Song of the South (1 Viewer)

[Ruz-El]

Disney is run by a bunch of shitheads. To hell with them.

Any Disney Blu-Ray I ever buy again will be used so that they don't get one red penny out of me.

Agreed and I'll be doing the same. While I enjoy the Blurays of the classic animation for what they are (modern remasters) the fact that they fiddle with them so much and don't offer the originals was enough of a bad taste. To have someone in charge be so completely ignorant of Disneys history as a studio and to piss so hard on Walts legacy? Screw 'em.

Depicting blacks as slaves in a period piece is not racist. To not depict slaves as horribly abused victims isn't racist either. The use of blacks and slaves in SOTS is a device to tell folktales, and it does so brilliantly, and also boldly shows how positive life lessons can be learned by what is considered a minority group. I could see the problem with SOTS if the mandate of the film was to say "Slavery isn't bad, we should be able to own slaves". It's not. Only an idiot looking for a problem would see that in the picture.

 

[MatthewA]

Not to mention that Iger is denying millions a chance to enjoy the work of several black actors, including one who one a special Oscar.

Disney owns a lot of Selznick films through ABC. Thank God they don't own Gone With The Wind.

 

[ahollis]

Originally Posted by Russell G
Depicting blacks as slaves in a period piece is not racist. To not depict slaves as horribly abused victims isn't racist either. The use of blacks and slaves in SOTS is a device to tell folktales, and it does so brilliantly, and also boldly shows how positive life lessons can be learned by what is considered a minority group. I could see the problem with SOTS if the mandate of the film was to say "Slavery isn't bad, we should be able to own slaves". It's not. Only an idiot looking for a problem would see that in the picture.

See that is one of the myths of SONG OF THE SOUTH. The picture takes place after the Civil War during Reconstruction. All of the blacks depicted in the film were free at that time. While some have debated that fact, just the part where Uncle Remus ties up his belongings and tells everyone he is leaving gives pretty good credence to the fact that they were free. If not I'm not so sure he would tell everyone he was leaving and walk so slowly down the road.

 

[Matt Lucas]

Hello all---

Jim Hill has posted an article of his own regarding SONG OF THE SOUTH:

http://jimhillmedia.com/editor_in_chief1/b/jim_hill/archive/2011/03/29/is-disney-being-a-dumbo-when-it-comes-to-quot-song-of-the-south-quot.aspx

He makes good points about DUMBO, which have already been made here.

Regards,
matt

 

[Matt Hough]

Originally Posted by Matt Lucas
Hello all---

Jim Hill has posted an article of his own regarding SONG OF THE SOUTH:

http://jimhillmedia.com/editor_in_chief1/b/jim_hill/archive/2011/03/29/is-disney-being-a-dumbo-when-it-comes-to-quot-song-of-the-south-quot.aspx

He makes good points about DUMBO, which have already been made here.

Regards,
matt

Thanks for posting that link, Matt. I enjoyed the article.

 

[Mike Frezon]

Originally Posted by MattH.
Thanks for posting that link, Matt. I enjoyed the article.

+1. That was well-done.

I'm sure it represents the feelings of most here on this forum.

 

[DeWilson]

Originally Posted by ahollis
See that is one of the myths of SONG OF THE SOUTH. The picture takes place after the Civil War during Reconstruction. All of the blacks depicted in the film were free at that time. While some have debated that fact, just the part where Uncle Remus ties up his belongings and tells everyone he is leaving gives pretty good credence to the fact that they were free. If not I'm not so sure he would tell everyone he was leaving and walk so slowly down the road.

WHY do people still have Myths about this film? Is it because Uncle Remus would have been a FORMER Slave?

 

[Eric Peterson]

Great article. MY only fear is that somebody at Disney will read it and use the information to make further edits.

As disgusting as this policy is to me, I'll take Dumbo over Song of the South any day. Dumbo always has been and likely always will be my favorite Disney cartoon and hopefully this latest restoration will finally get it right.

 

[Matt Lucas]

Originally Posted by Eric Peterson
Great article. MY only fear is that somebody at Disney will read it and use the information to make further edits.

As disgusting as this policy is to me, I'll take Dumbo over Song of the South any day. Dumbo always has been and likely always will be my favorite Disney cartoon and hopefully this latest restoration will finally get it right.

You know, at first, when I read your comment about the article inspiring more Disney edits, I thought, "Ironic and funny, but a little paranoid." But then I thought, "Man, he is right on the money." I hope you're wrong.

I agree about DUMBO being better than SONG OF THE SOUTH. DUMBO is the first movie I remember seeing as a child. My parents took me to see a re-release of it at the old Parkview Theater in Pasadena, TX [yes, home of the late Gilleys night club as featured in URBAN COWBOY!]. It must have been around 1974 or so. DUMBO has never been among my favorite of Walt's films, but it'll always hold a special place for me.

But I don't think SOTS is bad, by any means. It's an "old movie," in that the performances are a little over-earnest and the plot devices are predictable. But the animation and songs are great, and I think any movie produced by Walt should be preserved and shared with future generations. I find it very ironic that Iger seems to think the world can't handle SOTS now, when we've obviously moved to a place where we should be better equipped to view the movie with a little bit of perspective. I'm certainly not saying that racism is dead, but the fact that an African-American sits at the most powerful desk in the world has to count for something.

I think releasing some sort of DVD/Blu-Ray special edition would honor the memory of James Baskett and the others who contributed to the film. From a marketing and PR point of view, I think Disney could release this movie on home video and, by involving some historians and minority leaders in some sort of roundtable or documentary, they could focus on the film's merits. As we've already discussed, Baskett is the first African-American man to receive an Oscar, and he was also the first actor in a Disney film to receive an Oscar for live action work. If I'm not mistaken, wasn't Baskett also the first live action actor to be contracted by Disney? That only adds to the irony---the film can't be released on home video because its content might offend groups who could consider it racist, yet the man who played the film's main character was an African-American who happened to be the first actor hired by what is now one of the biggest movie studios around. Oh, and the guy also happened to be the first black man to receive an Oscar. It just doesn't make sense.

