Seeking advice for an HD newbie... (1 Viewer)

[Chris Harvey]

Hi gang,

At long last, I've convinced the wife it's time we upgraded from our old 32" Wega to a new HDTV. However, I'm semi-overwhelmed by all the possibilities, choices, tech options, and so forth, and I'd love to get some recommendations from folks who're more familiar with the HD world than me.

Some info about our viewing habits:
Our living room is fairly small and we probably sit about 6-8 back from our current TV set (which is a 32" 4:3 standard-def Wega, about 6 years old). We've got digital cable through Time-Warner and would probably upgrade to their HD service. No plans for getting an HD-DVD or Blu-Ray player. We'd mainly be watching HD cable and regular DVDs. We'd probably use it for some light gaming purposes as well (but no HD gaming).

Budget: I'd like to keep the cost under $1500, if possible. We figure this new TV would be sort of a "transition" TV.... we'll use it for 2-3 years with the expectation of upgrading to a bigger, newer, cooler model at that point.

So, given these variables and our budget, what would you guys recommend? So far, I'm thinking that a 42-50" screen would be suitable, but I'm stick as to whether an LCD, plasma, or DLP would be best.

 

[BrianTwig]

A lot of people are going to tell you to get what they have. Its what they are familiar with. I will do the same.

I didn't need a flat panel for wall mounting. I needed a 50" or bigger screen. I didn't need 1080p as I won't be getting a BluRay or HD-DVD player any time soon. I use it for 90% regular TV via Dish Network and then movies with a little X Box.

I got the 52" JVC HD-ILA (LCOS technology, same as the Sony SXRD). 50" plus plasmas and LCD were unaffordable when I purchased and my eyes never liked the LCD rear projection TVs. So it was between DLP and LCOS. At the end of the day, my eyes were just continually drawn to the JVC HD-ILA after many many many trips to stores to watch TVs.

I personally think it is a technology that is often overlooked and ignored in these discussions. Not sure why. I love my set.

And like you, it is a transitional set. In a couple years when 60"+ Plasmas are affordable, the JVC is going in the bedroom.

Vanns.com has some excellent deals on it right now.

 

[captaincrash]

Someone correct me politely if I'm out of wack...

... but with a 720p screen with a 6-8' viewing distance you would go 36"-48" diagonal in size. And with a 1080p screen you would go with a 48"-64". As for which screen - a plasma, LCD or RP... and if a RP then a LYCOS, LCD, 3 LCD (wheel-less) or DLP. AND... of course, are you gonna insist on a 1080p or go with a 720p? Yeah... the choices are quite varied and the price wanders up and down. But generally you get more size with a RP then with a plasma given the units compared are both 720p or 1080p. And a plasma will do bettter in brightly lit rooms with significant viewing off axis. If most of the viewing is pretty much on axis and the room is not bright then you should be able to consider a RP and szve a buck or get a bigger or higher resolution screen for the same money comapred to a plasma or direct view LCD.

Now - I do not think you will be considering a front projection given the size of screen you are probably going with. And the size considerations are fairly simple above. If 720p then we are talking about a 1 to 2 ratio of diagonal screen size to optimal viewing distance. If a higher resolution 1080p then in thoery you can tolerate a larger screen with the same viewing distances. SO the ratio becomes 2 to 3. These are just guidelines of course. If your vision is sharp and your minds' eye is technically demanding then you might NOT want to go for a larger screen as you might ebd up noticing pixelation if the screen were too large and your viewing distance too close. On the other hand if your eye is more forgiving then you can consider immersing yourself in a larger screen.

If you get too close to a screen too large then you are in trouble if you're swiveling your head to follow the action. (chuckles) but - you know - ultimately there is NO RIGHT or WRONG ... rather I prefer to think that whatever you end up doing IS THE RIGHT THING ... and THE ONLY RIGHT WAY to do it. I learned that after getting endless opinions from others about how to raise our kids and care for them. Comments are appreciated - but the decision is yours'.

Now - are you ready to discuss sound yet? How about power conditioning? What about dumping the sofas you have and tailoring the seating to more theater-like? And what about a the fancy cables, AV electronics and pop-corn machine? Will you be buying any furniture to go with the new set? And did you know that a lot of programming on HD channels is upsampled standard defintion garbage? It presents in 4x3 format on HD looking a little sharper but it is just garbage. Now - the snippets of original HD progarmming shot in HD is real candy for the eyes. But we are not at the point where we have it all in programming. Oh yeah... do you want a HD DVR? That is gonna cost something too - and it has far less capacity when recording HD programming compared to SD programming.

And - are you ready to splurge on a HD-DVD player and start a collection in HD DVDs? Take a look at whats out there. I decided to defer the decision to see if one of the 2 formats wins over the other. I use an upsampling DVD player that apparently lacks the processing oompf to do it right all the time. But when it works - its' output falls somewhere south of HD broadcast with original HD content and North of standard DVD.

One small word of deadly serious advice; well really two thoughts here: 1st) don't bring your spouse or SO until you have a well thought out series of remarks to drop when she's looking over what you really want; and 2nd) do NOT allow yourself to get impulsive.

AND WHY do I say this? Well... tonight I brought my spouse to look around at the local high end audio/HDTV store. They had a real home theater set up in a 20x15 room with remote controlled dimmers, curtains, two 7.1 sound systems, two exotic looking (and costing) AV racks of equipment, all driving into a 1080p Sony projector that cost $11,000 and a $6,000 fixed 100+" Stewart screen. The 7 chairs set up there alone probably selll for about $15,000. The consolidated sign on one of the AV racks with projector and screen was marked at $44,000 ... and as I was showing my spouse this layout and talking about what I had in mind to do at home she sort of grew real quiet and kind of pensive. I think she was sort of stunned with the scale and she was thinking this set up looked kind of expensive. Well... I have all kinds of crazy ideas on how to save and shave a dollar in achieving a similar result. And that sort of took the edge off her initial look of dismay. I'm sure she saw the $44,000 sign which excluded the chairs, lights, finishing and a plethoria of excluded details (cables, wires, universal remote, etc).

