Samsung HDTV (16:9) with Samsung Progressive Scan... problems.

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Gregg_Fritz, Sep 16, 2002.

  1. Gregg_Fritz

    Gregg_Fritz Extra

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    I just got off the phone with Samsung after 2 hours and have no answer.

    When I'm playing DVD's (anamorphic widescreen) or enhanced for 16:9 Widescreen movies I have the damn black bars top and bottom.

    The ONLY way I can not get this is to not use Component Video. My TV is taking my 16:9 signal from the DVD player and locking it as widescreen.

    Samsung is trying to tell me that 99% of all DVD's are produced in improper (non-true 16:9 format) or in cinema wide which is actually wider then 16:9.

    So if I play a non wide screen movie its fills the whole screen...

    Is anyone with a 16:9 Television and a Progressive Scan DVD player (using your Progressive inputs) experiencing this??

    If these guys are correct noone is watching widescreen movies that fill thier whole screen.
     
  2. Brian R

    Brian R Stunt Coordinator

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    Gregg

    They are correct. Movies are most commonly either 1.85:1 or 2.35:1 aspect ratio. A 16:9 tv is equivalent to 1.78:1. So you will have black bars at the top and bottom, but not nearly as large as on a 4:3 set.
     
  3. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

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    Gregg,

    Your tv has an aspect ratio of 1:78. What this means is that the screen is 1.78 times as wide as it is high. A regular tv, for reference, is 1:33.

    When you set the tv aspect ratio to Full, and set the dvd player for 16/9 tvs, the movie will be presented at full width, with nothing cut off the sides.

    Movies are made in a variety of aspect ratios, the two main ones are 1:85 and 2:35. Both of these are wider than your 1:78 tv, so in theory you should get very small black bars for 1:85 and wider ones for 2:35.

    Most widescreen tvs have some overscan so the 1:85 movies don't have bars at all, but 2:35 will.

    Check the back of the dvd case--the aspect ratio is usually listed on there in small print. If it says 2:35, the black bars are normal, if it says 1:85 you should have no or very small black bars.

    Some dvds are even wider than 2:35, some are 1:66, but these are not as common.
     
  4. Gregg_Fritz

    Gregg_Fritz Extra

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    So now the real question... what about burn out??
    Samsung warned me not to watch movies that are widescreen on my set [​IMG]
    This is getting very frustrating fast...
    The alternative is running S-Video [​IMG]
    But then you lose your progressive scan which is why I upgraded my old Sony DVD player to begin with...
    Grrrrrr what to do??
    How serious is the potential for burn out if you watch the TV 90% of the time with it 100% filled and 10% black bars from widescreen movies??
     
  5. ThomasL

    ThomasL Supporting Actor

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    If you've calibrated with something like Avia, which you should do btw, the chances of burn in on a direct view set are extremely low. Second, burn in does not occur due to the act of watching movies with black bars. What could possibly happen over a long period of time is that the phosphors in the blackened area will not age at the same rate as the rest of the phopshors (since they are not being used as much). Burn in is when a static image becomes literally fused onto the set's display. This happens because the phosphors effected are driven for a long time emitting the same light pattern. They get fried so to speak and their light emitting properties are actually changed - so that they never shut off when the electrons stop hitting them. Think of a light bulb that won't shut off when you hit the switch. Burn in is pretty rare these days on a direct view set. If you've calibrated your set, made sure the constrast and brightness are reasonable and if you don't leave a static image on the set for a loooong time, then you have nothing to worry about.
    Given your viewing habits and the fact that it sounds like you'll be stretching 4:3 material to fill the screen, I can't see why you'd be in danger of any type of uneven wear or burn in. I think it's safe for you to watch widescreen movies on your widescreen tv [​IMG]
    good luck,
    --tom
     
  6. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    Gregg, also: Films are meant to be viewed in the proper, original framing as they were shown in the commercial movie theaters. Until such time when a flexible television screen comes along, that means some movies won't "fill" even your 1.78:1 screen. To do so, the screen would have to be exactly the same shape as the movie's frame.

    Movies are shaped differently. You want, therefore, to see them in those various shapes (as their makers intended). Which means you will always have black bars above and below the image when the original frame is wider than your television's shape. And on films shot in the original Academy Ratio (that is, when commercial theater screens were shaped the same as "normal" 4:3 TV screens—and which is still the shape of some films currently being shot), you will have black (or gray) bars on the sides of the screen. It's the way things are. JB
     
  7. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

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    Gregg,

    If you haven't already, get a copy of the AVIA calibration disc and set your picture controls according to it's instructions.

    Until you can get a copy of this, turn your Contrast control down to less than 50%, preferably down around 30%.

    I watched lots of widescreen dvds on a 4/3 rptv that had been calibrated with AVIA for 2 years and got no burn in.
     
  8. Eric_M

    Eric_M Stunt Coordinator

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    Speaking of TV's being 1:78 in ratio is there any sets out there that really are 2:35? Are the screens in movie theaters really 2:35? I do apoligize if this question sounds a bit stupid.
     
  9. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    No, the only fixed screen sizes on consumer displays are 1.78:1 (16:9) and 1.33:1 (4:3). The screens in commercial cinemas benefit from curtains and in-projector matting, depending on the film being screened. Most are either 1.85:1 or 2.35:1, while 1.66:1 is a popular aspect ratio in Europe.

    Some films have been almost three times as wide as they are tall. I believe Ben-Hur, for example, is 2.55:1 (or wider). And my favorite film, on the other hand, is 2.21:1.

    So there you go. Movies come in different aspect ratios. Black bars will always be a part of life for the home theater enthusiast.
     
  10. Gregg_Fritz

    Gregg_Fritz Extra

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    Where do I get this Avia Calibration disc??
     
  11. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    At almost any fine online store or at a home-theater boutique-type dealership. Or you may order AVIA (an acronym that stands for "Audio Video Interactive Aid") directly from Ovation Software. In fact, I would recommend it over the current Video Essentials disc (the other current, "standard" calibration disc).
     

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