Should I wait??

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by benito, Sep 21, 2006.

  1. benito

    benito Auditioning

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    I recently purchased the Sony KDS-50A2000 and looking to build my first HT system. Im planning on also purchasing the SVS SBS-01 5.1 system. The receivers ive been looking at are the Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS or Denon AVR-2807. Is it really worth waiting on HDMI 1.3 avr's considering the following:

    1. The KDS-50A2000 doesnt support it.
    2. I'm only planning on having a 5.1 system.
    3. I do plan on getting the PS3 when it comes out.
    4. I don't have anything right now (HT system).
     
  2. John Brill

    John Brill Supporting Actor

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    For reason's 1,2,and 4, don't wait.
     
  3. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Producer
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    From what I am hearing it sounds like HDMI 1.2 supports 1080p so unless you are looking to include decoding options like Dolby True HD and DTS-HD Master Audio via HDMI. Then if that is not a concern for you then I would not wait as long as you can get something that is at least HDMI 1.2 complient. If you get a reciever that has 1080p switching and a 1080p bluray player then you should be set nicely. I would not jump into a reciever that uses HDMI 1.1 if it can not handle 1080p via its HDMI inputs. Since you allready own a 1080p HDTV I would be carefull to make sure you are getting a reciever that will allow you to get the full 1080p picture to your tv granted your source is 1080p.

    I would not base your decision of 5.1 on waiting though. To my knoweldge all the current Dolby True HD and DTS-HD mixes are all 5.1. So if you are looking to get into lossless surround I would hold out for a reciever that has the decoding built in. And at that point you can be sertain that the HDMI is compatible with the lossless surround and 1080p video. On the other hand if you are not interested in lossless surround formats and are happy with Dolby Digital and DTS 5.1 formats. I would still make sure that it has a 1080p complient HDMI conection. At least if you get a receiver that uses HDMI 1.2 like your HDTV does you should have no problems.

    Plan for the future and look into any possibility before you run out and drop cash on a new reciever. Because unless you can afford to replace it soon, you are the one that has to live with that reciever for a good number of years to come. That is why I have not run out and replaced my current Yamaha RX-V995 reciever. It has not component video, no assignable digital inputs and no HDMI. I do not have a HDTV as nice as you do, mine is your basic Sony 720p HDTV Wega that can accept 1080i input. And I recently purchased a Toshiba HD-A1 that is conected via HDMI to the HDTV. I am researching and looking into the product that I can afford to make sure I am not ending up with something I have to update in a year or two. I purchased my HDTV last year when most of the HDTV's where not 1080p. The ones I saw upconverted but I also did not have the money for the upconverting HDTV's. And I am planing on eventually buying a 1080p projector anyway so the 720p HDTV was allright for the moeny I spent on it.

    I would break out a peice of paper and write down what componets you want and what features you want or expect to have. Include a budget on what you are willing to spend on each component. This will also allow you to see how many cable you will need to buy if you do not like the stock cables you get with the hardware.

    I hope this helps in some way Benito
     
  4. benito

    benito Auditioning

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    I made up my mind on not waiting. Now Im having a difficult time deciding on what receiver to get. I haven't found a receiver with both the features and sound im looking for. I really like the features of the Pioneer VSX-84TXSi but prefer the sound of the Denon AVR-3806. Anyone have any other suggestions? Something comparable to the Pioneer as far as features go.
     
  5. John Brill

    John Brill Supporting Actor

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    What features in particular are you looking for that are part of the Pioneer but lacking in the Denon? Are they critical or are they gadgets you'll play with once and never touch again (i.e. DSP modes)?

    The Yamaha RX-V1700 may be another receiver to consider in the price range/features area.

    Personally, I've noticed that Pioneer tends to have features one level ahead of other manufacturers at the price point but I question the quality of the feature. To me it seems they sacrifice in that area just to get in ahead of the competition on price. Sound quality should be primary over features unless the feature is 100% needed (i.e. you have 3 components needing digital inputs and the receiver only has 2).
     
  6. Arthur S

    Arthur S Cinematographer

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    Hi JB

    Perhaps Rob is not a minimalist like you [​IMG]

    If, as you said, Pioneer is ahead of the curve with features, Rob will probably be well served with the Elite. But since he seemed to like the sound of the Denon, that is a really good way to go as well.

