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See, cables do matter!!! (Yeah right)

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by BrianAe, Feb 25, 2004.

  1. BrianAe

    BrianAe Second Unit

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    we are also talking about digital ICs. I'm still waiting for someone to answer the question that Tom reminded us of.
     
  2. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    Well this link will take you to the use of a coathanger as a digital interconnect.
     
  3. BrianAe

    BrianAe Second Unit

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    Great link Chu!!!! And the case is closed... But not the thread [​IMG]
     
  4. Ben.T

    Ben.T Agent

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    ...last time I checked the only digital signals used were binary, ie 1's and 0's

    Thats the whole point of digital over anolog. There is no gray area, its *on* or *off*
     
  5. DaveF

    DaveF Moderator
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    The discussion started with the choice of component interconnects. There were some claims that "audio" digital was not nearly the same as "data" digital, and so the choice of a digital interconnect affects sound quality.

    The discussion has only more recently turned towards speakers, and lunch selections (or so I've understood it).
     
  6. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    Hey, would a pastrami sandwich taste the same wrapped in a paper vs aluminum vs copper foil?
     
  7. Erik*R

    Erik*R Agent

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    Well not really.. see when you chew paper its a totally different feeling than chewing aluminum.. and dont get me started about copper foil vs silver fillings your teeth.. such a horrible sensation [​IMG]

    Sorry, I couldnt resist.


    Really on cables all they can do really is detract/corrupt for a lack of a better word the signal. Ive never seen any cable enhance any signal.
    (but would i spend $2000 on cables if i had a $20000 system? maybe but if i could get the same sound in my ears for $200 cables id do it)
     
  8. Brian Fitterman

    Brian Fitterman Stunt Coordinator

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    The argument for digital cables making a difference is do they effect timing..that is introduce digital jitter into the signal.

    I believe that cables for analog signals do make a difference. But I never did for digital signals. Now my EE friend who thinks this is a bunch of BS said wait, yes cables for digital can introduce jitter. I have no idea. I use Monster Video 2 (less than $20 for 1 meter) for my coax digital. Its a nicely made pretty cheap 75ohm cable. I know you can measure jitter. Widescreen review did it a while back when DVD players first came out. Of course codecs like DD and DTS have built in mechanisms to fix jitter (I think), but PCM does not.
     
  9. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    You'd need one heck of a long cable before that became an audible issue.
     
  10. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    But would you really be able to tell the difference between chewing aluminum vs copper?
     
  11. Erik*R

    Erik*R Agent

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    hmmm I dont know. In the sake of science I think someone should grab a bar of aluminum and a bar of copper and chew on them for at least a day and see what they think. [​IMG] Then maybe set up a double blind study of the same?
    [​IMG]
     
  12. DavidLW

    DavidLW Stunt Coordinator

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    If you claim you could and someone stuck one test lead of an O-scope in your mouth and the other "where the sun don't shine" and got the same reading both times. Can we conclude that there was no difference and you only imagined that it tasted different?[​IMG]
     
  13. Yogi

    Yogi Screenwriter

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    Yes and no depending on who you ask.
     
  14. Brad_Harper

    Brad_Harper Stunt Coordinator

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    I was just over reading some posts in the cables section of the some other audio sites they were all a million times more out to lunch on this topic then anyone that has posted here so far. I read posts that debated what solder sounded the best and what cable core sounded the best. So much misinformation being spread around about this topic. It's really sad that people buy into the lies and waste their money. [​IMG] Didn't anyone take physics in highschool?

    Being that this is a capitalist society I might as well start my own cable company and make some dough off these poor people. After all if they are going to throw their money away they might as well be throwing it at me. [​IMG]
    Brad's Liquor and Cable store! Fine wines and exotic cables all at great prices. Taste and hear what you've been missing! (I really think I'm on to something here)
     
  15. Tom Grooms

    Tom Grooms Second Unit

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    Tell us how your really feel Brad [​IMG]
     
  16. Michael R Price

    Michael R Price Screenwriter

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    Brad,

    While I do not have enough experience with cables to argue over this sort of thing, I think your viewpoint is a little narrow. The physics at work here are not so simple, and there are definite, extremely minor distortions contributed to the signal depending on the cable materials, geometrical arrangement, etc. Jon Risch has explained these; he claims to understand the differences in sound they cause; and he has published free designs for relatively cheap cables that minimize those distortions.

