PMF

Senior HTF Member
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,464
Real Name
Philip
Not a fan of this film really. It just never grabbed me, for whatever reason. But I’m thrilled to hear about the restoration. I will be buying the blu-ray day one to support Warners for their efforts. Perhaps in this new HD release it will finally carry me away the way it does so many others.

And for what it’s worth, I love Gigi, especially the title tune! And who knows? Maybe soon there’ll be a push-back against the PC push-back and people will say we shouldn’t engage in “courtesan shaming.” ☺
Make no mistakes, I think "Gigi" is a fantastic film, as well.
And despite my previous lampooning of the "Gigi" title tune, itself, I certainly have no interests in talking others into disliking any aspect(s) of something they do love. As I often say, if one loves a film in its entirety, then the other party should let one continue on within the happiness that each and every film provides. And this, my friends, is part of the glory of film.:)
P.S. to WAC: Please restore "Gigi".
 
Last edited:

Sam Posten

Moderator
Premium
HW Reviewer
Joined
Oct 30, 1997
Messages
29,060
Location
Aberdeen, MD & Navesink, NJ
Real Name
Sam Posten
My suggestion is not to berate, malign or even resent those who have lived with oppression and react to films that have perpetuated those destructive narratives. We also have an opportunity to present these films in a context in which they can also be appreciated and enjoyed. And not everyone will be ready to go down that path. But I still want to see a release of PORGY & BESS and SONG OF THE SOUTH, THE DEVILS, etc. Remember, we're all on a learning curve here. There is more than one appropriate reaction. It's keeping the discussion open and flowing that allows us to evolve and for these amazing works of art and entertainment to continue to have an important place in our lives, our culture, our society.
We're on shaky ground here with regards to politics but I'd like to point out this is exactly the kind of response I respect most here at HTF.

Acknowledge the content is problematic.
Empathize with those who are affected by it.
Note that the content can still have redeeming qualities despite the controversy, and in fact may be beloved by people who also recognize the inherent problems.
Recognize that morals and standards change over time and that art is, by it's very nature a product of it's time of creation.

That's how I view SOTS, which I've been vocal about. I've not seen Seven Brides yet but I will try to remedy that with a viewing of this disk.
 

Mark VH

Second Unit
Joined
May 2, 2005
Messages
370
I agree. SBFSB is one of my all-time favorite musicals. Been hoping for this release for a long time. AND cinema is a reflection of and a commentary on our society, our culture. I think the growth that is happening in our country right now in terms of awareness of misogyny and patriarchy is essential. It's not gonna be an easy road, and there will be both appropriate and inappropriate, healthy and unhealthy responses to it, but it's long past due, in my opinion. I think it's our job as lovers of cinema to help people see the deep artistic and social value of cinema. Even in its day, SBFSB wasn't a film condoning kidnapping and forced marriage. It was well aware of its own "backwards" story-line and mined a lot of humor in that. Is it also a film that will trigger some people, push some buttons. Of course! But that's not a bad thing. Cinema has been doing that since day 1. As Mark VH said, we can have "a reasonable discussion about the movie's "problematic" content (by today's standards, and using the preferred vernacular of the moment) while also celebrating the fact that Warners have seen fit to release it." Sensitivity around lifetimes of oppression and destructive narratives are not inappropriate. They're a necessary part of growth, healing, evolution. I still stand behind BIRTH OF A NATION as an amazing piece of cinema. AND I also find it disturbing in ways it was not intended to be. And I certainly understand it being a massive trigger for many for whom the messages of the film helped perpetuate violent oppression on a mass scale. AND it's a film that should be shown, seen, discussed, and even celebrated for its technical and storytelling merits. Both can co-exist. My suggestion is not to berate, malign or even resent those who have lived with oppression and react to films that have perpetuated those destructive narratives. We also have an opportunity to present these films in a context in which they can also be appreciated and enjoyed. And not everyone will be ready to go down that path. But I still want to see a release of PORGY & BESS and SONG OF THE SOUTH, THE DEVILS, etc. Remember, we're all on a learning curve here. There is more than one appropriate reaction. It's keeping the discussion open and flowing that allows us to evolve and for these amazing works of art and entertainment to continue to have an important place in our lives, our culture, our society.

One final note, I love GIGI. I love Minelli. This is a stunning film with amazing music, performances & cinematography. And, yes, it also perpetuates some narratives about men and women that have been destructive to many. A large percentage of films from that era have. Just as there are modern films today that continue to perpetuate destructive narratives that we are currently engaged in, blind to, or not ready to confront. What an amazing window into our cultural and social progression film is. Among so many other things.
Agree with Sam's post above. Really well said.
 

Arthur Powell

Second Unit
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
419
Real Name
Arthur
I have to admit that I'm not a big fan of the film and can easily think of several MGM musicals I would have chosen ahead of this film (an HD remaster of "Good News" would be heaven). However, I can appreciate the lengths that Warners went to in order to make this beloved film - one plagued with several technical problems - available with a beautiful remaster. While the film itself does not excite me, I may still buy a copy of this blu to support the Warner Archive. Now, if the WAC would only start releasing more pre-1940 films....
 

rsmithjr

Screenwriter
Joined
Oct 22, 2011
Messages
1,228
Location
Palo Alto, CA
Real Name
Robert Smith
There is another more appropriate way to view 7B than the analyses that are being presented here.

[If you haven't seen it, this does contain spoilers. I am assuming this film is well-known.]

7B is about how people should treat each other. Milly is the center of the film and the communicator of civilized and decent behaviour.

Adam comes to town bragging that he is going to pick a bride in one day. He makes himself presentable, finds Milly, and proposes to her because he thinks she is strong and can cook and clean for his brood.

