sony just flat out said publicly they were under the impression source devices already had the update. I don't see how they do that if Dolby didn't drop the ball, and then Oppo comes out and was never told until now the Sony FW released and didn't work.

That's on Dolby. They should never have certified and allowed the release of the TV FW until there were source devices updated. Hell, why did it take them SIX MONTHS to own up and fix the black level issue? Why? Because their head is up their ass.

Dolby is the fool.
 

gadgtfreek

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BTW, my current stance is I did not care about DV in the past nor base my purchasing on it because I love HDR10 on a calibrated display. Therefore I really don't care about it now...

Hardly anyone I know is using HDR10 now, no one even knows what DV is outside of forum people and folks in the industry.
 

Todd Erwin

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Gadgt blames Dolby in the new consolidated thread at AVS. I don't and I will tell you why:



OK but let's look at it from Dolby's PoV. There are two ticks against DV when compared to HDR or HDR10:
- Licensing Fees
- Requiring dedicated hardware.

So let's assume Dolby WANTS to keep the license fees moving. They have to fix #2 to remain competitive in the face of HDR10+. How do you do that? Either on the device or on the panel. Assume Dolby isn't just interested in Oppon and Apple. With this change they have short term pain but long term they can add:

Every cheap UHD deck
Playstation 4
Xbox
Kindles
Rokus

Hell anything that connects to HDMI with a half decent processor can do DV as long as that sweet sweet licensing lucre keeps rolling in.

And right now? It looks like Sony are the dopes.

And partly, Sony is. Not because they made a bad technical decision, BUT BECAUSE THEY FAILED TO SET CONSUMER EXPECTATIONS ACCORDINGLY.

I don't blame Dolby in this situation. They have the potential to rapidly expand their user base.

I TOTALLY BLAME SONY. Sony advertised a set in January and Delivered it to me in March with a CORE FEATURE I counted on being there. By the time I can actually use that feaure the same panel will have a street cost of HALF of what I paid for it. To the tune of THOUSANDS of dollars.

That's my PoV as a pioneer who has arrows in his back.
Totally agree with you, Sam. More broken promises from Sony.
 

gadgtfreek

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So, about a week after the fiasco, ATV4K just got a developer beta 11.3 and DV is now active between the ATV4K and Sony displays. Sure, Sony hid it from everyone and Apple added it in a week. Keep thinking Dolby didn't screw this up...

Apple had time to prepare, why not Oppo?
 

Sam Posten

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If you are Sony why do you take anyone's word for it and ship your firmware without testing your panel with external devices? YOU DON'T. That would be colossally stupid and against every software engineering principle.

Sony knew from the beginning that they were shipping an update that no external devices on the market could communicate DV to.
 

gadgtfreek

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LOL, Sony said "second half of January", and now you have DV internal apps and Apple just proved the info was out there for HDMI DV support with the new beta. What are you still bitching about, because Dolby didn't tell Oppo or Oppo is dragging its feet? You are full of manure if you think Sony released that and within 8 days of being taken by surprise Apple released an update.

This has been known by Dolby and Co for awhile obviously, but hey, you keep making up things to be mad about.
 

Mark Booth

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Apple released the beta tvOS 11.3 to developers today. A developer posted this to Blu-ray.com:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?p=14634727#post14634727

HIs included message is pretty cryptic, but later in the thread he posts this:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?p=14634822#post14634822

and this:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?p=14635083#post14635083

So, amazingly, Apple has ALREADY issued the beta software that fixes Dolby Vision compatibility between Apple TV 4K and Sony's Dolby Vision firmware update.

I agree with his assessment, Apple *had* to be working on this Dolby Vision profile implementation BEFORE Sony released its firmware update last week. Which means Dolby Labs had communicated the need for support of the new profile to its partners. Which means...

Hey, Dolby Labs, how about getting off your lazy ass and communicate with consumers?! When the Sony TV broohaha popped up last week, Dolby Labs should have issued a statement immediately to alleviate consumer heartache and confusion.

Mark
 

Mark Booth

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People are reporting that the tvOS 11.3 public beta is now available. If your Apple TV 4K is enrolled in Apple's public beta program, you should be able to upgrade your device now.

I haven't tried it yet and won't until sometime next week (out of town).

Mark
 

Robert_Zohn

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Don't believe everything you read on the Internet, unless you read it on Hometheaterforum.com.

Sony's XBR-75X940E is alive and well and will carry over into the 2018 model year. The fix has to come from OPPO who needs to add Dolby Vision's standard "Low Latency" protocol. Apple Ultra TV did it in one week.
 

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