    I personally have no idea whether we can hear any of those differences since they are so minor compared to anything else. And I personally have about $10 of cables in my system right now.
     
  17. Brian OK

    Brian OK Supporting Actor

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    Brad,

    If you are referring to audio asylum and some of the highly esoteric postings there, then, yes, you hit the motherload.

    But do not be too quick to judge. There is more knowledge below the surface at that site than you can possibly fathom.

    Sure, you can get some off the wall topics and discussions there. But the denizens there are far from novice debutantes. Raise your head too high there--unknowingly, of course-- and it will become removed before you can blink.
    You are at the high end there. Beyond that.... you are a certifiable loon, and even worse....

    It's a fun place to learn. And leave it at that is my advise.
     
  18. dougW

    dougW Stunt Coordinator

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    You know as a cable manufacturer of mostly reasonably priced higher end cables and as a manufacturer that does condition cables, it's like giving some of you a rope with a noose already fashioned posting to threads like this. So, here's my approach. I'll post once here, and I won't be back to this thread. So, I can't be goaded. I can't be beat up. Because I won't be here to take it. So, if you try? You'll be talking to yourself, and the others here, you won't be talking to me. [​IMG] So, here goes:

    But first a disclaimer. I am a cable manufacturer, so read into the following as you might, sales spoof? Or validation for my opinion? Well, I can't separate who I am from my opinions on subjects like this. So, any possible marketing info here, is just for purposes of this validation, nothing more.

    Just for your information Brian, I personally find that casting doubt upon any research or reviews without validation, gives no weight to your opinions at all. Nada, Zip. It's possibly just a futile attempt to convert the rest of the world that actually believes in cables and cable conditioning techniques making a difference, into the mold casting that the average user believes, because either he's not experienced it for himself, or he closed his mind to any possible differences long before attempting to hear them. So he will never hear them.

    Those that appreciate higher end cables, that can and do add to the performance and enjoyment of systems capable of demonstrating these differences IMO, will continue to do so, regardless of "anti-cable" mentality or the one shoe fits all theory. Because they've experienced it. They know it exists.

    Frankly, as a manufacturer and advertiser here, I'm a little surprised at the closed mindedness of many people that either don't want to hear a difference, or feel they can't afford to let themselves for whatever reason, so why admit there are differences? Fortunate for me, not everyone feels this way though.

    So, the battle goes on and on and on. I say, whatever you want to believe, well believe! Whoever you are and whatever side of the fence your on? Don't try to dictate your own way of thinking to others. Let them make those decisions for themselves! That's precisely why I offer a 30 day money back guarantee. So, people can choose for themselves. If they hear a difference or find some other asthetic value? Keep them. If not, send them back. Funny, in 3 years of sales, I have less than a 1% return ratio. So, either I must be doing something right, or the cables are. You be the judge- If you don't hear a difference, but want to keep them anyway? Won't hurt my feelings in the least. My contribution to the one shoe fits all theorists. [​IMG]

    Doug
    CATCables.com
     
  19. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Lead Actor

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    I love drive bys.
     
  20. Brian OK

    Brian OK Supporting Actor

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    Which Brian was he shouting at when he drove by, Chu ?

    Too many Brian's here. Have to change my name to Mr. Rueben, or "Mr.Broosky".

    Doug.... don't be a streaker, huh. Stick around. I catch crapolla all the time here, and elsewhere. No harm done. Lighten up.

    This is a hobby, remember. More for you I know, but guys either buy into the idea of "better" cables or not. Not life and death issues here.
    Now ... time for a cold one........

    BOK
     

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