Setting bass management to "Both"

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Arron H, Mar 5, 2002.

  1. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

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    My receiver (Yamaha RX-V1200) allows you to choose "both" when you have the mains set to large. The description for both is "Select this if you use a subwoofer and you want to mix the main channel low-frequency signals with the LFE signals." I'm not quite sure how to interpret this. Does this mean that the mains will receive the full range of LFE signals that they are capable of receiving and that these same signals will also be sent to the sub? My mains go down to 37HZ and the sub goes down to 25HZ. Are my mains and the sub both receiving bass signals down to 37HZ if I select "both"? If so, are there any drawbacks to using sending signals to "both"?
     
  2. Jason Wilcox

    Jason Wilcox Supporting Actor

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    i'm pretty sure that the BOTH setting sends the frequencys below 90hz from the mains over to the sub as well as the LFE signal.

    it does sound a lot like setting the mains to small.....but thats what interpreted from my yamaha's manual.
     
  3. Harry Lincoln

    Harry Lincoln Stunt Coordinator

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    The main channel bass will be reproduced by the mains and the sub, while the LFE signal will be present only in the subwoofer.

    Harry.
     
  4. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

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    Thanks for the info. Are there any drawbacks to sending the main channel bass to both the mains and the sub?

    Another question related to this. If I set the main speakers (B&W603s) to large and select the sub option instead of both, how do I set the crossover frequency? I was thinking of manually setting the crossover on the back of the sub to around 48HZ. The frequency response of my mains is 48Hz - 20kHz 3dB on reference axis. Dispersion is within 2dB of response on reference axis Horizontal over 40 arc, Vertical over 10 arc. The frequency range is -6dB at 37Hz and 30kHz.

    A few thoughts - I like the mains a lot and was hoping to mainly use the sub (Sunfire True Sub Jr) to fill in the bass for movies and music below 50Hz.

    Any input related to the theory of bass management for HT would be greatly appreciated.
     
  5. ColinM

    ColinM Cinematographer

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    I used to (when I had towers) set them to large and run the sub as LFE only, no crossover applied (sub dial). That way everything got the full amount of info available, pure and unrestricted. Worked great.

    Later, I jumped the main's wires throught he sub and used it to do the crossover duties. Mains = large, sub = no. This sent the LFE to the mains (Which the sub captured, filtered and sent along the bass-less signal), along with the full bore main signal. That let me play with the crossover. Worked great.

    Later still, I set my mains to small, along with all the other speakers, and let the sun do all of the bass, plus the LFE. Worked the best.

    Bottom line, I'd suggest to anyone who has towers and a sub to try as many combos as possible. You have nothing to lose, you may learn a lot, and discover a few things about bass management / cancellation issues. Cancellation problems vary widely, and to nail it down you need to spend about 2 hours with earplugs, an SPL meter and a test cd, than decide if you need equalization.

    I like talking about this stuff!

    It's almost like NY vanilla vs French vanilla vs Regular vanilla ice cream to some people, but I find the differences pretty obvious.

    - CM
     
  6. Vin

    Vin Supporting Actor

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  7. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

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    Thanks for the info, everyone. Right now, I have the crossover on the back of the sub turned fully clockwise which according to the manual will bypass the sub's crossover and allow the sub to reproduce a wide frequency range. I have the phase turned fully counterclockwise. The volume on the sub is turned up about half way. I still have the mains set to large but have switched the LFE/Bass on the receiver to sub.

    Based on this current setup, all LFE signals should go to the sub but the entire range of left and right main channel bass signals are still going to the mains, correct? Are a lot of movies sending bass signals well below 40Hz to the main channels or are most of the really low signals transmitted through the LFE? I hope these questions are making sense and I'm starting to get this.
     
  8. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

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  9. ColinM

    ColinM Cinematographer

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    Yes, in both cases I left the crossover 'wide open', trusting the receiver to do the work.

    Good Luck!
     
  10. ColinM

    ColinM Cinematographer

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    My HK has the option "L/R + LFE" to the sub. This gives the mains (when 'large') bass, the sub the same bass as the L/R, and the LFE all at once. Triple-whammy.

    I wonder if thats the same as 'both' in your world.

    I didn't use it that way for long, though. I prefer Small all around, sub doing the heavy lifting.

    Occasionally I go to large across the front 3 for some reference, to see if I am missing something, and I get a *bit* more slam, but I don't want to stress the speakers and the receiver. My mains are NHT 'Ones, limited to 57Hz. I tested them to be good to about 52 in my room.

    - CM
     
  11. Arron H

    Arron H Second Unit

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