    Different strokes for different folks.
     
  7. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Producer
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    IMHO I would go for the Denon. But you can not go wrong with the Pioneer Elite they have come along way in the past 4 years. I currently own a Yamaha and it has worked great. But if I was to replace it today I would be looking at Denon & Pioneer Elite. I would look at what features you need along with ones you would like to have. Then I would pick one of the two based on your needs and wants.

    IMHO the Denon AVR-3806 will give you great performance at a lower price. How ever for alittle more you do get 2 more HDMI conections on the Pioneer Elite. And the Pioneer has a Faroudja DCDi - 480P, 720P, 1080i internal scaler. And they both do 1080p switching so it depends on what features one has over the other. I personally like the amplifier section and the processing better in the Denon but that is personal preference.

    Hope this helps, please update us and let us know what you purchased and how it works out for you.
     
  8. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Wait. The audio is half the experience. It's HDMI 1.3 or bust for me.

    Dan
     
  9. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Producer
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    I am personally waiting for HDMI 1.3 switching on next generation recievers and Dolby True HD and DTS-HD Master Audio decoding. The reciever or pre/pro I purchase will have to last a minimum of 8 years. I am also looking to postpone buying a Bluray player because I will not be able to output the new lossless surround to a reciever or pre/pro without HDMI 1.3. I really would like to see a Denon reciever in my HT but if they drop the ball and do not offer HDMI 1.3 I will buy another brand like Pioneer Elite or something else.

    I was really looking foward to owning a Bluray player but I can not afford to buy a player now and later once HDMI 1.3 is available. I am planing on upgrading my center channel speaker ($900), Reciever ($1400 - $3000), Bluray player ($1k - $1,500), 1080p Projector and a Stewert Film Screen plus other components as well. Plus HD movies to buy on a limited budget so buying two Bluray players is out of the question. I am kinda pissed that HDMI 1.3 is not being used with Bluray players when 2nd generation HD-DVD player coming out about the same time will be using HDMI 1.3 [​IMG]
     
  10. benito

    benito Auditioning

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    I decided on the VSX-84TXSi and will be picking it up this weekend. Bestbuy (Magnolia) has it for $1499.99 - 12% if you have the RewardZone membership. I spoke to one of the reps and according to him Denon will be releasing AVR's w/ HDMI 1.3 by next month. 38 & 4807 I believe. Since I will not be running 7.1, my current TV doesnt support, and I don't have anything now. I can't wait. SBS-01 is on the way also and hopefully will have it by this weekend. I'll let you guys know how it goes.
     
  11. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Producer
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    Ether that rep was missinformed or the web site does not have the updated information? I had emailed Denon over a month ago and in the response I was told that Denon had no plans to offer any Bluray players or recievers using HDMI 1.3 or decoding for Dolby True HD or DTS-HD. I was told that there would be nothing along that line in the next 5 - 6 months.

    I also went to Denon's web site today and there is no mention of any new models that will include HDMI 1.3 and no sign of any Dolby True HD or DTS-HD decoders anywhere. I honestly dont think we will see anything from Denon until the end of 2007. I would have loved to own a Denon Bluray player and a matching Denon reciever that had HDMI 1.3 and Dolby True HD and DTS-HD decoding with discrete 7.1 surround sound.

    I can not believe that both HD-DVD and Bluray players only have 5.1 analog outputs. I realize that there are no titles with more than 5.1 currently but its kinda stupid that they have limited the formats to 5.1 for now. This is especially funny when you watch the begining HD-DVD trailer talking about 1080 HD picture and up to 7.1 lossless sound. Well with no HDMI 1.3 there can be no 7.1 lossless sound. While this is possible with the upcoming HD-XA2 the problem is that it is pointless to mix for 7.1 at this time. That is only because of the limitations of 5.1 analog outputs and no decoders capible of decoding disrete 7.1 mixes. I wonder if we will actually see any titles with 7.1 mixes. Heck HD-DVD does not even have any releases that include any DD-EX or DTS-ES. HD-DVD seems to favor Dolby while Bluray seems to offer DTS-ES, Dolby EX titles not to mention DTS-HD mixes coming soon. There is a comon problem with both HD formats. Nether one can do 7.1 lossless audio with out HDMI 1.3 and the decoders as well.