As for the 2nd admonishment... 2 or 3 years ago I got the nod from my spouse to get an HDTV. We had a $2000 budget and I conducted zero research. We just walked into Costco and I picked something. And I impulsively choose... and it was poorly conceived choice. I selected a 60" CRT rear projection HDTV in 4x3 screen size. Was it sharp ... yes. Was it big? yes. Was it cheap.... relatively speaking, yes. And about 3-6 months after I bought it I discovered a fixed triangular rainbow spray artifact appeared in 3 of 4 corners. Plus the dang thing kept drifting out of convergence avery few weeks and I had to manually reconverge it on a field of 200 tri color "+" marks. It was maddening!!!

I thought I had been tatooed with a leamon of a HDTV. Wrong screen ratio format, a bum defect in the screen and convergence, and the on-line reviews were horrible. I should have done my homework.

Alas... all was NOT lost after all. After some investigation I found that Costco would honor a return even after several months. So - I made arrangements to have a service pick up and return the thing at my expense - and I selected a replacement for delivery on the same day! I went with an Epson RP 3 LCD Livingstation HDTV in 57" size. I am a digital photography enthusiast so this was a nice dual purpose "toy" for me. At the time plasmas were considerably more expensive for a true 720p HD resolution plasma of greater then 42" size.

So... I returned the Phillips piece of junk and got every penny back less the delivery cost. I picked up the HDTV initially with the help of friends -and could not bear the chuckles in asking my pals to help me take it back so I spent $60 to have it picked up by a service. The new Epson HDTV has been loads of fun and I have 2 replacement lamps - so I figure I'm set for about 18,000-30,000 hours of viewing. When the bulbs are gone I'll buy another HDTV - probably a bigger plasma with a long life and for LESS money.

Oh yeah.... a 3rd bit of advice you'll NOT have any trouble using... have fun researching your decisions.

Holiday Cheers!

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Actually a DLP or LCoS RP set will do better than plasma or LCD flatpanels is a room with a lot of ambient light - won't get washed out like LCD, won't be obscure by reflections like a plasma.

I also own a 720p LCoS and love it, and don't find a 56" size to be overkill from about 8 feet away. (I like to be enveloped by the movie or sporting event, your mileage may vary.) If you want to keep the screen height closer to where you are now, a 42" to 46" 16:9 would be the best replacement for you 32" 4:3 set. In that size it is hard to beat DLP RP for price/performance. Check out some in stores and see if you're bothered by the "rainbow effect" that some people find maddening while others don't even notice it. (I've never been bothered by it and my nephew's 42" Samsung looks pretty much as good to my eye as my JVC LCoS. My Olieva and Westinghouse LCD panels are good, but noticeably inferior to the two RP sets. But one is a bedroom TV and the other does double duty as a PC monitor and TV, so they aren't my "home theater" sets anyway.)

Just my two cents. If you don't have an absolutely need to hang a set on a wall or limit its depth to a few inches (and front projection isn't an option), I think microdisplays offer the best price performance mix at sizes over 40". And of the microdisplays I think LCoS has most of the advantages of LCD and DLP with few or none of the disadvantages. (Of the three I like the look of LCD RP, either 3 panel or color wheel, the least.)

Regards,

Joe

 

[Chris Harvey]

Thanks guys, for your comments and suggestions so far. They definite help... and I realize that until I'm actually comparing units by eye I won't be able to make a final decision.

I realized, somewhat after my first post, that I probably overstated our viewing distance. Right now, it's probably 8-10 feet... and if we wall-mounted a screen, it's probably more like 8-12. We're in a small-ish apartment, with eventual plans on moving (say, within a year or two), so this certainly won't be our "ultimate home theater" setup (not even close to it). Realistically, in terms of speakers, seating, cabling, etc we probably won't make chances until we move.

Our room is relatively shielded from direct light, so I'm not overly concerned with having to overcome that. Frankly, given all the factors so far (and having done a bit more research), I think LCDs are off our list.... as far as I can tell, they aren't manufactured in 42"+ sizes at the price point I need to hit. (Also, from what I've read, it sounds like our viewing habits are aimed more at the plasma/microdisplay sets).

I thought I had narrowed the field now to a few various plasma options.... but honestly given the feedback here (and with additional research), I'm now starting to waver towards a microdisplay. Since I'm lazy and also with an eventual move (even if it's a year or two away), I'm reluctant to get a set that's in excess of 100 lbs and would be a hassle to move to another place. One of the positives about plasmas is their narrow footprint and weight. However, I'm noticing that the newer RP sets are actually fairly thin and light, all things considered.

I've heard that it's better to get a "good" 720p set than a cheap 1080p one... and given that we're looking at the lower end of the price-range, I think that effectively eliminates a 1080p model. Unless, of course, there's a steal in terms of price/quality out there. I confess, the more I read about what's "better" in terms of 720p/1080i/1080p the more confused I get: given the bulk of content on TV is 1080i (or so I've heard), would a 1080-line set give me the best quality? Or is 1080i achieved by essentially being 2 fields of 540p (meaning a 720p set wouldn't really that bad an option)?

Despite my confusion and ignorance, learning all this stuff is fun too!