Uncle Remus is such an endearing character, not because of his situation as a sharecropper in the post-Civil War South, living on a wealthy old woman's property, but because he's kind, gentle, wise, and a great storyteller.

matt

 

[ahollis]

Originally Posted by DeWilson

WHY do people still have Myths about this film? Is it because Uncle Remus would have been a FORMER Slave?

I think that people are trying to find a reason why this film is kept locked up despite the numerous re-releases including on in the middle 80's. The easy way out is to say, "oh no one should see this since it portrays happy slaves and that we know that was not the case." Also some of the myths are perpetrated by people that have never seen the film not have they read the Uncle Remus stories, but feel they are experts on the subject. This would make a facinating book, the history and myths of THE SONG OF THE SOUTH.

 

[Cees Alons]

Until about twelve years ago, SotS was readily available on (totally legal) PAL VHS tape in Europe.
I have a copy. I read (and was read) the stories of Uncle Remus as a child and naturally wanted to have the film.
My children have seen it, we all enjoyed it and we NEVER felt that there was any place for racism.

However....
About ten years ago we had this same discussion on this same forum and one member mentioned an aspect (I'm terribly sorry, but I'm not even going to specify it here and now, lest I soil the discussion in a terrible way) that I wasn't aware of (nor could be, not living or having grown up in the US) that hurt him. I still cannot totally reject, deny or even judge it, but it did make sense.

That said, I think a lovely and amusing set of tales like SotS should be available on digital media. People are mature enough to judge for themselves if they want to see this movie and it's certainly not comparable to other works of hate, provocation or instigation we don't want to see freely spread.

But perhaps some elements need to be carefully considered indeed, and perhaps buyers be warned about.


Cees

 

[DeWilson]

Originally Posted by Cees Alons
,,,About ten years ago we had this same discussion on this same forum and one member mentioned an aspect (I'm terribly sorry, but I'm not even going to specify it here and now, lest I soil the discussion in a terrible way) that I wasn't aware of (nor could be, not living or having grown up in the US) that hurt him. I still cannot totally reject, deny or even judge it, but it did make sense....

Without mentioning it, I think I know what aspect you are referring to. Something that African Americans would find just as offensive as the "N" word.

I have just realized that if I am correct, it is most likely the REAL reason this isn't out in the U.S.not the whole post-Civil War "reconstruction" sharecroppers and "Uncle Remus".

 

[Pete York]

Hmmmm. How about...Criterion? Link

Or April Fools?

 

[Eric Peterson]

I'll try to think positive about this, but that looks about as close to 100% April Fools as possible.

Originally Posted by Pete York
Hmmmm. How about...Criterion? Link

Or April Fools?

 

[ahollis]

Originally Posted by DeWilson


Without mentioning it, I think I know what aspect you are referring to. Something that African Americans would find just as offensive as the "N" word.

I have just realized that if I am correct, it is most likely the REAL reason this isn't out in the U.S.not the whole post-Civil War "reconstruction" sharecroppers and "Uncle Remus".

Cees you have hit the nail on the head. There is still a lot hurt from that period of time and there will be for many more years. But It is a collection of stories that have do have lessons in them to learn and today the lessons can be much more powerful. I do believe that the film will be eventually released and enjoyed again, for I understand that Disney keeps very good care of it. But it will have to wait until the time is right.

 

[Mike Frezon]

Originally Posted by Eric Peterson
I'll try to think positive about this, but that looks about as close to 100% April Fools as possible.

Just because it was posted at 12:01am on April 1?

 

[JoHud]

Originally Posted by ahollis

I think that people are trying to find a reason why this film is kept locked up despite the numerous re-releases including on in the middle 80's. The easy way out is to say, "oh no one should see this since it portrays happy slaves and that we know that was not the case." Also some of the myths are perpetrated by people that have never seen the film not have they read the Uncle Remus stories, but feel they are experts on the subject. This would make a facinating book, the history and myths of THE SONG OF THE SOUTH.

Pretty much. To some people Uncle Remus = Uncle Tom, but its quite a stretch. Disney won't release it because they are more concerned with losing any bit of brand loyalty than they are preserving their film heritage. Guess those interested in the movie will have to wait for Iger to step down in favor of someone less paranoid

 

[JoeDoakes]

Originally Posted by Cees Alons
However....
About ten years ago we had this same discussion on this same forum and one member mentioned an aspect (I'm terribly sorry, but I'm not even going to specify it here and now, lest I soil the discussion in a terrible way) that I wasn't aware of (nor could be, not living or having grown up in the US) that hurt him. I still cannot totally reject, deny or even judge it, but it did make sense.

As I try to understand arguments about this sort of thing, I looked for the post to which you are referring, but I was unable to find it. I looked through numerous threads and they were very depressing. Could you post a link to what you are referring to? Thanks

 

[Cees Alons]

Ray,

I will try to find it, but I seriously doubt that posts that old will still be in our archives or can be found.

Are you familiar with the movie (or the tales)?
It's not extremely difficult to guess if you do; you just need to realize it (and know some things that member told me, that a non-US citizen or someone not from the South may not be aware of).


Cees

 

[DeWilson]

Let's stop dancing around this,shall we - it's NOT the idea of Uncle Remus as an "Uncle Tom" character, plain in simple, it's the "Tar Baby" segment, and the term "Tar Baby" is offensive to African Americans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tar_baby#Term
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tar_baby#Disney