For her part, Milly simply falls in love with him at first sight. The preacher warns her against a hasty marriage, but she is too smitten to listen. When she arrives at their house and finds out she has been deceived, she is justly mad at him. But she relents and behaves as his wife, again because she loves him.

She decides to civilize them, makes them clean up and starts teaching them manners and explains how to treat people. Adam has been a terrible role model and teacher to his brothers, preferring to order people around and making fun of them instead of helping them improve.

It then comes that they go to the barn raising. The brothers are on their best behaviour after Milly's help, but the townspeople--still smarting from Adam's audacious behaviour with Milly--treat them very badly. This proceeds to a competition, at the end of which the girls prefer the brothers to the town boys. [There is a clear city/country split here, which the film is telling us is an artificial separation.]

Now of course comes Adam's stupid and dangerous kidnapping scheme. When they arrive back with the girls, and with the avalanche sealing them off for the winter, Milly is furious. She throws Adam out and the brothers have to sleep in the barn for the winter. Gradually, the brothers realize this was all wrong, and Adam, now about to be a father, realizes the terrible mistake he has made. The girls declare in song their growing love for the brothers (Stockholm syndrome?).

Of course it all works out, with Adam having learned something about love and the brothers having become more civilized and kind.

I have really never thought that this movie is seriously about kidnap or rape. At base, it is very wholesomely about people treating each other with consideration. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, if you will.

We also have to remember that musicals have always allowed a certain fantasy element to creep in. That is part of their charm.
 

battlebeast

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2010
Messages
3,202
Location
Edmonton, Alberta
Real Name
Warren
And this is why I enjoy restoration featurettes, when they are included as bonus features.
Me too. i LOVE those. I have seen some good ones... one with MR. Harris on Vertigo (how long ago was that?), one on Wings, one on Snow White, among others. They are great fun and provide a really informative look at the way films have been treated (Metropolis), and the way we get them back to prestine condition.

I wish every film had one; some films I am very curious as to how we got the image we have.

One of my all-time favorite bonus features on any release.
 

Mark Booth

Premium
Joined
Aug 25, 1999
Messages
2,849
I am very excited about this upcoming release, but I couldn't help feeling a little blue tonight when watching The Harvey Girls on DVD and wishing it was getting the WA Blu-ray treatment, too.
I'd really like to see 'The Harvey Girls' on Blu too. Not only because it's a great film, but because of my interest in Historic Route 66 and anything and everything associated with the iconic highway. My wife and I (along with friends) have traveled the original Route 66 (about 80-85% of the original road still remains, the other 15-20% has been covered by the Interstate) from Chicago to LA three times since 2011. That included visits to several former Harvey Hotels. I just love the nostalgia of it all.

So, Warner Archive, pretty please for 'The Harvey Girls'!

Mark
 

PMF

Senior HTF Member
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,464
Real Name
Philip
Deleted by PMF

(or, to quote Chief Dan George,"Sometimes the magic works, sometimes it doesn't".)
 
Last edited:

Camper

Supporting Actor
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
795
Location
Florida
Real Name
David Dennis
I find the 2 versions story fascinating. How was that done? One day (or days) they film a scene in scope and then the next day the same scene in flat? That would seem to be the only logical way. I sampled the beginning of the movie in both versions on DVD and I did think the scope performances were sharper. But that may vary from scene to scene as the movie goes on.
 

Paul Penna

Supporting Actor
Joined
Aug 22, 2002
Messages
800
Real Name
Paul
I find the 2 versions story fascinating. How was that done? One day (or days) they film a scene in scope and then the next day the same scene in flat? That would seem to be the only logical way. I sampled the beginning of the movie in both versions on DVD and I did think the scope performances were sharper. But that may vary from scene to scene as the movie goes on.
You'd think doing them sequentially, one version right after the other, or as much as practically possible, would be more efficient. Unless the wider Cinemascope field of view required reconfiguring the sets. Interesting logistical challenge. Are there existing production records I wonder?
 
Last edited:

Josh Steinberg

Premium
Reviewer
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
19,300
Real Name
Josh Steinberg
I could be mistaken and would gladly defer to experts here, but I recall reading that they had two cameras on set, and that they would first do a version of the shot in scope, and after the director felt he got a good take, they would then shoot the flat version. So it sounded to me like they’d do one after the other on the same day.
 

Camper

Supporting Actor
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
795
Location
Florida
Real Name
David Dennis
That's interesting. But some scenes have multiple camera setups and angles and also some scenes are fairly long in movies and aren't even filmed in a single day. It would be impressive if they could wheel in the other camera and set it up after every section of every scene. Maybe somebody out there knows for sure.
 

Douglas_H

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Nov 29, 2000
Messages
235
As Hitchcock used to say, "It's only a movie."
And he was exactly right.

Yes, but he's wrong, as all of us know here! :)
Um, no he's not.
Anyone offended by SBFSB is looking to be offended.
If a 1954 MGM musical makes your neck hairs stand on end your priorities of things to care about need professional attention.
Look most all musicals have 2 themes, Love and Love songs.
If you're lucky there are other great scenes, dialog & songs that show the talent of the actors & make a simple Love Story interesting.

SBFSB has some outstanding acrobatic choreography & dancing.
Whenever Russ Tambyln is involved in a musical, there's memorable dancin'.

Also the look of the film. Highly saturated colors of the Agfa Vista\Ansco Color process.
Obviously Robert knows exponentially more than I & hopefully will correct me, ASFAIK SBFSB was shot in Ansco Color in the Cinescope format whatever that entails for this film.
I just know what I've seen on TCM and it looks like early Bonanza episodes only more so.

Blind buy & I like about 4 musicals.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Richard M S

Forum Sponsors

Forum statistics

Threads
345,195
Messages
4,733,603
Members
141,404
Latest member
l3randon39