    I am thrilled that VC-1 and dual layer Bluray disc are now available. This was one of my biggest reasons not to purchase a Bluray player. I was also exspecting HDMI 1.3 to be included when the Sony & Pioneer Elite players become available. I now find myself deciding to wait again as I have no need for a player that can not decode or output Dolby True HD or DTS-HD. I was disapointed that my HD-A1 did not have DTS-HD capability but it does have Dolby True HD. And its not like there are many DTS-HD titles or any DTS-HD titles around the corner.

    It was not an easy decision to hold off on owning a Bluray player but I can not afford to buy the player twice. I might purchase a 2nd generation HD-DVD player down the road and only if HD-DVD ends up coexisting with Bluray beyond the end of 07'. If Denon takes to long to get product to market there are other companies that make great product so I have no problem choosing another company when I go to buy a reciever.

    I just got off the line with Pioneer Electronics and no one has a clue when HDMI 1.3 will be available. The guy said he has asked about the avialability of HDMI 1.3 from others in his company but no one seems to know anything about it. [​IMG]

    Oh, good luck with your SVS SBS-01 purchase. Let us know how it works out for you. [​IMG]
     
  12. dapa

    dapa Auditioning

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    I recently purchased a pair of Axiom m80's Since I am also in the need of a new receiver I asked what they would recommend and they mentioned the Sherwood newcastle line. I checked them out looks like good quality equipment I haven't heard much talk of Sherwood in these forums. One thing I did notice with their AVR receivers is that they don't have HDMI you have to buy a separate switching unit the reason being that HDMI is changing so fast why build equipment that will be out dated in a few months instead you would have to buy a new switching unit for a few hundred dollars.

    What do you think of this approach to HDMI ?

    I am really anxious to buy a new receiver but if I am going to spend $1000+ bucks on it than It needs to last 5+ years
     
  13. Dave Moritz

    Dave Moritz Producer
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    There are very few companies right now that do not offer HDMI switching. While it has changed I don't see it as a reason why Sherwood should not offer it in there product. I personally do not care for there product and would recomend something else. One thing you have to consider is that the sales people are getting a nice spiff for every Sherwood they sell. So they have an incentive to try to get you to buy that brand. I am not buying a Harman Kardon for my HT but I would buy a HK in a heart beat over the Sherwood. The HK has alot of bang for the buck, has better build quality and has stronger high current amplifiers than the Sherwood. If you really must have a reciever now.

    I to am very anxious to purchase another reciever to replace my aging Yamaha RX-V995 5.1 DD/DTS reciever. There are plenty of things on it that I would love to have updated on my next reciever. But I decided a year ago I would not replace it until I could find something that had everything I need to have. If your current reciver will get you by until the end of next year, I would wait! I would take that $1k and put it away and save some more money and get yourself something really nice next year. HDMI 1.3 should be out at the end of 07' and you will have the best of 1080p switching along with the ability to decode Dolby True HD and DTS-HD Master Audio in that new reciever. There will be no reason why that reciever should not last you at least 8 + years, maybe even 10 years. And while HDMI has had a few flavors over that past few years I dont see another new one coming out for awhile after HDMI 1.3 becomes available.
     
  14. rademacher1939

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    Dave
    Like Rob I'm just finishing up a HT room. Other then all the B&w speakers for a 7.1 set up, I'm still in a quandary for the power to drive them. I was looking at the new releases from Marantz "SR8001 & SR7001". Since all I have right now is my old Denon PMA-500v ( 2 Channel) with a Luxman tuner , which won't work at all in my new applications.
    I'm also looking at going with an Outlaw 7125 amp and their 970 pre/pro.
    Outlaw has stayed out of the HDMI game until they think the water is right, pretty much like the rest of us have. Then I can always pick up a newer pre/pro when the operating systems catch up to everything else. And hope fully at not at such a high introductory price.
    Do you have any suggestions for a newbie who needs to power up.
    Thanks, John
     

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